194 replies to this topic

[VicHockeyFan]

^ The home on Chandler makes me wonder wtf the next-door neighbour has been doing over the last 30 years to make their home even remotely interesting. And of the subject house, I'm all for no-maintenance front yards, but unless that's very new and awaiting some type of foliage, the rocks seem downright boring.

Ah, good call-up Aastra. Yes, I was thinking of that James Bay one earlier when I said they looked good in JB.

What do you all make if this, in quite a different type of neighbourood?

http://maps.google.c...249.68,,0,-3.86

Speaking of low-maintenance front yards, this is a moss front lawn, no maintenance except some leaf-blowing with all the oaks around. It looks a little haggard here, but it used to be very nice, I always enjoyed it.

http://maps.google.c...cbp=12,135,,0,0

[aastra]

I sure prefer that yellow box house to the housing project across the street. The yellow box house says you're still in Victoria whereas the housing project across the street says you're almost in Saanich so why not just jump straight there?

[Bob Fugger]

I'm pretty sure I've seen outrage expressed about that second one. On Flickr, I think.

Wow, so much hate. Oh well, I suppose I'll have to live with the derision of modernist hipsters who would shun me as a philistine for liking it.

This one was a horror show as far as I'm concerned. Terrible fit:
http://g.co/maps/9twyt

***

The tenant in this building is the Ministry of Advanced Education, for some bizarre reason. I think it is a front for spooks.

How about this one?
http://g.co/maps/jquha

***

This is the gigantic middle finger to all of your neighbours. This house says, "I'm the kind of person who enjoys being a pariah, because it fuels my persecution complex and gives me something to talk about with my hipster friends."

Or this one?
http://www.flickr.co...nwra/501843266/

I know what I hate, and I don't hate this. I think the envelope is too big for the lot, mind you.

[Baro]

That blue metal house has a frosted glass door with a tiny rectangle that is transparent. The tiny rectangle exists and is perfectly sized just for their yappy dog to stare out barking at anyone who walks by. There's a lot wrong about this house but I don't hate it at all, I entirely support it just for it's different-ness.

[dasmo]

I just have to say having a "design oversight committee" would most likely drop values in OakBay... It's a terrible idea. There are enough bylaws to force most people into going to the variance board to beg. Personally I like unique architecture that reflects the era it's from. That's what makes these areas interesting. Victorian, Queen Anne, Arts and crafts, Post war bungalows, 80's crap shacks, modern mansions, all living in harmony. It's what distinguishes these neighbourhoods from the ticky tacky...

[Baro]

A lot of people have no idea what they're talking about and end up seeing a very diverse neighbourhood as a mono-culture of "old" buildings. "old" becomes a rigid style to them. Doesn't matter if it's a faux-tudor mansion from the turn of the century, or 30's deco, it's all just "old" style. When something new comes along, suddenly that building is NEW and it conflicts with the OLD. What they never understand is that when most of these houses were built, they were the crazy different new-style buildings that "clashed" with their neighbours. In 100 years we'll be shocked at what tasteless ignorant people lump together as "old".

[skeptic]

I just have to say having a "design oversight committee" would most likely drop values in OakBay... It's a terrible idea.

I don't think it affects values in the Uplands. Monterey, CA has very strict design guidelines and some of the highest property values in the US.

There are enough bylaws to force most people into going to the variance board to beg.

Not true. The building bylaws are pretty standard (outside of the Uplands). If you're tearing down an old house and building on bare land you can do whatever you like as long as you meet the setback and height restrictions.

The problem I have with these modern boxes (unlike, for example, the older art deco designs in Oak Bay) is they max out the building envelope and height, which with the flat roof makes these houses look too large for the space they are in. They are vulgar intrusions built to maximize interior square footage. In almost all cases they are built as spec houses by developers who have no intention of living in them, or even the neighborhood.

I find the sneering in this thread quite enlightening--it says as much about the authors as the objects of their derision.

[dasmo]

(I for one wasn't sneering)...

[Sparky]

I sure hope we do not loose our rights and freedoms to design our own homes. That would be terrible to have the local government dictate styles.

This is Canada, not North Korea.

[dasmo]

Here are a couple I think fit in fine...
http://g.co/maps/yjwkg unfinished in google land
http://g.co/maps/q5fxb

but I guess these aren't the mega mansions some are referring too.

[aastra]

Who's sneering? I'm sure not. Are the folks who picket in front of a new house sneering? Picketing in front of a new house seems rather scornful to me.

The only place I reject outright in this entire thread is that one on May Street. I'd wave a magic wand to change it if I could (although I sure wouldn't picket in front of it). But otherwise, different strokes for different folks. Even that place across the street from Fugger's modern house has a right to exist as far as I'm concerned.

It's what distinguishes these neighbourhoods from the ticky tacky...

That's absolutely right. It's the difference between a real evolving city neighbourhood and the cookie-cutter stuff you often see in the suburbs.

[skeptic]

I sure hope we do not loose our rights and freedoms to design our own homes. That would be terrible to have the local government dictate styles.

I agree. But by the same token I think the community has the right to protest a design (even if the protest will come to nought)--that's called free speech, and it's even more important than the right to build a vulgar-looking house. Think what you like about the citizens of Oak Bay, but they obviously care about their community and there is nothing wrong with them trying to defend the qualities that they find valuable.

The fact that the developers typically ignore these protests is an indication that they have no stake in the community.

There's nothing anyone can do about that but sneering at people for bemoaning it is pretty rude. If the shoe was on the other foot and you complained about Mayor Fortin deciding to open a "safe" injection site across the street from your place, how would you feel if the response was "suck it up, it's a free country?"

[G-Man]

So what does this house look like that it is soo out of place?

[skeptic]

Who's sneering? I'm sure not. Are the folks who picket in front of a new house sneering? Picketing in front of a new house seems rather scornful to me.

The entire first page of this thread is sneering (with some obvious envy thrown in for good measure). Check your dictionary for the definitions of "sneering" and "scornful." There's quite a difference.

[aastra]

My dictionary must be broken:

Sneer:
to speak or write in a manner expressive of derision or scorn.

Scornful:
full of scorn; derisive; contemptuous.

I mean, seriously. You could have looked that up in two seconds but instead you plowed in and put your foot in your mouth. What's the deal?

Look, this is a forum. If somebody has touched a nerve, here's your opportunity to make your case. Instead of rambling and throwing tomatoes at people, try making some meaningful points. Persuade us. You've actually got it pretty easy with me because I already respect your right not to like the new house right out of the gate. And I'm not exactly thrilled with the drawings that were shown in that news video, either. So convince me that some sort of strict and comprehensive style guideline would be a good thing.

...they obviously care about their community and there is nothing wrong with them trying to defend the qualities that they find valuable.

Good point. And how about those Oak Bay residents who have no problem with the new house or who like the new house because it embodies the qualities that they find valuable? Do they count? Should we dismiss them because their non-negative reaction to the new house obviously indicates a lack of regard for their community?

The fact that the developers typically ignore these protests is an indication that they have no stake in the community.

Sort of like those evil condo developers (and buyers) downtown?

I feel like the dialogue on VibrantVictoria.ca has been set back several years in just the past few posts.

[Bob Fugger]

[aastra]

I'd really be interested in hearing what skeptic thinks about the various houses that people have identified in this thread. Which ones are acceptable and which ones aren't (if any), and why?

[VicHockeyFan]

I agree. But by the same token I think the community has the right to protest a design (even if the protest will come to nought)--that's called free speech, and it's even more important than the right to build a vulgar-looking house.

You say they are vulgar, and you say they are built on spec, but somebody built them, and somebody bought them. So somebody likes them, and presumably does not think they are vulgar.

319 Chester for sale, mentioned earlier in thread:

http://www.propertie...ng/319-chester/

$1,390,000

[skeptic]

My dictionary must be broken:

Sneer:
to speak or write in a manner expressive of derision or scorn.

Scornful:
full of scorn; derisive; contemptuous.

I mean, seriously. You could have looked that up in two seconds but instead you plowed in and put your foot in your mouth. What's the deal?

Sneer: a contemptuous or mocking smile, remark, or tone

Scorn: The feeling that someone or something is worthless or despicable

There is a subtle difference. Perhaps I shouldn't have suggested it was an obvious difference.

Look, this is a forum. If somebody has touched a nerve, here's your opportunity to make your case. Instead of rambling and throwing tomatoes at people, try making some meaningful points. Persuade us.

I made a case. You just don't agree with it.

You've actually got it pretty easy with me because I already respect your right not to like the new house right out of the gate. And I'm not exactly thrilled with the drawings that were shown in that news video, either. So convince me that some sort of strict and comprehensive style guideline would be a good thing.

I already said I belive people should be able to build what they want (within the bylaws), but also that other people should be free to complain.

And how about those Oak Bay residents who have no problem with the new house or who like the new house because it embodies the qualities that they find valuable? Do they count? Should we dismiss them because their non-negative reaction to the new house obviously indicates a lack of regard for their community?

What's your point? Were they out there waving placards saying "we love this fugly house?"

Sort of like those evil condo developers (and buyers) downtown?

Er, no, I am pro developement, as you would realize if you looked at posts I have made in the past.

I feel like the dialogue on VibrantVictoria.ca has been set back several years in just the past few posts.

OK, I don't get that but whatever.

I'd really be interested in hearing what skeptic thinks about the various houses that people have identified in this thread. Which ones are acceptable and which ones aren't (if any), and why?

What difference would that make? I don't live in those neighborhoods.

You say they are vulgar, and you say they are built on spec, but somebody built them, and somebody bought them. So somebody likes them, and presumably does not think they are vulgar.

Well, they probably haven't been bought yet. But what is your point? The neighbors don't like it and they said so. All they did was express their opinion. Nothing will be done about it.

[VicHockeyFan]

Well, they probably haven't been bought yet. But what is your point? The neighbors don't like it and they said so. All they did was express their opinion. Nothing will be done about it.

I think my point since I started this thread was that I agree that neighbours don't like it. It's clear they don't. But making placards and protesting in front of the home that offends them I find so mean-spirited.