Rock Bay brew pub proposal seeks rezoning

By Robert Randall • Published on Wednesday, April 28, 2010 • Categorized as Business & the Local Economy, Local News

When the husband and wife team of Don and Bonnie Bradley proposed the idea of a brew pub in Victoria’s Burnside Gorge neighbourhood, you’d be forgiven for assuming it would be in a trendy development like Selkirk Waterfront or Dockside Green.

Instead, the Bradleys chose a unit in a non-descript commercial strip mall along Bay Street’s industrial heart. While lacking in bucolic waterfront views and shady patios, the proposed location is surrounded by dozens of businesses, but hardly anywhere to grab a beer after work, let alone a lunchtime sandwich. Bonnie Bradley describes the high-density commercial district as having “a built-in clientele” and that neighbouring businesses have greeted the proposed pub with enthusiasm. “They’re thrilled to bits”, Bonnie says, “of the idea of having a place nearby to have a pint and eat a good lunch”.

Site of the proposed pub site on Bay Street in the former Direct Buy location. Photo © VibrantVictoria.ca.

Hoping to head off the rezoning headaches experienced when they investigated opening a pub in the old needle exchange building on Cormorant Street, the Bradleys searched for a location that had industrial zoning (including restaurant and brewery uses) close to Downtown’s border population. Unfortunately for them, in order to sell their own beer in the restaurant, a liquor primary license was also required, triggering the rezoning they hoped to avoid. Antiquated “Tied House” laws, drafted before the era of the neighbourhood brew pub and with national breweries in mind, have been the bane of the Victoria publican’s existence for generations, forcing pubs to sell competitors’ products unless special permission was granted.

The pub's name was inspired by a George Orwell article. Image supplied. Photo © VibrantVictoria.ca.

Don and Bonnie vow to press on with their chosen location and are in the process of installing fireplaces, skylights, furniture and brewing equipment in the former Direct Buy location at 350-B Bay Street. Named “The Moon Under Water” after George Orwell’s article on the hypothetical ideal pub, the Bradley’s alehouse will be modeled after traditional English self-serve pubs. Bonnie mentions the Crow and Gate pub outside Nanaimo as a model to emulate, a destination pub with a small menu featuring quality food. The Bradleys are no strangers to the beer business; Don co-founded Bowen Island Brewing in 1994 before selling four years later. The couple plan to brew English-style Ales and a Czech-style pilsner, with nothing above 4.5% alcohol. They’re aiming for a July opening for the restaurant while they await City Council’s decision on the Pub rezoning.

A Community Association meeting looking into the rezoning application will be held tonight at the Burnside Gorge Community Centre on Cecilia Road. Doors open at 6:30 p.m.

To discuss the Moon Under Water Pub on the VibrantVictoria.ca discussion forum, click here.

Responses to this Headline or Article

The five most recent replies to VibrantVictoria.ca's discussion forum's Moon Under Water Pub Brewery | Victoria | 350-B Bay St. thread, the most relevant thread to the above headline or article:

amor de cosmos

Feb 13, 2012 at 8:51 am

It didn't look like trouble last time I was there.

G-Man

Feb 13, 2012 at 10:31 am

Have they not always been closed on Sunday and Monday??

mysage

Feb 13, 2012 at 12:03 pm

Quote: What pub closes on a Sunday? I smell trouble.

Hope not but if this is strictly a cost saving move (and nothing wrong with saving costs) it seems like an exercise in "false economy" to me.

Strictly guess work here but:

A quick look with some "kitchen table" math show that a guess (based on $ per sq ft in that area) would show that the minimum lease they are paying is around $5000 per month (but I would wager it is much more on a triple net lease).

That means on an annual basis they are paying a $60,000. Divided by 365 days a year means that they are paying $164.38 per day whether they are open or not. Now being closed for 3 days a week x 52 weeks a year means they are closed at a minimum 156 days a year (not including some extra holiday times). At 164.38 x 156 we have a cost of $25,643.28 pa. That is a major loss before they even open the doors - 42.73% of their rent is paid with no chance of off setting it with sales. This calculation does not include other hard costs that they might have (insurance, phone, accounting, salaries, etc) which would increase the per day costs even more. That seems like a bad business model to me.

I hope they are surviving OK as I like the place and go there often but I agree that things are looking very shaky.

Anyone with a restaurant and or accounting background here feel free to weigh in and correct me. I have no background in either but the business side of many things interest me.

Bob Fugger

Feb 13, 2012 at 12:29 pm

Quote: Hope not but if this is strictly a cost saving move (and nothing wrong with saving costs) it seems like an exercise in "false economy" to me.

Strictly guess work here but:

A quick look with some "kitchen table" math show that a guess (based on $ per sq ft in that area) would show that the minimum lease they are paying is around $5000 per month (but I would wager it is much more on a triple net lease).

That means on an annual basis they are paying a $60,000. Divided by 365 days a year means that they are paying $164.38 per day whether they are open or not. Now being closed for 3 days a week x 52 weeks a year means they are closed at a minimum 156 days a year (not including some extra holiday times). At 164.38 x 156 we have a cost of $25,643.28 pa. That is a major loss before they even open the doors - 42.73% of their rent is paid with no chance of off setting it with sales. This calculation does not include other hard costs that they might have (insurance, phone, accounting, salaries, etc) which would increase the per day costs even more. That seems like a bad business model to me.

I hope they are surviving OK as I like the place and go there often but I agree that things are looking very shaky.

Anyone with a restaurant and or accounting background here feel free to weigh in and correct me. I have no background in either but the business side of many things interest me.

Are they closed three days per week, now? I thought it was just Sunday & Mondays.

As for your math, it's hard to say - too many variables, including:

Number of salaried staff vs. hourly staff (likely more of the latter) - lends to argument to keep closed on a slow day
Perishibility of food/ordering efficiency - if you can order around an off period or if your goods are not all that perishable, you can afford to be closed and not waste food
Business flows - if you only have 10 tables over the course of a Sunday, your variable costs are probably through the roof. Maybe it's worth it to cut your losses at the fixed cost loss. I'm also guessing that a lot of the business there is driven by the 9-5 light-industrial Rock Bay lunch bucket crowd. If they're not there, why open?
Opportunity costs - this is a brew pub. If the operator makes more on the beer side and could increase profitability by devoting more time to the beer side of the business, he'd be foolish to stay open during down times when he could be brewing.
Not knowing the business at all except from what I can glean on here and Facebook, it looks like they had a bit of a following for their Sunday roast beef. It can be a loss leader at the worst of times, but if you're smart you can turn a tidy profit on it, plus all of the incidental beer sales you might not otherwise have.

Moving their roast beef special to Saturday night may not work out for them - roast beef dinner specials are a Sunday pub staple in Victoria. If it was me, based on my own assumptions/appraisals, I would have closed Saturday day and Sunday day, but opened up at night.