1451 replies to this topic

[Casual Kev]

Ugh. Some renters giving the rest of us a bad name. I keep seeing these horror stories as justification for not renting units out long-term, so owners will instead AirBnB the property. Yet is that not taking the same risk?

 

You will find out whether an AirBnB occupant is damaging the unit very quickly. Not always the case for long-term tenants. 

[Victoria Watcher]

Ugh. Some renters giving the rest of us a bad name. I keep seeing these horror stories as justification for not renting units out long-term, so owners will instead AirBnB the property. Yet is that not taking the same risk?

most air bnb tenants are respectful. they want to maintain a good rating in the system.

and there is no real risk for the host. police can and will arrive and evict people on the spot. with a long term tenant there is no possibility of that.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 23 May 2020 - 04:08 PM.

[Mike K.]

AirBnB also has mechanisms in place to assist landlords with damage. They do, after all, have the individual’s credit card.

[Jackerbie]

I’m looking forward to the AirBnB equation here. Will the people with vacation suites who’ve vowed to never rent them as long term apartments going to change their minds, or are they holding out for “some” semblance of a tourist season?

 

Anecdotally (and of course without data cannot be sure how much of this is AirBnB and how much is international students heading home), there are currently 3,000 rental listings in downtown Vancouver. Even the "core" of Richmond has something like 1,000 listings on Craigslist.

[spanky123]

Seeing lots of For Rent signs on buildings that used to say Waiting List....

 

Good. All we need to do is get the vacancy rate above 3% and all of council's 'temporary' rental assistance measures end.

[Nparker]

Good. All we need to do is get the vacancy rate above 3% and all of council's 'temporary' rental assistance measures end.

And all it will have taken to achieve this vacancy rate is the nearly complete destruction of the economy. 

[Mike K.]

Precisely. One crisis solved.

Or will it be? Some on council believe all housing must be state owned and state delineated.

[GetLisaSomeHelps]

Precisely. One crisis solved.

Or will it be? Some on council believe all housing must be state owned and state delineated.

 

"Good news everyone housing is now free....now hand over 90% of your paycheque!"

[Mike K.]

Oh yeah, that’s line 16 on page 97 of the official New Society Resident handbook.

[Nparker]

"Good news everyone housing is now free....now hand over 90% of your paycheque!"

Not much of a burden for those who feel the state owes them a guaranteed income without ever having to do any work.

[spanky123]

Precisely. One crisis solved.

Or will it be? Some on council believe all housing must be state owned and state delineated.

 

Well this is what state run housing gets you. https://www.bbc.com/...ver-find-a-home

[Victoria Watcher]

Own a piece of Victoria history: a Maclure Mansion built in 1907 - it's a beautiful example of British Arts and Crafts. This grand heritage home was divided into 5 units in 1945 and then further developed in 1991, when the present owner added a coach house to the property. The coach house has a bachelor unit on the top floor and a garage/workshop space below that could be converted to more finished space. Two of the other units have 2+ bedrooms and generous living spaces. 3 of the units are 1 bedrooms with the potential for expansion.This stately property houses 5 decorative fireplaces, hardwood floors, stained glass, period detailing, generous porches, garden space, and a fabulous location across from Beacon Hill Park. The suites have been renovated over the years by the owner, a master craftsman, and it shows. The tenants all love where they live and are an asset. Heat pump, gas furnace, 3 year old roof, gas HW. This home will draw you in and hold your attention!

 

$3,199,000

228 Douglas Street

 

there is also video on the site.  nice photos.  seems like a grand old house.

 

https://www.realtor....ctoria-downtown

 

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 11 June 2020 - 09:18 AM.

[Casual Kev]

Now that I've concluded my rental search for a 1-bed, this is what I've noticed:

 

 

Tons of secondary suites on the market. Hard to tell whether prices are down on average since you see all sorts of things, but units with 2+ beds seem to be going cheaper than usual - surely because these usually go by the room and with the lack of international students they're taking a hit. The bottom of the market seems to be about $650-700 per room. 

 

Also lots of AirBnB-oriented units going long term. Lost count of how many downtown studios and small 1-beds are available. They seemed to be generally on the higher end (e.g. Jukebox, Union) so they aren't particularly cheap, say $1500-1600 for 400-500 sqft. But that reflects how much more revenue they generate as AirBnBs, which is why there are also quite a few real estate listings for these units.

 

Prices for purpose-built rentals seem to have dropped a bit but not by much - maybe a year's worth of rollback. Overall (including parking + storage + laundry fees) you're still looking at $1400-1500 for old stock and $1600-1800 for a newer/reno'd one. As the WIP stock comes online maybe it'll get a bit better for renters.

 

Some price drops in condos too, maybe a bit moreso in the higher end of the market. I personally went with a newly built condo in a great location, financially it's comparable to a newer purpose-built rental after accounting for the extras and amenities. You're maybe looking at 1300-1500 for older woodframe condos, and 1700-2000 for newer and/or concrete condos. I've seen some decent deals, though they go fast. 

 

Speaking of going fast, the rental market is still very competitive. Landlords pretending COVID never happened and charging ever-increasing rents seem to not be moving their units, but stuff priced maybe 5-7% less than pre-COVID times is still going fast. I didn't get a response in about 1/3 of my inquiries despite generally responding to ads within hours of them showing up. Given vacancy rates were extremely low pre-COVID, this makes sense - and no doubt some tenants are trying to get out of bad deals from the last year or two they felt compelled to take.

 

I was kinda shocked at the number of dual income households competing for 550-700 sqft units even when they weren't particularly well priced. I'd speculate it's because tenant's future income expectations override the price drop from COVID circumstances, coupled with Victoria having stickier rents from retirees and government workers. I ended up going with a moderately sized 1-bed in part because I failed at every + den I applied for, but succeeding at 1-beds.

 

 

I don't expect the long-term rental market to bottom out until the fiscal reckoning from the COVID bailouts come to fore, where I'd imagine you will see some real disparity across neighborhoods and type of stock - the weak CDN and apparent stability should prop up the AirBnB and secondary suite stock back up for the most part, but the big cuts that will have to be made will affect most of the market in a bad way. And I'm saying this without accounting for whatever the second COVID wave will look like, there's a chance no one will have time to worry about rents or vacancy rates by October.

Edited by Casual Kev, 12 June 2020 - 09:16 PM.

[Mike K.]

Fascinating, thank you.

I’m hearing that UVic’s international student situation is equal to pre-COVID heading into the summer, and they’re arriving on campus every day. Before they can reside on campus, however, they’re being put up in hotels for quarantine. UVic was not expecting this level of uptake by international students.

[Casual Kev]

Fascinating, thank you.

I’m hearing that UVic’s international student situation is equal to pre-COVID heading into the summer, and they’re arriving on campus every day. Before they can reside on campus, however, they’re being put up in hotels for quarantine. UVic was not expecting this level of uptake by international students.

 

That's interesting to hear. A lot of international students want to transition into becoming immigrants, so being physically present in Canada is very important to them. And some students do need access to in-person resources to carry out their work. For everyone else, I don't see much reason to go through the hurdles and the expenses if their course load for the next two semesters is slated to be fully online. 

[grantpalin]

Now that I've concluded my rental search for a 1-bed, this is what I've noticed:

 

 

Tons of secondary suites on the market. Hard to tell whether prices are down on average since you see all sorts of things, but units with 2+ beds seem to be going cheaper than usual - surely because these usually go by the room and with the lack of international students they're taking a hit. The bottom of the market seems to be about $650-700 per room. 

 

Also lots of AirBnB-oriented units going long term. Lost count of how many downtown studios and small 1-beds are available. They seemed to be generally on the higher end (e.g. Jukebox, Union) so they aren't particularly cheap, say $1500-1600 for 400-500 sqft. But that reflects how much more revenue they generate as AirBnBs, which is why there are also quite a few real estate listings for these units.

 

Prices for purpose-built rentals seem to have dropped a bit but not by much - maybe a year's worth of rollback. Overall (including parking + storage + laundry fees) you're still looking at $1400-1500 for old stock and $1600-1800 for a newer/reno'd one. As the WIP stock comes online maybe it'll get a bit better for renters.

 

Some price drops in condos too, maybe a bit moreso in the higher end of the market. I personally went with a newly built condo in a great location, financially it's comparable to a newer purpose-built rental after accounting for the extras and amenities. You're maybe looking at 1300-1500 for older woodframe condos, and 1700-2000 for newer and/or concrete condos. I've seen some decent deals, though they go fast. 

 

Speaking of going fast, the rental market is still very competitive. Landlords pretending COVID never happened and charging ever-increasing rents seem to not be moving their units, but stuff priced maybe 5-7% less than pre-COVID times is still going fast. I didn't get a response in about 1/3 of my inquiries despite generally responding to ads within hours of them showing up. Given vacancy rates were extremely low pre-COVID, this makes sense - and no doubt some tenants are trying to get out of bad deals from the last year or two they felt compelled to take.

 

I was kinda shocked at the number of dual income households competing for 550-700 sqft units even when they weren't particularly well priced. I'd speculate it's because tenant's future income expectations override the price drop from COVID circumstances, coupled with Victoria having stickier rents from retirees and government workers. I ended up going with a moderately sized 1-bed in part because I failed at every + den I applied for, but succeeding at 1-beds.

 

 

I don't expect the long-term rental market to bottom out until the fiscal reckoning from the COVID bailouts come to fore, where I'd imagine you will see some real disparity across neighborhoods and type of stock - the weak CDN and apparent stability should prop up the AirBnB and secondary suite stock back up for the most part, but the big cuts that will have to be made will affect most of the market in a bad way. And I'm saying this without accounting for whatever the second COVID wave will look like, there's a chance no one will have time to worry about rents or vacancy rates by October.

I look at the rental offerings from time to time just to see what's happening on the market. Each time I come away grateful for the good value, bang for the buck rental setup I've currently got.

[Matt R.]

That's interesting to hear. A lot of international students want to transition into becoming immigrants, so being physically present in Canada is very important to them. And some students do need access to in-person resources to carry out their work. For everyone else, I don't see much reason to go through the hurdles and the expenses if their course load for the next two semesters is slated to be fully online.

Yup, we scuttled a purchase and stopped looking once we realized the kid was not needing to live in Victoria in the fall, it’ll wait. She’s keen to move back to Victoria and get going on life, but it’s not the same as it was in terms of entertainment and social options so no big harm in waiting.

Matt.

[Casual Kev]

I look at the rental offerings from time to time just to see what's happening on the market. Each time I come away grateful for the good value, bang for the buck rental setup I've currently got.

 

You could certainly take a shot at a secondary suite or an older rental in the low-1000s, but most of the stuff I saw was get-what-you-pay-for. The few that were actual deals were scooped up very quickly, only got a response at all for those maybe half the time and as a single bloke I stand no chance versus DINKs - who seemed to be the majority of the competition.

[Redd42]

 as a single bloke I stand no chance versus DINKs - who seemed to be the majority of the competition.

 

This makes no sense. I choose the single person over the couples. The current tenant in the suite I help rent is a single guy.

[spanky123]

You could certainly take a shot at a secondary suite or an older rental in the low-1000s, but most of the stuff I saw was get-what-you-pay-for. The few that were actual deals were scooped up very quickly, only got a response at all for those maybe half the time and as a single bloke I stand no chance versus DINKs - who seemed to be the majority of the competition.

 

Every once in a while a lottery ticket comes up (ie older person wanting to rent out a suite for security or company. ) so it pays to check around every once in a while.