777 replies to this topic

[Sparky]

Looking nice Sparky, can't wait to see it when it is all done

We have come a long way since you were out to have a look. To be honest, it has been a bit of a grunt.

I look forward to seeing you at the reveal.

[Sparky]

^^^^ waaay too funny. What if I had a prostate issue?

[Bob Fugger]

The middle tank supplies the hot water heat for the floor radiation, the bigger tank is for domestic hot water and it is also pre-heated by the smaller tank in order to negate the need to heat from a 50 degree well temperature.

So those two tanks are your holding tanks? Given that they don't look like anything more than run-of-the-mill electric hot water tanks, there must be a hell of a lot of heat loss coming off of those.

It seems odd to go to the trouble of installing a super-efficient geothermal heating system, only to have a massive efficiency (i.e., heat loss) gap? Have you thought about buying them some super stylish jackets?

[VicHockeyFan]

^ If those tanks live within a heated area of the home, what's the difference? If your hot water tank bleeds off heat that then warms the home, then there is no energy loss.

[Sparky]

^ ^^ Actually you are both correct. They are run of the mill water tanks, and they are well insulated inside the metal casing. The tall one is the domestic hot water with regular electrical elements in them. The difference is that the water entering the tank is already at 100 F, so it does not take much to heat it to 120 F.

You are keen VHF, as this mechanical room is only accessed from the exterior and is also used as the source for make up air. There is a rule in the building code that the make up air requires a heater unless it comes from an unoccupied area as opposed to the outdoors.

When the hood fan and bathroom fans are on, there is a duct that feeds from the mechanical room into the rear hallway making up the air that is exhausted.

[sebberry]

Sparky, now that the weather is cooling down how's the heating system working out?

Or is sthere still enough sun warming you guys up through those windows like tomato plants?

[Sparky]

^ Thanks for asking Seb. We are just now getting to feel the benefits of the in-floor radiant heating, along with the geothermal heat pump.

The radiant heating in the concrete slab creates a large heat sink which keeps the heat quite constant. One does not turn the heat down at night or when the house is not occupied. This takes a little getting used to. You basically turn the thermostat to the desired level in each room in the fall and then turn them off in the late spring, so the house is warm when you get up in the morning and when you get home after being away.

If the power goes out (which it did the other day when some goof took out a power pole with his truck) the stored heat in the concrete slab keeps the house warm for a long time, probably longer than 24 hours. That's kinda nice.

The other advantage is that the heat pump operates on electricity, which in my mind is a renewable and environmentally friendly resource which is usually always available so you do not have to worry about running out of oil. It is a little early yet to make comparisons regarding the operating costs, but it should be in the neighborhood of 50% of most other heating methods.

You are correct regarding the passive solar effect with having lots of windows. I wasn't sure that the thermopane windows would allow much heat to pass through but it does. On a cold sunny day, it is amazing how much warmer it feels as compared to the evenings. Maybe some of that is psychological.

All in all I think it was worth the effort. I will keep you updated once we get a few hydro bills under our belt.

[sebberry]

So, Sparky, what's the verdict on all those red tubes now that the winter is done with?

[Sparky]

So, Sparky, what's the verdict on all those red tubes now that the winter is done with?

For those of you wondering what Sebberry is referring to, we installed a ground source (geothermal) heating system in a new house with in floor heating (concrete floor) last July. For comparison purposes, our previous house was heated with an oil fired furnace with carpeted flooring.
The apparent cost savings in monthly energy bills appears substantial (perhaps as much as 40% compared to oil) but there are a number of beneficial factors that we were unaware of.
· Electricity rates appear to be much more stable than oil, increases do not happen overnight depending on world affairs.
· The house is continually at room temperature, no cold mornings or when you return from a weekend away.
· Individual room temperature settings. (bedroom always cooler than living area)
· In the event of a power outage it takes a day or two to lose residual heat.
· Noise free outside (unlike external air heat pumps)
· Works well in sub zero temperatures. (no electric backup required)
· Dust free environment, (as long as you mop the floor from time to time) air quality is noticeably higher.
· No carbon footprint. Environmentally responsible.

The downside is the original cost is much higher than a forced air system ($35,000) but it would appear that the system is relatively maintenance free (no chimney, filters, fans, .........and best of all .......no oil man.)

[Baro]

Trying to take into account all costs and savings, how long do you think such a system would take to "pay" for its self in energy savings and upkeep savings?

[Sparky]

Trying to take into account all costs and savings, how long do you think such a system would take to "pay" for its self in energy savings and upkeep savings?

This site says ROI is between 2-10 years but I think that is a bit low for Victoria's climate. Perhaps back east or up north this calculation may be more accurate.

Some basic facts........http://www.wapa.gov/...ctsheet/GHP.pdf

[LJ]

Is it a one story house on a slab or do you have soft-crete or similar on the upper floors?

Did you not require a heat recovery ventilation system?

[Sparky]

^ LJ it is a single story slab on grade. The heat recovery systems are no longer required if you put a bathroom fan on a programmable timer.

[LJ]

^Thanks Sparky, I didn't realize that the bath fan option now meets the requirements. Good to know, as we plan to build again in the near future I am going over the different HVAC options.

[gumgum]

Short video on compressed air cars and eventual perpetual motion?

[gumgum]

'Major discovery' from MIT primed to unleash solar revolution

In a revolutionary leap that could transform solar power from a marginal, boutique alternative into a mainstream energy source, MIT researchers have overcome a major barrier to large-scale solar power: storing energy for use when the sun doesn't shine.

Until now, solar power has been a daytime-only energy source, because storing extra solar energy for later use is prohibitively expensive and grossly inefficient. With today's announcement, MIT researchers have hit upon a simple, inexpensive, highly efficient process for storing solar energy.

Requiring nothing but abundant, non-toxic natural materials, this discovery could unlock the most potent, carbon-free energy source of all: the sun. "This is the nirvana of what we've been talking about for years," said MIT's Daniel Nocera, the Henry Dreyfus Professor of Energy at MIT and senior author of a paper describing the work in the July 31 issue of Science. "Solar power has always been a limited, far-off solution. Now we can seriously think about solar power as unlimited and soon."[...]

[Nparker]

'Major discovery' from MIT primed to unleash solar revolution

Now watch big oil spend millions to bring this "revolution" to its knees.

[sebberry]

If you really want to solve our energy crisis, thorium is the key.

[jklymak]

Any update on that? That article is 4 years old...

[gumgum]

Good question. Hadn't noticed how old it was.