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Panhandlers, tacky shops cost Empress a conference


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#21 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 12:47 PM

Coincidentally most of my friends from high school are now "graffers." They're not taggers, but "graffers" who run with crews full of some of the most talented artists I've ever met.

If you study graffiti created by real graffiti artists, it oftentimes has a message that is not obvious to passersbys. And quite frankly neither is the message aimed at average joes, either. To understand graf you have to take the time to acknowledge its presence and let the illegality of the art form slide. Getting upset because a piece has gone up won't allow you to appreciate what someone has created hence the huge opposition by some individuals.

Btw, it can take days to create one peace of graffiti. It's a very laborious process even with three or four guys working on one piece.

One of Victoria's most talented artists, who went by the name of "Ghost," passed away several years ago but his talents were at-par with some of the worlds best. He was very troubled by the events that had taken place in his life and through his art he expressed himself -- a perfect example of what graffiti has the potential to be. It's too bad most saw him as a criminal rather than an artist with an unbelievable gift.


...what a bunch of drivel.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#22 Mike K.

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 01:06 PM

:smt012

I'm not talking about kids painting their "tags" in bubble letters -- I'm talking about drawings with spray cans. It's an urban form of expression that I'm assuming you don't care for. Believe me, it's a much more pleasant urban phenomenon then what local clubs and pubs scatter into the streets at 2AM every morning.

One thing I personally disagree with is defacing prominent sections of property. Back alleys and rear courtyards used for loading docks are perfectly suited for graffiti as it doesn't bother individuals. Graffiti on storefronts or highly visible walls can be a visual eyesore but the latter isn't a big problem in Victoria (albeit some think it is).






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#23 Holden West

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 01:45 PM

For every decent graf on an unsightly wall there's a hundred fugly tags on nice facades. Ah, well--everyone's a critic.

Breaking news straight from the horses mouth! Roger Soane and others sound off on panhandlers on CBC radio.

Latest Interviews

August 21
A lead hotelier in Victoria claims he lost a major U.S. conference because of aggressive pandhandlers in downtown Victoria. He says for the problem to improve, there needs to be political will. We put that challenge to two politicians: a city MLA and a member of city council.
Listen to the interview (runs 7:15)

We hear the panhandlers side in the controversy over panhandling in Victoria.
Listen to the interview (runs 4:35)

August 18
We hear from Roger Soane, the General Manager of the Fairmont Empress who says he's lost a major conference because of the pandhandlers in downtown Victoria.
Listen to the interview

http://www.cbc.ca/on...interviews.html

(RealAudio)
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#24 aastra

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 02:15 PM

If you come to Victoria expecting a fairyland getaway, you will definitely be disappointed and even shocked by the reality of the place. Constant sirens, panhandlers, street people, graffiti, drugs, brutal crime (that fatal stabbing at Central High and that Cook Street rapist come to mind)....

It's a real city. It's also an equal opportunity city, re: mayhem. You can vandalize any property anywhere, in just about any part of town. You can loiter anywhere, even on neighbourhood streets. Most cities have riff-raff free zones, Victoria doesn't.

In many other cities, the guys doing the spraypainting near Government House would have had the cops on them just because they dared to go for a walk in that neighbourhood.

#25 aastra

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 02:17 PM

I lived in Victoria between 1997 and 2001. The changes since are not something that anyone in your city government should be proud of.


Fact is, Victoria hasn't changed at all in that time. If he wasn't aware of the city's uglier sides, he simply wasn't paying attention.

#26 Mike K.

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 02:19 PM

...but unfortunately the fugly tags get grouped in with the decent graf on unsightly walls. And that's too bad.

Graffiti in the artful sense isn't very visible in Victoria. Tags are, but tags require absolutely no skill or brains to produce and have no cultural value. They're a pest that gives real artists a poor rep.

But I suppose that's the reality with most anything.

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#27 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 02:30 PM

Spray painting on someones walls without asking isn't very nice.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#28 Baro

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 03:30 PM

Why don't more empty ugly bare walls just ask a couple decent artists if they want to have go at it. Heck, a lot of the walls in the city could have a rotating quarerly showcase where artists do murals and such.

There's many aritsts out there who'd do it all, for free. So why isn't every square inch of ugly wall in the city covered in everything from happy colourful murals of prancing unicorns, to angsty "graff" that at least looks well done?
"beats greezy have baked donut-dough"

#29 Mike K.

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 05:37 PM

For two decades the walls along the tracks in Esquimalt were an overlooked graffiti zone until the muni clamped down last month. There were several areas in the downtown core (the only one left now I think is on that bakery on Quadra across from Nelson's Music) that had such walls where the owners didn't mind because the graf coloured an otherwise bland ediface. Now the City of Victoria says that if owners don't clean up ALL graffiti on their property AS SOON as it appears, the City will do it for the owner and then send them a bill. Thank the tourism moguls for that because small town tourists fear graffiti as a sign of gangs and crime.

I'm not sure what they deal is with the bakery as new graf pokes up there all the time -- and its very well done (the current piece is a neat tribute to George W, actually). Nobody touches it so my guess is the city allows it to stay because of the political messages that tend to go up there(?).

Two other walls with owner-sponsored graf include the one along the cement plant on Bay and in the alley beside Odeon. The painters were given free reign so long as it was themed along the lines of the owners business(s). For the most part the walls work -- i.e. "taggers" don't touch them because they don't dare leave their mark on something of high quality and by respected artists, and other legit graffiti painters don't touch them because the pieces are of high quality and are there for a reason.

Society chooses to pay for abstract art like Baden's pieces but through acts of irony clamps down on property owners who allow their properties to be used as ever-changing canvasses.

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#30 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 06:17 PM

^ What's wrong with George Bush?

the current piece is a neat tribute to George W, actually

Over 50% of US voters voted him in. More votes than all the other presidential candidates combined. I'm a big fan.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#31 G-Man

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Posted 21 August 2006 - 06:37 PM

Are you serious?

My sarcasm meter is broken and George Bush could be the World's dumbest leader ever. I put him at slightly less intelligent than Mussolini and about as politically adept as Idi Amin.

Visit my blog at: https://www.sidewalkingvictoria.com 

 

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#32 Holden West

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Posted 22 August 2006 - 07:15 AM

Most historians believe George W. Bush is a better president than Warren G. Harding was.


Panhandlers have rights

Times Colonist
Published: Tuesday, August 22, 2006

Do we need to get rid of the panhandlers just like we get rid of the homeless, the poor, the sex-trade workers, the drug addicts and generally the undesirables?

They have the right to be on these streets as much as we do. When will this kowtowing to tourists and Victoria's middle class end? When did Victoria become such a "cash-grab" city?

Maybe it's not the undesirables that are keeping the tourists away. My friends from Montreal say, "Victoria is boring and is in need of more culture." Don't blame all of Victoria's problems on the street people.

We should feel ashamed of the way we treat our community members.

Lisa St. Pierre,

Victoria.
© Times Colonist (Victoria) 2006
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#33 G-Man

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Posted 22 August 2006 - 07:41 AM

Good One! I completely agree with 92% of that. Except that Victoria is boring. I find the city pretty exciting but again most people are pretty lame in their ability to search out fun events in the city.

Visit my blog at: https://www.sidewalkingvictoria.com 

 

It has a whole new look!

 


#34 Baro

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Posted 22 August 2006 - 10:28 AM

The fun is out there, but all the tourist marketing seems designed to make victoria look like nothing more than a few touristy museums and buchart gardens, that's it. They get off the coho or the bus and all they see is the main tourist strip, and the bus trip out to that boring old quarry. No one markets or tells them about anything interesting, in fact they supress it as it would scare away the tourists, or so they say.
"beats greezy have baked donut-dough"

#35 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 12:00 PM

Some type of a meeting took place this morning, and will again happen tonight at 6PM at the church on Quadra and Mason (enter basement off the Mason St. steps).

Some type of homeless action plan or streetlink thingy being discussed...
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#36 G-Man

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 12:06 PM

A new temporary shelter at St John The Divine Church. To be used from now until November when it becomes the Winter youth Shelter (As it always has been).

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#37 aastra

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 02:25 PM

They need to put these shelters and services in places other than downtown.

#38 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 02:28 PM

^ Or in another town...

(PM me for the delivery address for my CFAX Citation Rose)
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#39 aastra

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Posted 23 August 2006 - 02:40 PM

Sure, that's what I meant. Other towns, like Oak Bay or Esquimalt or Sidney or View Royal...

#40 Mike K.

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Posted 24 August 2006 - 08:51 AM

Saanich? The biggest muni does nothing, absolutely nothing to aid in the region's social problems.

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