1697 replies to this topic

[dasmo]

Rail yards has been delayed. The original plan was a 7 year build out. He just slowed down and re planned instead of busting. A lot happened in the las cycle... A lot. I get the skepticism though. Dockside was supposed to be a 7 year build as well... I give the area another ten years to feel done...ish.

[jonny]

In fewer words that's what you mean.

 

No it is not.

 

You gotta understand that massive projects like Roundhouse takes years and years to get through the planning process. And only then can developers start the arduous process of finding tenants or selling homes before a single shovel hits the ground.

 

Again, this project has been in various stages of planning since at least 2007. Eight years of "planning" and not a single Roundhouse building is even close to going up. Permitting does not take that long.

 

KK - The Railyards has been successful, no doubt, but it is also moved very slowly and is overall an incredibly modest compared with DG and Roundhouse. I believe it has been delayed as well.

 

I'm not saying nothing will ever get built, but I'm not expecting much over the next five years or so. There is a lot proposed and coming down the pipe in Victoria, and there are other projects that are way ahead of DG and RH in terms of marketing and being close to getting their hands dirty.

[Mike K.]

Bayview first hit the planning tables in 1997, or thereabouts, and major changes took place before even Focus got involved. The first building wasn't completed until 2009. These mega projects take years.

The original Focus Equities concept for Bayview was 10-, 11- and 13-storeys. As we can see that all changed, big time.

Dockside lost its development partner, Windmill, which left VanCity stranded. The bank had to take the hit and figure out how and with whom it should proceed. I actually believe we'll see developmemt partnerships at DG like we saw with Bosa and Focus. That makes the most sense to me, but who knows.

[Urbanistco]

How many units were at the Hudson? 160 or thereabouts? Promontory could very well be the largest single phase condo project, ever, in Victoria.

 

I feel like I am on the fence positionally on this discussion but it should said that Promontory had 50 units sell to a single foreign investment group. Without that purchase, the project would likely not be viewed as an example of success.

[Mike K.]

I'm sure there are plenty of projects selling units to all sorts of investors. There's nothing wrong with that. For 50 to be snapped up by a single buyer means someone is extremely bullish on Vic West.

[Urbanistco]

Not disagreeing but that is privilege only available to groups like Bosa that have the track record and contacts...It does skew the absorption rate by quick a bit that other developers may base decisions off of only to find themselves without that sort of privilege. 

[Mike K.]

Not a single big project other than Janion has sold out since 2012 (the 834 being the last one). Sovereign, Duet, Mondrian, Union, Era, and 200 Douglas all have inventory and will for some time to come. All of those building are completed and buyers get exactly what they see without the waiting game or the gamble. It's a perfect scenario and yet units are still sitting around. That's just the nature of the industry, I guess.

 

Edit: The Hudson has 152 units which does make Promontory the single biggest condo building every built in the City of Victoria -- or at least in the last 15 years, give or take [Shoal Point is really three different buildings built over three separate phases but I don't know if even it has as many units]).

[jonny]

Shutters must have quite a few units...it's huge.

[Mike K.]

Collectively 185 between the two buildings, but yes, that would have been the biggest volume of units in Victoria sold as part of one single sales phase.

[Mike K.]

Mike, when do you think we'll see a highrise go up at DG? Roundhouse?

 

Dockside is moving on the two rental buildings as the next phase. Construction will start next year.

 

Roundhouse is moving forward on Roundhouse Marketplace. They are now negotiating with tenants and in discussions with an anchor tenant for the grocery space. What goes into the grocery space dictates what they can lease elsewhere as big tenants have sway over who can and cannot lease near their premises if they are taking the biggest gamble.

 

We do know the next residential phase is Bayview Tower 3. Focus Equities have a partner lined up for that tower but they have not yet formally signed on and as such no formal announcement has been made. Then there are several lowrise buildings at Bayview that will be built. Towers at Roundhouse will be the last over-all phase for that entire swath of land as that's when top-dollar will be charged and warranted, sort of like what's happening at Hudson Place where the 24-storey and 17-storey towers will be the last to be built.

[Designer Diva]

So how about the condo owners on Sitkum in The Edge Building . . . do I see a 21 story tower in their view?

 

[Mike K.]

Yup, for sure. If I were concerned about losing an unobstructed view and I lived there I'd consider selling. Or if I was buying with an unobstructed view in mind I'd consider looking elsewhere. Of course it could be many years before that part of Dockside is even developed.

[Kapten Kapsell]

Did anyone go to the Planning & Land Use Committee meeting last week @ CoV?

 

Apparently there was a rezoning proposal discussed to move the non-market housing buildings to sites @ 370 & 384 Harbour Road; the presentation is at https://victoria.civ...resentation.pdf .

[Nparker]

http://www.timescolo...eboot-1.1962017

 

I bet the reduced density will be regretted in the future. I think this is a very short-sighted decision.

[VicHockeyFan]

http://www.timescolo...eboot-1.1962017

 

I bet the reduced density will be regretted in the future. I think this is a very short-sighted decision.

 

We live in a strange world here.  Only here in the backwoods would reducing density make the stuff more attractive to developers.  In the big boy world, higher FSR always means higher profits.  Somehow here the only way it works is to go small.  Sigh.

[spanky123]

We live in a strange world here.  Only here in the backwoods would reducing density make the stuff more attractive to developers.  In the big boy world, higher FSR always means higher profits.  Somehow here the only way it works is to go small.  Sigh.

 

Reading between the lines my take is that reduced density means that they do not have to deliver on the amenities promised for higher density, they can reduce parking requirements and do not have to meet LEED requirements. If that is correct then reduced density may be more attractive.

[VicHockeyFan]

Reading between the lines my take is that reduced density means that they do not have to deliver on the amenities promised for higher density, they can reduce parking requirements and do not have to meet LEED requirements. If that is correct then reduced density may be more attractive.

 

Ya, you are probably right.  They are masking it in "let local developers" build.

[Mixed365]

Reading between the lines my take is that reduced density means that they do not have to deliver on the amenities promised for higher density, they can reduce parking requirements and do not have to meet LEED requirements. If that is correct then reduced density may be more attractive.

Ya, you are probably right.  They are masking it in "let local developers" build.

Don't forget absorption...especially with Bayview Place underway. 

[Fernwoodian]

I saw the public hearing sign for the rentals. It was slated for tonight. Not sure what happened.

[Mike K.]

Affordable housing reignites Dockside Green development
http://victoria.citi...en-development/

 

The City of Victoria has approved two buildings for exclusive use as affordable "work force" rental housing at 370 and 380 Harbour Road as part of the Dockside Green project in Vic West. The development will be in partnership with Dockside Green developer Vancity and Catalyst Community Development Society, a not-for-profit using social equity in project financing that will own and operate the units once completed. Pacifica Housing will handle tenant intake and the day-to-day management.

 

The two buildings, referred to as R4 (19 units) and R5 (30 units), will rise to three floors with units ranging from 250 square foot studios to 1,130 square foot three bedroom and den townhomes. In accordance with BC Housing Income Limits maximum rent for studio apartments will be $737.50 rising up to $1,675 for townhomes. [Full article]