26 replies to this topic

[Mike K.]

Recently land clearing has begun on a Esquimalt First Nation property along Admirals at Hallowell Road referred to as the "Fibre Max" site. From what I've been able to gather up the proposed project is a commercial/retail development that could include a marina component.

From a nearby strata council minute (I did not include a link as the website is listed as under suspicion for malware attacks).

This is from March of 2013.

The Esquimalt First Nation Development Plan: Notes from an Aldersmith
neighbourhood information session.
Wednesday, February 27th, 7-9 pm, 121 Aldersmith Place meeting room

There were 27 people in attendance, including residents and strata council representatives
from the Strata at 106/108, 118, 121, 126, and 127, and the owner of Admiral’s Walk.

View Royal Councilor Ron Matson set the agenda as “finding a win/win for Esquimalt
Nation, View Royal and adjacent neighbours.” He then introduced Bob Mason, and noted,
“It’s sort of his meeting.”

Bob Mason identified himself as a real estate developer, but in this case, acting only as a
development consultant to the Esquimalt Nation. He does not have an interest in the
development. “I am providing advice to my client, Esquimalt Nation, on a radical change.”

Mason began his outline of Esquimalt Nation’s development plans, by characterizing life on
reservations as a “human tragedy.” He noted, “Poverty denies a way out of an institutional
problem and a crisis of reduced expectations.” Implementing the Esquimalt Nation’s
development plan would provide increased revenue and access to a modest increase in
local jobs for the Nation’s members. The estimate of total new jobs created by the
development is 100 – 200, but, because of lack of skills, Band members may qualify for only
10 of them, but those 10 would be a significant improvement.

The development includes:

- The “Triangle” Site: 8 acres, to be developed as a retail shopping centre. “Mixed
tenants” would cover 25% of the site, with much of the remainder needing to
accommodate parking. Deliveries to the tenants would occur off Hallowell. The
Admiral’s Walk access road on Hallowell would be extended into the Triangle site to
link the two centers.

- The “Fibre Max” site: A business park / marina (joint with Songhees First nation).
Indian Affairs was responsible for decontamination of this site and some remaining
clean-up is expected to be concluded this year. A typical Wal-Mart is about 130,000
square feet, and this site could accommodate approximately 140,000 square feet of
“warehouse-like” space. The Marina would be adjacent to a Water Lot lease of 88
hectares held by both bands. Mason did not consider increased warehousing traffic
to be as large an issue as the already agreed load from Thetis Cove.

- About 3 years ago, the parties involved with Admiral’s Road in the reserve area, the
Province, Songhees, and Esquimalt Nation, agreed to a plan for redevelopment to
bring the Road “up to standard.” The project will provide access to the Triangle by
a Seenupin Road crossing and extension, including a stoplight. The “dangerous”
intersection at Thomas Road will be closed after the rest of the project is completed.
If Hallowell restrictions aren’t lifted, the “Plan B” would be to make that Seenupin
extension the route to Band Land after closing Thomas Road. It’s clear however that
unblocking Hallowell makes Band’s access mostly Hallowell.

- With the closing of Thomas Road, the Esquimalt Nation still retains the right to one
crossing over the E&N Tracks, this could be part of the “Plan B” option but there are
two difficulties: 1) the grading to the tracks is steep and 2) the Island Corridor
Foundation is pushing for 1 crossing at Hallowell Rd. According to Bob Mason,
Option B would reduce the estimated $30 million value of the Esquimalt Nation’s
property by $2.5 million. This new road way would reduce the area available for
development. The cost of building the new road is also an issue.

- The Rail Trail relocation: Mason indicated that some sort of “agreement” existed
among affected parties, CRD, View Royal, Esquimalt, Esquimalt Nation, Songhees
First Nation, and the Island Corridor Foundation regarding the location of the Rail
Trail in relation to Esquimalt Nation’s land. View Royal disputes that any such
agreement has been finalized. The trail will be routed up Hallowell to Admiral’s
Road, then along Admiral’s to rejoin the track corridor at the to-be-closed Thomas
Road crossing. The Band wants a “separation” to occur so that trail users aren’t
staring into their homes and ceremonial sites. Mason emphasized, “I don’t think you
understand how traumatized these people are. Over time, maybe the trail could
cross directly through, but not just right now.”

- The Admiral’s Road project is delaying 18 months while plans for the Rail Trail are
finalized. The design is 85% finished, and the expectations are that 100% can be
reached in 4 months, after the Provincial election. Widening Admiral’s Road
involves transferring some Esquimalt nation land to the Province. Federal to
Provincial land transfers typically take 24 months.

- The Trio concrete batch plant trucks will stay on Thomas until it is closed, but if
Esquimalt Nation/Trio continues with the lease, the trucks would then be going on
Hallowell.

Here are the answers to the questions, why now? - where’s the money for development
coming from?

- The best design solution for the implementation of these plans, and therefore the
key to poverty alleviation, is to remove the View Royal weight restrictions that keep
trucks off Hallowell Road.

- A nearby neighbor, the Esquimalt Graving Dock, owned and operated by Public
Works Canada is about to spend 30 billion dollars on shipbuilding. The seaside land
in their Business Park on the Fibre Max site is a logical magnet for services to the
Graving Dock. There is no closer potentially accessible and water related industry
land for the peripheral services that the Graving Dock will attract. 3 | P a g e

- Ordinarily, reserves don’t have the money or “soft” development capacity to build
the infrastructure required to attract investors or tenants. They are denied access
to wealth accumulation through leverage of real estate because potential developers
can't use band land as asset to secure capital (i.e. can't get a mortgage). So Bands
can't develop infrastructure to secure tenants, except on “buckshee” leases. These
are usually “not the highest and best use, just the best they can get for some
revenue.” The land that the Esquimalt Nation has available is currently attractive
enough so that potential developers are willing to bear some of the infrastructure
costs and are knocking on their door.

- In the interests of securing compatible and complimentary retail services on the
Triangle site, Admiral’s Walk owners have been involved in ongoing discussions
with the Esquimalt nation.

The next steps in the “process” aren’t yet clear:
1. The desirability of extending the path on the shore of Thetis Cove development as
far as the Marina was noted

2. There was a sense that this information session was only a preliminary first step
and there was a need for a proper open community meeting in a larger venue some
time soon.

3. Reacting to that need, Ron Matson noted:
- There would be responses to all questions asked at this meeting, particularly the
ones written on the blue cards

- According to Bob Mason there has been 12 months of discussions with View
Royal staff about options and that the Esquimalt Nation’s “timelines” were
getting very short

- View Royal Council would refer issues to the advisory committees, providing
more public opportunity to for public participation. “The advisory committees
are the best route so that people are aware and can ask questions.”

4. But, over the last several years these committees have met infrequently and their
agendas and times of meeting are not published. It would require some pressure to
make this means of participation actually worked.

5. The big unanswered question is why must access to Hallowell Road be granted so
quickly and without completing the appropriate engineering and traffic studies and
providing the community with an official plan? Bob stated a decision was required
within 4 weeks. Ron will go back to the TVR staff to get answers to why the town
and the CRD for that matter have been in discussions with the Esquimalt Nation
without completing the necessary studies and planning.4 | P a g e

6. A better way needs to be determined for all Aldersmith area neighbours, including
local businesses and First Nations, to continue dialogue among themselves on
common interests in area development and on the best means of communicating
them to all levels of government.

The meeting (a) very strongly supported development for the Esquimalt Nation and (b)
identified Hallowell’s re-design and removal of the weight restrictions as of critical concern
to the neighbourhood. “This is a loaded bomb.” But then the residents actually made
useful and rational recommendations as to how that re-design could be made into a
win/win “opportunity.” In effect the solution is to widen Hallowell Road allowing for
turning lanes onto Admirals Rd and splitting the lower half of Hallowell Rd at the Lane (by
Reliable), allowing for a separated access lane in front of the 6 houses in the strata at
126. This would accommodate both the truck traffic from the Esquimalt Nation, the Fibre
Max site and future traffic from Thetis Cover – a win, win for the whole community. Bob
Mason admitted this hadn't come up and was worth thinking about.

[Coreyburger]

Uhh, Songhees and Esquimalt Nation are separate nations. Also, this project should be labelled [Esquimalt Nation] Fibre Max, as it NOTHING to do with View Royal.

[Mike K.]

Which government ok's the development?

[Coreyburger]

Esquimalt Nation and the federal government, as the reserve is technically owned by the federal government and Esquimalt Nation doesn't have a comprehensive development plan that I know about.

[Mike K.]

So View Royal has no say over whether or not the development proceeds?

[Coreyburger]

No, First Nations are not part of any municipality (except Tsawout and Tsartlip, but even then Central Saanich doesn't have land use decision power).

[sdwright.vic]

8 acres... 25% coverage cru... not alot of retail space, sounds specific to me.

Edited by sdwright.vic, 26 February 2015 - 06:06 AM.

[Mike K.]

So in an election, who would Esquimalt Nation residents vote for? The mayor of Esquimalt, View Royal, or neither?

[Matt R.]

Public Works Canada is about to spend 30 billion on ship building, eh? Seems a bit steep.

Matt.

[Coreyburger]

So in an election, who would Esquimalt Nation residents vote for? The mayor of Esquimalt, View Royal, or neither?

 

Within the CRD they belong to the Juan de Fuca Electoral Area (along with Songhees Nation, T'souke, Scia'new [Beecher Bay] and Pacheedhat). Pauchaquin and Tseycum in North Saanich vote for the Southern Gulf Island EA, and Tsawout and Tsartlip are part of Central Saanich electorally. They also can vote for school district trustees as part of any of the four SDs in the CRD.

[Mike K.]

Hmm, well I'll be...

[LJ]

Sort of a reverse Boston Tea party, representation without taxation.

[Mike K.]

And DC, no? Their license plate is the absolute best.

[Coreyburger]

Sewer and water services are delivered in Songhees and Esquimat Nation by the CRD (just as they are in the rest of the Juan de Fuca Water Distribution Area - that includes the West Shore + View Royal), so they do pay that. No idea about garbage/compost/recycling.

[weisguy86]

Within the CRD they belong to the Juan de Fuca Electoral Area (along with Songhees Nation, T'souke, Scia'new [Beecher Bay] and Pacheedhat). Pauchaquin and Tseycum in North Saanich vote for the Southern Gulf Island EA, and Tsawout and Tsartlip are part of Central Saanich electorally. They also can vote for school district trustees as part of any of the four SDs in the CRD.

 

Actually as they do not pay any municipal fees they do not get to vote in local elections.

 

The cleared site is now proposed to host a gravel mart and small Ellice recycling depot.

[Coreyburger]

Actually as they do not pay any municipal fees they do not get to vote in local elections.

 

Voting is determined by residency, not taxes. And for the purposes of the CRD, Esquimalt Nation is within the Juan de Fuca EA (although the CRD doesn't do the local area planning like they do for the rest of the EA). And CRD Integrated Water provide water and sewer services for both Esquimalt and Songhees Nation (Songhees Nation is part of the Westside Sewage Committee).

 

For reference: school district boundaries: http://www.bcstats.g...aps/Census.aspx

[satellite]

Any images or renderings out there?

[weisguy86]

Voting is determined by residency, not taxes. And for the purposes of the CRD, Esquimalt Nation is within the Juan de Fuca EA (although the CRD doesn't do the local area planning like they do for the rest of the EA). And CRD Integrated Water provide water and sewer services for both Esquimalt and Songhees Nation (Songhees Nation is part of the Westside Sewage Committee).

 

For reference: school district boundaries: http://www.bcstats.g...aps/Census.aspx

Let me clarify, anyone living on the native reserves do not vote in our municipal elections, or so I was informed during this past election.

[LJ]

Let me clarify, anyone living on the native reserves do not vote in our municipal elections, or so I was informed during this past election.

Do not vote or can't vote?

[Coreyburger]

Do not vote or can't vote?

 

Can't, unless they own property and are thus non-resident electors.