Jump to content

      



























Photo

Lynn Hunter l Victoria l Council


  • Please log in to reply
45 replies to this topic

#21 Rob Randall

Rob Randall
  • Member
  • 16,310 posts

Posted 15 November 2008 - 12:02 AM

^I think it's incorrect to say she is stupid. From what I have heard she is a bright person. It's true she appeared not to understand basic Bonus Density issues at one of the all candidates debates but she's got a good team of people around her that will get her up to speed on municipal issues.

#22 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 03:57 PM

Today Victoria council was officially sworn in - and Lynn Hunter made the news (CFAX) for being the only elected member who refused to pledge her allegiance to the Queen.

#23 Chris J

Chris J
  • Member
  • 215 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 05:25 PM

Good on Lynn Hunter. Anachronistic is right. You wanna talk about people getting fat off our tax dollars...Time to pull the plug on the royals.

#24 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 05:59 PM

Good on Lynn Hunter. Anachronistic is right. You wanna talk about people getting fat off our tax dollars...Time to pull the plug on the royals.


Colour me olde fashioned - but I like tradition - and making such a pledge is really just a basic form of respect/decorum in my opinion.

#25 Caramia

Caramia
  • Member
  • 3,835 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 06:27 PM

At this point in history our Governor General is sure going to earn her keep. Interesting when you look at the people who serve as the queens representatives here - we have a black Hatian-Canadian lady at the top, and a Native Canadian here in BC. The position may be mostly symbolic, but it is interesting to notice what symbols are chosen.
Nowadays most people die of a sort of creeping common sense, and discover when it is too late that the only things one never regrets are one's mistakes.
Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900), The Picture of Dorian Gray, 1891

#26 Chris J

Chris J
  • Member
  • 215 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 06:36 PM

Just because it is traditional doesn't make it right in my books.
I have issues with a lot of these kinds of institutions, and what they represent. I'm not going to bow and pledge alliance to people who represent the idea of some people having the divine right to rule over others. Do we like democracy here or not? Those people have no authority over me. If you choose to respect that tradition, fine, but don't force it on everyone else.
It's like this whole Christmas thing. We live in a diverse society, but we still have this Christmas thing rammed down our throats as if it were the only religious holiday of the season.

#27 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 07:29 PM

[quote name='Chris J'][quote]I'm not going to bow and pledge alliance to people who represent the idea of some people having the divine right to rule over others. If you choose to respect that tradition, fine, but don't force it on everyone else[/quote]

Well, just like no one is forcing you to do that - no one forced Lynn Hunter to do it today either. AND you also might want to read Caramia's post a little more closely.

[quote]It's like this whole Christmas thing. We live in a diverse society, but we still have this Christmas thing rammed down our throats as if it were the only religious holiday of the season[/quote]

Well, so much for sugar plums and fairies and prancing reindeer. Sorry you wont get to see them yourself.

Hope you have a Merry Christmas anyway Chirs. (But I'm not forcing you.)

#28 Chris J

Chris J
  • Member
  • 215 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 08:20 PM

I'm not implying that you're doing the forcing. Sorry, I'm still learning to control my ton here.
And it's good that Lynn Hunter was able to make that choice. At least there's that.
What did I miss in Caramia's post; that native people and black women are chosen to represent the queen (which is supposed to make us feel like the royals are a 21st century kind of equal rights group?)
Or was it in reference to the symbolism? Yes, I understand it's a symbolic thing, but it symbolizes power over others, and that power was not earned. The GG and LG may have earned respect from their work before the position, but I won't respect them FOR the position, symbolic or not.
And you have a nice holiday season, celebrating it in whichever way you choose.

#29 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 09:29 PM

quote=Chris J;91932]What did I miss in Caramia's post; that native people and black women are chosen to represent the queen (which is supposed to make us feel like the royals are a 21st century kind of equal rights group?)


No, that we live in a great country that values diversity. Your thing about power is another thing altogether.

And it's good that Lynn Hunter was able to make that choice. At least there's that


I find it ironic that two NDP politicians have refused recent opportunities to pay respect to the symbols of our country.

In June, Denise Savoie refused to sing 'O Canada' at the official opening of our Tall Ships festival at the Inner Harbour - and again stood silent (while all the other dignitaries and audience sang our anthem) at a ceremony in Fernwood to open the Community Well. Then, today, all the newly elected council pled their allegiance to the Queen except Lynn Hunter.

I think singing our anthem together is one of the good things we can do as a community. Only takes a few minutes too.

#30 Ms. B. Havin

Ms. B. Havin
  • Member
  • 5,052 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 09:52 PM

I'm not implying that you're doing the forcing. Sorry, I'm still learning to control my ton here.
And it's good that Lynn Hunter was able to make that choice. At least there's that.
What did I miss in Caramia's post; that native people and black women are chosen to represent the queen (which is supposed to make us feel like the royals are a 21st century kind of equal rights group?)
Or was it in reference to the symbolism? Yes, I understand it's a symbolic thing, but it symbolizes power over others, and that power was not earned. The GG and LG may have earned respect from their work before the position, but I won't respect them FOR the position, symbolic or not.
And you have a nice holiday season, celebrating it in whichever way you choose.


For the record, I agree with Chris J. here.

This bit...

In June MP Denise Savoie refused to sing 'O Canada' at the official opening of our Tall Ships festival at the Inner Harbour. She again stood silent (while all the other dignitariesé and audience sang our anthem) at an official ceremony in Fernwood to open the Community Well.

... is news to me, though - and that's in a completely different ballpark than refusing to pledge whatever to an anachronistic monarchic system (royalty). Whatever was she thinking? She's the elected Member of Parliament of Canada, so what gives with not singing the national anthem?
When you buy a game, you buy the rules. Play happens in the space between the rules.

#31 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 10:02 PM

For the record, I agree with Chris J. here.

This bit...

... is news to me, though - and that's in a completely different ballpark than refusing to pledge whatever to an anachronistic monarchic system (royalty). Whatever was she thinking? She's the elected Member of Parliament of Canada, so what gives with not singing the national anthem?


RE the pledge to the queen: We are all free to chose about that. Its just my opinion. I grew up in a military family so was surrounded by pomp and circumstance. As such I was raised to value, and still do, the Queen thing, flag thing, and heads of state formality thing. I guess I sound like a dork.

RE singing national anthem: I was at both ceremonies and was suprised as well.

#32 ted - 3 - dots

ted - 3 - dots

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 187 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 10:10 PM

( clip - clip ) ted... sorry

As elected representatives and recipients of taxpayer checks - I don't get their refusal to participate. In my view, it shows disrespect for their country and constituents, which gave them the opportunity to enjoy a place of influence and power.

I think singing our anthem together is one of the good things we can do as a community. Only takes a few minutes too.



--------- Traditions...? -------------

They used to horse-whip people for NOT fallowing "The Traditions" ...!

when did they stop that ....? obviously ,
if they don't beat enough people at the right moment , the "traditions" will fail ...!

Actually , the public beatings helped to keep people RESECTFUL of the traditions ...
( so why would they stop ...? ) it's so disrespectful of the "OLD-WAYS"


ted...

Ps, didn't they change a few word's in our National-Anthem a few years ago ...?

not mention the new maple-leaf flag that we got ....!!!!!!!!!!!
( what's wrong with the old Tradition-Flag ...? )


;{-

.
.
.
spare the whip , and you spoil the subject's...!

( probably , there was a "reason" , for staging the Horse-Whipping's in the city square...!
obviously , we've lost that kind of "reasoning", when we gave up the jolly-old tradition ...! )

.

#33 Rob Randall

Rob Randall
  • Member
  • 16,310 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 10:34 PM

It is kind of odd--not pledging allegiance to the Queen. I know it's a silly anachronism but it's such an innocuous thing to get your knickers in a knot over. The topic came up tonight at an event I was attending and one woman agreed that she wouldn't pledge allegiance to the Queen--now Prince William on the other hand...

I remember last month Hunter refusing the hand-held mic at the All Candidates Meeting, instead requesting the podium before she spoke. If you put the two incidents together maybe Hunter's gearing up for a royal coup?

#34 Caramia

Caramia
  • Member
  • 3,835 posts

Posted 02 December 2008 - 10:46 PM

Some people just feel more confident speaking with a podium in front of them. /shrug
Nowadays most people die of a sort of creeping common sense, and discover when it is too late that the only things one never regrets are one's mistakes.
Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900), The Picture of Dorian Gray, 1891

#35 Holden West

Holden West

    Va va voom!

  • Member
  • 9,058 posts

Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:25 AM

JIM HUME - Talk Politics
For Lynn Hunter, a new watch; and likely a new lament


Jim Hume
Times - Colonist
Oct 12, 1995

IF TIMING IS EVERYTHING in politics, Lynn Hunter should get a new watch.

Having remained silent through the tumultuous weeks and months when Victoria Blencoe was braving incredible pressure from charges of sexual harassment made against her husband Robin, the caring former NDP member of Parliament Ms Hunter steered well clear of the Blencoes, unwilling to extend genuine sympathy lest it be mistaken for something else.

Then, just a few days ago, feeling the urge to get back into politics and with her eye firmly fixed on Blencoe's seat in Victoria-Beacon Hill, Ms Hunter opined that even as she considered seeking the nomination she felt a twinge of sorrow and pity for Mrs. Blencoe. Ah, such warmth in the milk of human kindness. Unfortunately for Hunter, fortunately for the rest of us, Victoria Blencoe is not the fading violet type. She is a woman of the '90s, a woman of some stature in the mental discipline sense, a woman of a quality Hunter may yet aspire to be. Her reaction to Hunter's sympathy was "where was she when I needed her?", a response tantamount to telling the former MP what to do with her less than credible pity for a completely innocent victim in a shoddy NDP soap opera.

Empty emotions spilling from the lips of politicians are not new. Politicians, like the chameleon, can change their colors to suit any occasion.

Some, like the intrepid but hardly believable Hunter, actually believe their easily adapted publicly displayed emotions fool the public. Who can forget the Hunter tears of 1993 when, to her utter amazement, the people of her Saanich-Gulf Islands constituency told her in no uncertain terms to get lost, that she had not been as impressive an MP as she thought she had. As the Times Colonist reported on the evening of that unsurprising day (for everybody except Hunter): "Trembling and on the brink of tears she (Hunter) said in a brief interview: 'I think the world is a nastier place tonight and I really fear for my country. I think my country has gone from the frying pan into the fire ... ' "

But Hunter's recovered now, feels belatedly, maybe even tearfully, more sorrow for Victoria Blencoe than Victoria feels for herself, and she's ready to offer herself again for public service. If she gets the nomination she seeks, she'll be running cheek-by-jowl with her close friend Gretchen Brewin who holds, for now, Victoria-Hillside. Robin Blencoe, for whom Ms Hunter expresses no sympathy at all despite his expulsion from the NDP caucus before any charge against him was (or has been) proven, could spoil what she hopes will be her home-coming.

Blencoe would still like to run as a New Democrat in the next election but knows he can't because Premier Mike Harcourt would never sign his nomination papers. Without that precious piece of paper, Blencoe's constituency executive finds itself in a bind.

It, too, thinks Blencoe could hold the seat. Not because the people have already absolved him from the allegations against him but rather because of the uneasy feeling that sentencing people before their trial is not the Canadian way. In the end it will do as it is told by those who run the premier and the party.

I do not share the view that Blencoe could win if he ran NDP. I think the MLA has been so tainted by the allegations and the harsh and improper response of the premier, that he will never recover in the Greater Victoria arena as a New Democrat or as an Independent - which he will have to become if he wishes to run at all.

Nor do I think Hunter, trying to find a soft berth after her federal rejection, could hold Victoria- Beacon Hill for the NDP; and with Blencoe running as an Independent Socialist (shades of Tom Uphill) her defeat would be beyond doubt.

So I suspect would be the defeat of next door neighbor Brewin as Blencoe support spilled into her backyard. All of which leads me to opine that I hope Hunter (a) decides not to run or (b) loses the nomination. I don't think I could stand another night of defeated tears and another verse in the lament that because of her rejection British Columbia would automatically become a nastier place to live.
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#36 Sue Woods

Sue Woods
  • Member
  • 621 posts

Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:44 AM

Some people just feel more confident speaking with a podium in front of them. /shrug


To back Rob up here - during this recent municipal campaign Lynn Hunter created an impression that she was above the rest of us (commoners) by refusing to share a hand held mic, and comments she made about certain people needing a shower.

In a sentence she took a rather regal stance throughout...which makes her refusal to pledge allegiance to the Queen today open up a level of skepticism about her motivation. It was afterall an official 'ceremonial event' for the city and its residents (complete with all the formal trappings used over the past 150 years to welcome a new Council and Mayor) - hardly a day for personal grandstanding by a civic politician.

#37 ted - 3 - dots

ted - 3 - dots

    Banned

  • Banned
  • 187 posts

Posted 03 December 2008 - 12:55 AM

( snip - clip ) sorry


If you put the two incidents together maybe Hunter's gearing up for a royal coup?



------- per-hap's , in 2067 ...? ----------------

we'll get ANOTHER national reAFfirmation of that reality ... ( like we had in 1967 )

I prefer to look at our Flag on a daily base's ,
but then again why should I bother when people like Judge-Ross is more capable
of reminding us , that " We are NOT amused about being British subjects " ...!


NOT AMUSED to the point of becoming an "independent" of British-rule ....


---- sorry for the history lesson -----


but again , Briton used to Horse-Whip people in the public square ,
for NOT fallowing the traditions ...



---------- "knickers in a knot" , you say ...? -----------

in Canada , we have nylon-stocking's ....!

( and , to me , it's another big difference )

shearly & clearly ....!!!!!

:{-


.
.
.

------- ( the difference ) --------

perhaps it all boils down to "razor-stubble" and one's ablity to cover it up ,
that makes us Canadian's , and not British-Subjects .


but I'm still going with the REJECTION of the "traditional" ceremonies ,
( that remind of my dog pee-ing on a tree , to mark his territory ...! )

Ceremonies that only serve to REINFORCE the notion that "birth-right" is not wrong ....!

( it can't be )

other-wise Anarchy will rain





.

#38 Jacques Cadé

Jacques Cadé
  • Member
  • 932 posts

Posted 03 December 2008 - 10:16 AM

Another thing I was wondering about: by refusing to pledge allegiance to the Queen, was Hunter really refusing to pledge allegiance to the law?

I'm no constitutional expert, but as I understand it, all institutions of government in Canada – and hence, all the laws they pass – still operate under the authority of the British sovereign.

I'm sure alternatives to Royal allegiance oaths have been created for republicans and Quebeckers. But I didn't hear any alternative oath sworn by Hunter yesterday at City Hall.

#39 Bernard

Bernard
  • Member
  • 5,056 posts
  • LocationVictoria BC

Posted 03 December 2008 - 10:48 AM

There are mechanisms in place for people that will not or can not swear an oath of allegiance. There are options available.

In my case, because of my faith, I can not swear an oath for any reason. I am a Quaker and we do not do oaths because an oath assumes that is the only time you are being truthful and our faith has truthfulness at the core. We affirm instead of swearing.

#40 Jacques Cadé

Jacques Cadé
  • Member
  • 932 posts

Posted 03 December 2008 - 11:42 AM

We affirm instead of swearing.


There's too much swearing going on anyway.

Bernard, you're confirming what I meant to say: there's usually an alternative to the standard oath to tell the truth, to the Queen, etc. I didn't see one used at City Hall for Lynn Hunter.

You're not quite at the end of this discussion topic!

Use the page links at the lower-left to go to the next page to read additional posts.
 



0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users