102 replies to this topic

[aastra]

Are drivers not supposed to treat the intersection as a 4-way stop in this scenario? If so, many local drivers seem to have issues with 4-way stops...

In localities everywhere, yes.

[G-Man]

I got the roundabout question correct.

[phx]

The bar is way way the hell higher now than when I got my license about 8 or 9 years ago. Seriously, if you're older than 25 (and got your license around your 16th), or got your license before the N system came in, you got one hell of a free ride compared with what you'd have to go through today.

The process now takes years and involves jumping through a bunch of hoops along the way. Does this produce better drivers? Nope...

[ZGsta]

The process now takes years and involves jumping through a bunch of hoops along the way. Does this produce better drivers? Nope...

Back that up with numbers or studies or something rather than random assumption.

[VicHockeyFan]

Back that up with numbers or studies or something rather than random assumption.

Might take a week to sort thru the reports...


http://www.icbc.com/...sion-statistics

Hold on, here we go, looks like a general decline:

http://www.icbc.com/...uth_drivers.pdf

[Mike K.]

I did the graduated licensing thing. Wasn't a big deal.

[phx]

Why would you expect the new system to produce better drivers? The written and practical tests are not significantly different from before. All that's changed is to drag the process out over a longer period of time and make it more expensive.

[Ms. B. Havin]

Is it still ok to bring the roundabout/ traffic safety question into this thread - or does someone want to snip this off into a separate thread?

I came across a pointer online to this book, Traffic: Why We Drive the Way We Do (and What It Says About Us). Interesting, what it says about roundabouts (and other stuff):

Q: So much of what you uncover about life on the road seems counterintuitive. Like the fact that drivers drive closer to oncoming cars when there is a center line divider then when there is not; that most accidents happen close to home in familiar, not foreign, surroundings; that dangerous roads can be safer; safer cars can be more dangerous; that suburbs are often riskier than the inner city; the roundabout safer than the intersection. When it comes to traffic why are things so different from how we instinctively perceive them?
A: I think part of the reason is it’s easy for us to confuse what feels dangerous or safe in the moment and what might be, in a larger sense, safe or dangerous. We have a windshield’s eye view of driving that sometimes blinds us to larger realities or skews our perception. Roundabouts feel dangerous because of all the work one has to do, like looking for an opening, jockeying for positioning. But it’s precisely because we have to do all that, and because of the way roundabouts are designed, that we have to slow down. By contrast, it feels quite "safe" to sail through a big intersection where the lights are telling you that you have the right to speed through. We can, in essence, put our brain on hold. But those same intersections contain so many more chances for what engineers call "conflict," and at much higher speeds, than roundabouts. So when what seems quite safe suddenly turns quite dangerous — will we be as well prepared? Similarly, we might be reassured that that yellow or white dividing line on a road is telling us where we should be, but how does that knowledge then change our behavior, to the point where may actually be driving closer — and faster — to the stream of oncoming traffic? Accidents are more likely to occur closer to home. Mostly this is because we do most driving closer to home, but studies do show that we pay less attention to signs and signals on local roads, because we "know" them, yet this knowledge actually give us a false sense of security.

[Mike K.]

This topic is now a separate thread.

[ressen]

instead of two ruondabouts that are sure to confuse even a seasoned driver; not to mention the retired people of sidney, they shoul build one large roundabout that straddles the highway. having the highway pass under this roundabout and all feeder roads leading on to it would be more in keeping with a UK motorway.

[piltdownman]

The biggest problem I've seen with roundabouts here is no one here seems to signal when leaving the roundabout. So you end up waiting to enter when someone is leaving before you anyways.

[Bob Fugger]

The biggest problem I've seen with roundabouts here is no one here seems to signal when leaving the roundabout. So you end up waiting to enter when someone is leaving before you anyways.

Is one supposed to indicate when they are exiting the roundabout? That's not been my experience in the (European) jurisdictions that are (in)famous for them.

[jklymak]

I think most European "roundabouts" are actually "traffic circles", in which case the cars entering the circle have right of way over those already in it. In that case there is no need to indicate that you are leaving the circle since you don't have right of way anyhow.

However, for our roundabouts, common sense indicates that you need to indicate your intention to leave them. Whether it is a law or not I can't say...

[VicHockeyFan]

Right of way is always to those that are in the circle.



But check the strange turn-signals of, say, the yellow car that enters from the right, or the red one that enters from the top....

[Ms. B. Havin]

jklymak is right that in most European countries, the rule is "right before left," meaning that unless you're on a road that has a clear "right of way" sign, you have to yield, always, to traffic entering from the right, even if it's from a street that's perpendicular to the one you're driving on. Sometimes it's counter-intuitive, because you might be on a road that you think is a "primary" street, and that the intersecting street is "just" a side-street. But unless the road you're on has that right-of-way sign, you must yield to cars coming from the right.

The traffic circle animation that VHF posted is interesting. The right-hand sides of all four roads have traffic lanes marked in, but the left-hand lanes don't. Yet, as VHF points out wrt the turn signals by the yellow car & the red car, the left-hand side of the road must also have multiple lanes...

No wonder each vehicle in that gif is signaling like crazy! They're all saying, "I'm gonna do this now, don't hit me!" ;-)

[LJ]

I believe the law is you have to signal when exiting the round-about.

I do both, when I am in the roundabout I have my left turn signal on to indicate to others approaching that I am going to continue turning left in the round-about then I signal right before I exit.

May not be the law, but I feel safer doing it that way.

[snub]

Turn signals in a roundabout are useless when they are self cancelling. Think about it. When you are making a left hand turn in a normal intersection you turn the wheel to the left to make the turn, then back to the right when you have completed it. In a roundabout you are are turning right to make a left hand turn, so your signals will cancel.

The only vehicles that don't have self cancelling turn signals are large trucks. That's because they have to turn left before making a right hand turn. So they don't run over the feet of people on the sidewalk.


If you have any doubts about this, take a drive out to the airport and navigate the retarded traffic circle they have on the way out there. See how many Yellow cab drivers blow through the circle while you are waiting to enter. It's more fun than Pong , or Space Invaders. They should make a video game out of it.

[G-Man]

No need to enter signaling but should signal when you plan to exit. That is what I do anyways.

[Mike K.]

That is correct, you need to signal before exiting.

[snub]

Maybe they should have a stop sign before you enter the circle. Whilst there you could read the "Rules Of The Road" sign, which will tell you to yield to vehicles that are already in the circle, and that you must use your turn signal when exiting the circle. Meanwhile, 182,000 Yellow cabs have blown through from the other entrance.

Or you could stop and watch the big screen video of this guy explaining how to use the circle:


http://www.youtube.c...h?v=TEZC_7CbA0s