1678 replies to this topic

[Mike K.]

Why can't the mayor issue a press release that anyone can read without having to go through a paywall?

[VicHockeyFan]

Helps posted on Facebook with a link to the opinion piece she wrote for the TC. This was her introduction to it:

 

"I hope you'll take the time to read the piece that I wrote, published in Saturday's Times Colonist. We settlers have big role to play in meaningful, ethical reconciliation." 

 

Settlers? Really? 

 

Yes, she says we have to get the dollar amount we still owe and pay up.

 

Here's the link:   http://www.timescolo...#undefined.gbpl

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 03 September 2017 - 02:51 PM.

[VicHockeyFan]

Well then clearly we should not allow any further settling. End all immigration now! It is unethical and impedes reconciliation.

 

Yes, why are we not siding with the natives and demanding an end to immigration, while we work out our plans to head back to Europe?

[Nparker]

Yes, why are we not siding with the natives and demanding an end to immigration, while we work out our plans to head back to Europe?

Will the "First Nations" peoples work out plans to reconstruct the Bering land bridge and return to Asia? It seems to me they are "settlers" in North America too.

[rjag]

aren't we all from Africa? being labelled a 'settler' is racist 

[Sparky]

I didn't settle here. I was born here. This topic should have been discussed with my ancestors when they were alive and had the opportunity to discuss this in person.

I can't speak to their actions, and I certainly haven't budgeted for paying for them. We are all citizens of the world and we all should be able to live our lives without being subject to racism.

Who owns what and how they came to claim ownership has varied over time. In the distant past it could have been whoever was stronger made the decision. Today we use a judicial system. In the future we may revert to a system that was similar to our past. Until then .........get away from me.

[Bingo]

Settlers of Catan...ada  will be next.     

 

https://www.gamespot...e/1100-6453090/

[VicHockeyFan]

She is not doing well on her FB page comments...

 

https://www.facebook.com/lisa.helps.5

[On the Level]

I'm 7th generation Canadian.  My ancestors came from all over the place.  Where am I supposed to go back to exactly?

[Bingo]

I'm 7th generation Canadian.  My ancestors came from all over the place.  Where am I supposed to go back to exactly?

 

Don't worry about it.

[VicHockeyFan]

I'm 7th generation Canadian.  My ancestors came from all over the place.  Where am I supposed to go back to exactly?

 

She might let us all go to the Yukon if we ask real nice.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 04 September 2017 - 08:04 PM.

[Bingo]

They might let us all go to the Yukon if we ask real nice.

Isn't HB already there?

[On the Level]

I think she believes she is doing the right thing, but she risks furthering the divide.  

 

Restitution for unkept promises yes, but don't demonize me and my heritage as a means to an end.  

 

She will further her own ambitions by increasing the segment of the population that supports her, for her own personal political gain.  I doubt she is doing this consciously, but does she understand the conflict of interest here?

[sdwright.vic]

She is not doing well on her FB page comments...

https://www.facebook.com/lisa.helps.5

She keeps blaming everyone else. Asking "did you even read the article?"

[VicHockeyFan]

From her piece:

 

As part of this process, we need to understand as a council and as a community what role city hall and local settlers played in removing the Songhees and Esquimalt Nations from their lands upon which the city was built. What motions did the council of the day pass and what actions did the city take that assisted in this process and in other processes of colonization? This would be a good master’s thesis topic for a University of Victoria student.

Once we understand the role of the city and local settlers in dispossession and decolonization, we can acknowledge our wrongdoing, provide appropriate restitution and make an apology.

 

 

A couple things.  Victoria was incorporated as a city in 1862.  Long after all the Douglas treaties were signed and executed (1854).

 

So I'm not sure what if any role "city hall" played in the process.  And nobody disputes that the Douglas treaties paid real money and goods to the natives in exchange for the land purchase.

 

But more troubling is the second paragraph.  It presupposes that the Douglas Treaty settlers were in the wrong, and that today we owe compensation.  I'm not sure that has been ruled.  So to go into this discussion already accepting fault is a bad idea.

 

And of course, irony alert.  She submitted her piece for publication in a newspaper called the Times Colonist.

 

Lastly, I'm all for giving the local bands clear title to the land they currently use as reserves and additional lands like we offer in federal land disposals.  Let's accelerate that.  The only reason we have mobile homes on these lands now is because the natives do not own it.  All the reserves around here are still federal land.  Let's turn it over completely and have it serve a higher use, as the owners choose.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 05 September 2017 - 06:29 AM.

[spanky123]

Helps posted on Facebook with a link to the opinion piece she wrote for the TC. This was her introduction to it:

 

"I hope you'll take the time to read the piece that I wrote, published in Saturday's Times Colonist. We settlers have big role to play in meaningful, ethical reconciliation." 

 

Settlers? Really? 

 

She has made the settlers comment many times now. It is a reference to the illegal Israeli settlements on the West Bank. She is trying to draw a comparison between the colonization of Canada and the Israeli / Palestinian conflict. 

 

Just goes to show that Helps can keep the crazy inside long enough to have a tea and crumpets with the 'enemy' yet it must take an incredible effort to do so.

[spanky123]

I think she believes she is doing the right thing, but she risks furthering the divide.  

 

Restitution for unkept promises yes, but don't demonize me and my heritage as a means to an end.  

 

She will further her own ambitions by increasing the segment of the population that supports her, for her own personal political gain.  I doubt she is doing this consciously, but does she understand the conflict of interest here?

 

She is a hypocrite. She writes about history being revised to reflect that the colonization of Canada was peaceful (I was never taught that in history class) yet completely ignores any mention of the fact that the average life expectancy of a FN child was 45, nearly half died of smallpox or other diseases and there was no basic literacy as you and I would understand it. 

[spanky123]

 

Lastly, I'm all for giving the local bands clear title to the land they currently use as reserves and additional lands like we offer in federal land disposals.  Let's accelerate that.  The only reason we have mobile homes on these lands now is because the natives do not own it.  All the reserves around here are still federal land.  Let's turn it over completely and have it serve a higher use, as the owners choose.

 

 

Not so sure that you are correct here. There are different models for land 'ownership' on reserves and FN land.  From what I understand, in most cases the FN can use the land for whatever purpose they want and they still get the income on leases. My guess is that the reason why there are mobile homes is that they do not require a lot of servicing and can still generate relatively easy income. 

 

What I think needs to be addressed is what appears to be the lack of transparency surrounding a number of these deals. It seems like each land lease gets set up as its own private corporation and then income/expenses do not get reported as part of the FN reporting requirements. May very well be legit, but how can you tell? Both the Songhees and Esquimalt bands, on paper, run at fairly large operating loses annually. 

[VicHockeyFan]

Not so sure that you are correct here. There are different models for land 'ownership' on reserves and FN land.  From what I understand, in most cases the FN can use the land for whatever purpose they want and they still get the income on leases. My guess is that the reason why there are mobile homes is that they do not require a lot of servicing and can still generate relatively easy income. 

 

Oh, they sure can use the land for what they want.  But commercial and mortgage lenders are wary.  You want to build your Home Improvement Store on native land?  Even if you have a 50-year lease, Mr. Lender wants tougher terms than if you owned the land.  Same for residential mortgages.  

 

Instead, let natives sell off land as they choose. 

[lanforod]

I think the fear has always been the natives would end up with no land in the end if they could sell it as fee simple. I agree, that's a risk, but its a risk everyone else takes. Nothing is stopping a FN family from owning hundreds of acres of land in Canada and living similarly to 500 years ago if they want to.