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[Bicycles] Issues with bicycles and cyclists in Victoria


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#2021 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 06 July 2022 - 08:43 AM

In any event, the truck driver will be fine physically. Why the cyclist is not more aware is the issue here.

#2022 FogPub

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 12:34 AM

Last I checked, right turn on red is generally legal in BC; and the signed exceptions for crossing bike lanes are a departure from what drivers are used to.  I'm surprised this doesn't happen far more often.


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#2023 todd

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 07:18 AM

Bikes got to cross multiple intersections in a very short period of time on that stretch, lights and arrows pointing every which way


Edited by todd, 07 July 2022 - 07:19 AM.


#2024 Spy Black

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 08:45 AM

Last I checked, right turn on red is generally legal in BC; and the signed exceptions for crossing bike lanes are a departure from what drivers are used to.

Indeed ... but the "signed exceptions" are ... well ... the exceptions!

 

You gotta' use your eyes and your brain 100% of the time when you're driving ... no excuse in this case, 100% the truck drivers fault, he literally ran a red light and hit a cyclist.


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#2025 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 08:55 AM

The cyclist rode into the truck. Regardless of the truck drivers fault or behaviour, an aware cyclist would never have been in that situation.

#2026 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 04:05 PM

A B.C. cyclist has pocketed $261,000 in damages after getting struck by a driver who turned right on a bike-lane only green light.

James Rouse was biking home along his regular Vancouver commute route in February 2015 when he was hit by the driver of a vehicle and knocked to the ground. Rouse had been passing southbound through the Burrard Street intersection at Cornwall Avenue on a bike-only green light when driver Mary Lamarque turned right into him.

https://www.pqbnews....d-awarded-261k/

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 07 July 2022 - 04:05 PM.


#2027 todd

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Posted 07 July 2022 - 04:45 PM

The cyclist rode into the truck. Regardless of the truck drivers fault or behaviour, an aware cyclist would never have been in that situation.

Truck hadn’t started to turn at the time the cyclist first entered the intersection

cyclist should be focussing forward into the bike lanes by that point

Edited by todd, 07 July 2022 - 04:58 PM.


#2028 Spy Black

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 05:43 AM

The cyclist rode into the truck. Regardless of the truck drivers fault or behaviour, an aware cyclist would never have been in that situation.

I have no inherent sympathy for cyclists, but in this case you're simply wrong.

 

The cyclist was moving legally forward in his lane, concentrating on the road ahead of him, and the truck literally turned directly into the cyclist and hit him from the cyclists blindside.

 

Sure, the cyclist would have stopped if he'd seen the truck turning, to presume otherwise is ridiculous ... but the point is the cyclist didn't see the truck, and indeed was under no obligation to be looking for any vehicles turning in front of him ... as the cyclist along with a pedestrian and another cyclist were well into their "green light" to move forward, and were in fact moving forward as they were legally permitted to do.


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#2029 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 06:03 AM

I have no inherent sympathy for cyclists, but in this case you're simply wrong.

 

The cyclist was moving legally forward in his lane, concentrating on the road ahead of him, and the truck literally turned directly into the cyclist and hit him from the cyclists blindside.

 

Do you ride a bike?  You have to be constantly aware of cars turning that do not see you.  Coming past you on the left then turning right, turning off side streets as you cycle the main street, coming towards you and turning left in front of you across the road.  And watching for cars opening doors or pulling out of the curb lane.

 

You must be very aware.  

 

I don't care that he was "legally moving forward", he was still not enough aware.   You have to be 5x more aware at intersections and double that again at this crazy area.


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#2030 Sparky

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 06:33 AM

Spent a while observing the comings and goings at this intersection. In a word "Chaos"

 

As an example notice the group of cyclists waiting out past the curb blocking the north/south bike lane while the north/south bike lane light was in the yellow position.

 

Cars, trucks, bikes and pedestrians all going every which way. No place for the complacent. Noticed lots of cyclists not wearing helmets and lots with ear buds or headphones grooving to the music.

 

We walked across this intersection a few times in each direction. The only thing I can recommend is what we learned going to school. Stop..look...and listen.

 

Pandora and Wharf.jpg



#2031 Ismo07

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 07:23 AM

 Stop..look...and listen.

 

 

 

Kind of the mantra anytime you walk, drive or ride...  Accidents tend o happen when one or more folks are not paying attention or believe everything is the same everywhere.


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#2032 JohnsonStBridge

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 08:20 AM

The cyclist rode into the truck. Regardless of the truck drivers fault or behaviour, an aware cyclist would never have been in that situation.

 

This is totally incorrect. If you watch the video the moment the cyclist became aware of the truck it braked to avoid the truck that was turning into its path. The awareness of the cyclist prevented this from being a much worse accident that likely would have involved the cyclist being run over and getting caught up underneath the truck rather than bouncing off the truck's side/rear wheel. There was a complete lack of awareness demonstrated by the truck driver that chose to accelerate through a red light despite the intersection being surrounded by multiple cyclists and pedestrians waiting to cross. 


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#2033 Spy Black

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 09:25 AM

The cyclist rode into the truck. Regardless of the truck drivers fault or behaviour, an aware cyclist would never have been in that situation.

I'm afraid your posts mystify me sometimes. I can't tell if you're simply trying to stir the pot, or if you truly believe half the stuff you post?

 

The truck ran a red light and hit a cyclist who was legally moving forward ... it's no more complex than that.

 

That the intersection in question is a complete Sh_t-show is a given, and that as we move forward, the existence of the poorly designed bike lanes will very likely cause far more cycling injuries and deaths than did regular roadways that required cyclists to pay the same attention to everything as any car driver was obliged to do as well  ... and as inexperienced, and too-trusting cyclists venture into such poorly designed COV bike-lane mazes like the Pandora/Store/Wharf/Johnson intersection.


Edited by Spy Black, 08 July 2022 - 09:26 AM.


#2034 Nparker

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 10:13 AM

I'm afraid your posts mystify me sometimes. I can't tell if you're simply trying to stir the pot, or if you truly believe half the stuff you post?...

:thumbsup:


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#2035 Ismo07

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 10:35 AM

I'm afraid your posts mystify me sometimes. I can't tell if you're simply trying to stir the pot, or if you truly believe half the stuff you post?

 

The truck ran a red light and hit a cyclist who was legally moving forward ... it's no more complex than that.

 

That the intersection in question is a complete Sh_t-show is a given, and that as we move forward, the existence of the poorly designed bike lanes will very likely cause far more cycling injuries and deaths than did regular roadways that required cyclists to pay the same attention to everything as any car driver was obliged to do as well  ... and as inexperienced, and too-trusting cyclists venture into such poorly designed COV bike-lane mazes like the Pandora/Store/Wharf/Johnson intersection.

 

How many injuries and deaths along the bike lanes have you tallied up, more than there were in the past?  This was a simple driver who did not check for pedestrian or cycling traffic when making a right on a red.  It's one thing that he wasn't supposed turn right on a red but another not to check for others crossing...  This isn't about poor design but more about bad choices or not paying attention.  

 

Yes this area has a lot of light cycles and many ways to go, but it's hardly confusing really.  Follow the posted lights and signs...  


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#2036 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 11:32 AM

This isn't about poor design but more about bad choices or not paying attention.  

 

Exactly.  The cyclist was not paying attention.

 

Nor was the truck driver.



#2037 Daveyboy

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 01:36 PM

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#2038 Ismo07

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 02:10 PM

Exactly.  The cyclist was not paying attention.

 

Nor was the truck driver.

 

 

Usually when someone cuts off the other person, in any matter, we seldom blame the cuttee, usually the cutter...  Easy to say the biker should have just stopped in his tracks when he is not expecting to be cut off..  I appreciate people need to be aware but there are some limits.


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#2039 Mike K.

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Posted 08 July 2022 - 04:48 PM

It sounds like the cyclist was a woman. She’s in bad shape but not in a condition where he life is in jeopardy, according to an exchange on CFAX.

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#2040 Spy Black

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Posted 09 July 2022 - 06:15 AM

How many injuries and deaths along the bike lanes have you tallied up, more than there were in the past?  This was a simple driver who did not check for pedestrian or cycling traffic when making a right on a red.  It's one thing that he wasn't supposed turn right on a red but another not to check for others crossing...  This isn't about poor design but more about bad choices or not paying attention.  

Yes this area has a lot of light cycles and many ways to go, but it's hardly confusing really.  Follow the posted lights and signs...  

I'm going to disagree, and re-state that the intersection under discussion is an incredibly poor design, indeed I consider it on par with the McTavish Road - Highway Interchange out by the airport for a classic example of a traffic engineering failure.

 

Let's see over time if the bike lanes increase or decrease accidents ... I know for a fact that some of your COV fellow managers are equally concerned about the increase in the "perception" of bike lane safety (especially for inexperienced cyclists), when indeed no actual increase in safety for some city blocks has actually resulted from the new bike lanes (as they're not all fully separated from vehicle travel lanes, and often have multiple driveways running across them, not to mention the fact that parked cars frequently block views of vehicles making right hand turns across bike lanes, making it impossible to see oncoming bikes).

 

Note that I didn't state that the intersection at Wharf and Store was confusing to "me", as you have noted that it's not (in your opinion) confusing to you. I've lived here all my life, and pay pretty close attention to everything in the area, including changes to vehicle lanes and intersections. I also know what vehicle lanes look like a block or two further along, and in the the blocks to the east, west, north, and south of wherever I happen to be driving ... but for a new, inexperienced, or nervous driver or cyclist ... these are incredibly poor designs that inspire a feeling of safety and security for cyclists that simply doesn't exist, and potentially confuse drivers who may not be quite as up on these many major changes in the downtown core.

 

But to reiterate my earlier post, I do agree that the accident that inspired this particular conversation was 100% the fault of the driver of the truck, who simply ran a red light and hit somebody (in this case a cyclist rather than a pedestrian) who was moving forward on their own green light.


Edited by Spy Black, 09 July 2022 - 06:22 AM.


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