1754 replies to this topic

[LeoVictoria]

Why not Chinese steel, it's less expensive than US or Canadian.

For good reason as the blue bridge project found out.

[nerka]

Why do we need "domestic energy security"?  Do you anticipate a world war where the four producers larger than us (US, Saudi Arabia, China and Russia) are all cut off for us?  Even if that happens we are already oil self-sufficient for our domestic uses.  And we have bigger problems than oil if any one of three of those four are at war with us.

Clearly we don`t absolutely need it as we have done fine without it so far. The question is would it be nice or sensible to have. Eastern Canada is dependent on energy imports. Many other countries dependent on imports have an oil reserve for the eventuality that supplies are cut off. Eastern Canada does not have that. I believe it would be sensible to either develop that sort of reserve OR a pipeline connection to our supply regions.

 

A cut off of supplies to the East Coast is very unlikely I believe. Though of the four producers you mention the US and China are irrelevant as they are both importers not exporters (despite their large production).

 

Totally separate from energy security Energy East has an economic rationale of diversifying customers.

[VicHockeyFan]

Many other countries dependent on imports have an oil reserve for the eventuality that supplies are cut off. s.

 

Actually very, very few countries maintain an oil reserve and the grand total of those that do it is 41 days.

 

The last two major wars were over 1,500 days each. 

[nerka]

Actually very, very few countries maintain an oil reserve and the grand total of those that do it is 41 days.

The EU, the US, Japan, South Korea. In other words most of the nations we consider peers. Energy security alone would certainly not justify building Energy East (cheaper to build a reserve in Eastern Canada instead if we want to go that route).  However if Energy East made commercial sense, domestic energy security would be a supporting rationale.

 

But if Line 3, KXL and TM all get built, there may not be a need for energy east.

[jonny]

My name is not Bryan Holmes, I swear.

 

 

Peninsula News Review LETTERS: Calculated risks with proposed pipeline

• Sidney, North Saanich, Central Saanich posted Jan 25, 2017 at 12:00 PM

 

The Peninsula News Review published a couple of letters just before Christmas on the increased tanker traffic that will result from twinning the Trans Mountain pipeline. Ms.

Jestico called the extra one-tanker-per-day ‘a ticking time-bomb’! Well, if that is so, we are surrounded by time bombs. Several come to mind, using her train of thought.

 

Just think of the recent huge growth in air traffic at YYJ. What if, one dark and foggy evening, an approaching aircraft mistook the lights on Beacon Avenue for the runway approach and landed, heaven forbid, on the Gateway shopping centre? Horrific thought!

 

Then there’s another time bomb ticking away in Victoria harbour where the Coho, the Clipper, a float-plane and a mega yacht at the new millionaire’s marina, or any combination of them, might collide, burst into flames then drift into and destroy the new Johnson Street bridge.

Calculated risks, as Ms. Jestico says, all of them, but a risk worth taking — all of them.

 

Another letter writer said that we must stop the pipeline because the extra one-a-day tanker would disturb our orcas. Now let’s think about this a minute. Every day, B.C. ferries makes at least 83 passages through the Salish Sea. Add 12 daily ferry trips between the Island and Washington State, at least one cruise ship, plus numerous cargo ships and fishing boats and she thinks that one more tanker is going to upset the whales?

 

Get real. I was out in my small boat last summer when J-pod swam by, about a half-mile away. The pod was shadowed by 35 vessels, varying from commercial whale-watching boats, floating gin-palaces, cabin cruisers, fishing boats, dinghys, etc. And you think that a single tanker that may (or more likely, may not) be anywhere near our whales causes more disturbance and stress than these officially-approved encounters? I think not.

 

It would appear that some people are clutching at straws to find any excuse to disrupt the pipeline’s construction, even though exporting oil will generate billions of dollars in revenue through taxes to help pay for federal and provincial services that are fundemental to our well-being, such as Medicare, RCMP, defence, infrastructure, improving Indigenous well-being and, somewhat ironically, even pay a portion of our deficit that was incurred when we sent 232 of Justin Trudeau’s invitees on a junket to Paris for a meeting on climate change.

 

Bryan Holmes, North Saanich

 

Seriously. Not Bryan Holmes.

[Bingo]

Kinder Morgan Inc. has begun talks with institutional investors including major Canadian pension funds and private equity firms to raise capital for the $6.8 billion expansion of its Trans Mountain pipeline project, according to people familiar with the process.

Kinder Morgan has held discussions with Canada Pension Plan Investment Board, the Caisse de dépôt et placement du Québec and Ontario Teachers' Pension Plan Board, three of the biggest Canadian pension funds, the people added.

It was unclear whether talks with the three pension funds were still ongoing.

"We're confident in the interest from the investment community and we're continuing to move forward with all aspects of planning in order to begin construction in September 2017," said Ali Hounsell, spokeswoman for Kinder Morgan's Trans Mountain Expansion Project.

http://www.cbc.ca/ne...3988295?cmp=rss

 

[VicHockeyFan]

Keystone XL approved.  Trump is getting it done.

 

http://www.cbc.ca/ne...anada-1.4039176

[LeoVictoria]

Keystone XL approved.  Trump is getting it done.

 

http://www.cbc.ca/ne...anada-1.4039176

 

If Obama decides to eat Subway, and Trump orders KFC is that "Trump getting it done"?   

[VicHockeyFan]

If Obama decides to eat Subway, and Trump orders KFC is that "Trump getting it done"?   

 

I'm not sure.  But what Obama did with XL is just wait, wait, wait for over 5 years.  No decision either way.  60 days in, Trump has approved it.

[Mike K.]

Obama couldn't have approved it as his supporters would have lost their marbles. He delayed it as long as he could in order to have the next guy deal with it.

[VicHockeyFan]

Obama couldn't have approved it as his supporters would have lost their marbles. He delayed it as long as he could in order to have the next guy deal with it.

 

Well, he actually rejected it 4 days before the US election.  So it was all political, see which way the wind is blowing right up to the election date.

[Mike K.]

Right, a move for his supporters to gush over, but knowing full well rejecting or approving something with only hours left before the Big Day would mean the decision would still rest with the incoming pres, as it clearly did.

[VicHockeyFan]

Kinder Morgan will proceed if they raise the money.

 

https://www.thestar....essful-ipo.html

[jonny]

 

The company has offered 102.9 million shares at a price of $17 per share in an effort to raise $1.75-billion. The public offering is set to close May 31.

 

The IPO would be one of the biggest ever on the Toronto Stock Exchange and Kinder Morgan spokesman Dave Conover says the company is confident it will be a success.

 

 

Kinder Morgan says it’s expecting to begin construction for the project in September, with a completion date set for December 2019.

 

https://www.theglobe...rticle35121691/

 

Woop woop!

[VicHockeyFan]

We snoozed and lost:

 

https://www.forbes.c...r/#7720b9ee671a

 

The U.S. and China have announced the initial steps in their 100-Day action plan of the Comprehensive Economic Dialogue, inviting Chinese companies to negotiate long-term contracts for liquefied natural gas (LNG) shipments from U.S. suppliers.

This is a really big deal. 

 

LNG is the fastest growing major energy market, the U.S. is the fastest growing exporter, and China is the largest incremental consumer (with nearly a $30 billion market by 2030). Since LNG exports from the contiguous U.S. began in February 2016, about 10 of our cargoes have reached China, but only sold on the spot market. 

 

In March, U.S. supplies accounted for 7% of China’s LNG imports. Now, a few Chinese companies, such as Unipec, Sinopec’s trading unit, are considering long-term LNG contracts with the U.S. starting sometime around 2022, right about the time when the current global LNG glut is supposed to have cleared. 

 

LNG is the driving force behind the expectation that the U.S. will become a net exporter of natural gas next year, an unthinkable evolution just a decade ago. The potential agreement between the world’s two largest economies and energy consumers would help install a second wave of investment in U.S. LNG terminals. Natural gas, after all, is the clear winner under the Paris climate accord and various environmental policies (I document that fact here). 

 

[jonny]

MP Mark Strahl (Chilliwack - Hope) introduced a motion yesterday that the Federal government affirm that the Kinder Morgan Trans Mountain project has social license to proceed, is critical to the economy, is environmentally sound and should proceed as planned. This motion passed by a vote of 252-51 in the House of Commons.

 

All NDP MPs and Elizabeth May opposed the motion.

 

That's an overwhelming margin of victory right there.

[VicHockeyFan]

I had not seen these stats before:

 

Where does the petroleum we all use every day come from? Canada has some of the largest petroleum resources in the world and yet Canada imports 634,000 barrels of crude oil from foreign countries every single day. That is $26 BILLION of oil imports every year that we could have supplied to ourselves. That product arrives in tankers and is transported to where it needs to go by truck and train right through our communities. And yet we don’t want our own product to flow in pipelines to our communities for our own use or to our ports so we can export it? That just makes no sense at all to me.

So let’s talk about pipelines. I know pipelines are a safe, cost-efficient means of oil and natural gas transportation and emit fewer greenhouse gases than alternate transportation methods. Canada has 830,000 kilometers of pipelines. Three million barrels of crude oil is transported safely every single day. If we took that oil out of the pipelines, we would need 4,200 rail cars to move it. How many of those cars would you like rolling through your community? Between 2002 and 2015, 99.9995% of liquid was transported through our pipelines SAFELY. You probably spill more when you fill up at the gas station.

I understand you don’t want tankers floating down our coasts. But did you know the USA has been shipping up to 600,000 barrels a day of crude from Alaska to the Puget Sound through the Salish Sea for the last 20 years? Did you know that B.C. has a Tanker Exclusion Zone that has been respected for years? That zone stipulates that full tankers must travel on the west side of the zone but those that are not transporting goods can stay inside the protective zone. Other than one natural gas pipeline, Vancouver Island receives all of their petroleum by barge every day. I don’t remember ever hearing anyone complaining about that. According to Transport Canada over 197,000 vessels arrived or departed from west coast ports in 2015 - 1487 of them were tankers. 400,000 barrels of crude oil is safely transported off the B.C. coast every single day.  Sooo…. I think we are ok there.

 

http://www.resourcew...m/mayors-letter

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 20 June 2017 - 08:23 PM.

[sebberry]

^ Facts.  That'll upset the ecomentalists. 

[VicHockeyFan]

Do we have gasoline/diesel storage facilities on the Island?  At Nanaimo?  I wonder how many tankers a day have to come across...

[jonny]

^ Yup. Up by Arbutus Ridge Golf Course in Cobble Hill.