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[Marine] Victoria cruise ship industry | Breakwater District/Ogden Point | News / issues


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#2001 Sparky

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Posted 14 October 2019 - 05:24 PM

We just happened to be returning to Victoria from Port Angeles when I was catching up on this thread. Then this bad boy sailed by.

Can we at least keep the Coho?

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#2002 Stephen James

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Posted 15 October 2019 - 06:04 AM

On the one hand we all prayed for the port of Victoria's resurgence, but on the other hand we're now complaining that the resurgence (in the form of cruise ship business) is bad for the environment and needs to be curtailed; on the one hand we claimed (and still claim) that we want the city waterfront to have an industrial focus, but on the other hand we complain about noise and traffic and smells and how waterfront industrial operations (even very light ones, as compared to Victoria's past) don't jibe with the supposed interests of the community.

 

The hypocrisy and contradictions are endless. The neighbourhood groups claimed they wanted (or wanted to wait for) an industrial revival because they thought it would be a clever way to block waterfront residential development, since everybody knew Victoria would never be a booming port again and would never have booming waterfront commercial/industrial operations again. But people were wrong on both counts. What's the old lesson? Be careful what you (feign) to wish for?

 

It's the year 2019. I'd suggest it's long past time for the neighbourhood groups to drop their manipulative double-speak and start being forthright. They need to start saying what they mean and meaning what they say.

ok, let me be clear... I've been a boat owner for 15 years and it's not acceptable for me to leave my engine running, spewing diesel fumes, when I'm docked and it's not ok that cruise ships aren't connected to shore power either.


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#2003 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 15 October 2019 - 06:11 AM

maybe before they fill it with sewage bc hydro should sling a hydro line through that brand new harbour pipe from the electrical substation in esquimalt to james bay.   

 


Edited by Victoria Watcher, 15 October 2019 - 06:14 AM.

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#2004 Mike K.

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 07:57 AM

The GVHA, via the CEO, is saying they had tried to setup a meeting with the mayor to discuss emissions at the port and their approach to environmental issues, but that meeting never happened and then Helps raised the issue of shore power, etc. They wish they had had a chance to discuss their steps with the City.

The port says shore power is a plan, but “it’s not a simple case of flipping the switch.” They need to have support from BC Hydro to ensure there is enough power to support one, two or three ships. There are no timelines.

Site C to the rescue once again, right?

Cruise lines are telling GVHA that the mayor’s statements have already caused damage, and stakeholders dependent on the industry in Victoria are being told their financing could be in jeopardy as a result of the City’s sudden stance.

This is a conversation that just happened on CFAX with Ian Robertson and Al Farraby.
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#2005 Mike K.

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 08:41 AM

Robertson also said the impact of the cruise ships in our port is equivalent to 3,200 vehicles. What I didn’t catch was over what length of time. Robertson likened the impact to one hour’s worth of cars crossing the McKenzie intersection.

This is amounting to get another nothingburger like the 150 tonnes of waste dumped in Victoria, which equals 11 garbage trucks worth for refuse from 170,000 people over the span of a month.

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#2006 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:00 AM

i think in simple terms it's the equivalent of 3000 people living in tiny tiny tiny homes (cruise ship cabins) in our water for 4-8 hours.  although most turn off the cabin lights and leave the ship.  it probably is pretty small really.  


Edited by Victoria Watcher, 16 October 2019 - 09:01 AM.


#2007 aastra

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:18 AM

 

The GVHA, via the CEO, is saying they had tried to setup a meeting with the mayor to discuss emissions at the port and their approach to environmental issues, but that meeting never happened and then Helps raised the issue of shore power, etc. They wish they had had a chance to discuss their steps with the City.

The port says shore power is a plan, but “it’s not a simple case of flipping the switch.” They need to have support from BC Hydro to ensure there is enough power to support one, two or three ships. There are no timelines.

 

Most of that we already knew from the October 11 news item. But somehow this still ended up being depicted as a noble battle between self-proclaimed good and designated evil, when it should have been obvious to every thinking person that it was just another hollow political stunt.

 

Some more tidbits from the October 11 article for those who skipped it:

 

 

"Vancouver, Seattle and Juneau, Alaska, are ports on the West Coast that all have shore power and they’ve done it. But … they’ve collaborated with industry and what I’m not reading in the motion that the mayor has put forward is anything about collaboration and that’s disappointing to me."

 

 
Even with shore power outlets in place, Robertson said not all ships are capable of using them. "We estimate that about 48 per cent of the ships calling on Victoria have the capability to use shore power," he said.

 

from "Victoria mayor (and everybody else, obviously) wants cruise ships to plug into shore power" in the Times-Colonist...


Edited by aastra, 16 October 2019 - 09:19 AM.


#2008 Mike K.

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:23 AM

Tourism Victoria says two local businesses have approached them for assistance following calls from their lenders threatening to pull their loans as a result of potential disruption to their businesses (dependant on the cruise industry).

That’s ruthless. The City really pulled a fast one here and the impact is already being felt.

Why not take the meeting with the GVHA? They wanted to talk about all kinds of emissions-related successes and their plans. None of this drama should have happened.
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#2009 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:25 AM

i'm not sure i'm taking tourism victoria right at face value here if that's what they said.  you mean butchart gardens and wilson's have been put in some type of stress over a silly motion by the mayor?  i think it' might not be so serious.


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#2010 aastra

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:27 AM

Check this out:

 

 

Juneau considers proposal to offer more shore power to cruise ships
March 1, 2019
 

When cruise ships dock in Juneau, a few of them can connect to the city’s electric grid. That means less emissions and pollution downtown in the summer. It also generates money for Juneau’s hydroelectric utility that, in turn, benefits customers.

That’s why the City and Borough of Juneau wants to explore expanding port infrastructure to allow more ships to hook up.

Since 2001, Princess Cruises has been connecting to shore power at the Franklin Street dock during the summer cruise season.

"A lot of people don’t realize, this was the first place in the world (to offer shore power to cruise ships)," said Kirby Day, who works for Princess Cruises out of Juneau.
 

Day estimates that Princess pays Alaska Electric Light & Power about $1 million each summer for shore power. The money acts as a rebate for Juneau customers, who then receive a discount on their monthly energy bills.

 

Today, ports around the world offer electric hookups for cruise ships. But Juneau still only has one dock capable of supplying power.

That’s why the Juneau Commission on Sustainability submitted a proposal this year for the city to explore expanding that infrastructure. It suggests using $250,000 in revenue from Juneau’s marine passenger fee. That’s the $5 head tax cruise passengers pay when they visit Juneau.

While there are obvious benefits to shore power, it’s not a simple proposal.

For one thing, building the infrastructure is expensive, and the cruise season only lasts about four months.

A feasibility study from 2016 estimated building a new facility to provide shore power from just one additional dock would cost $12.9 million.

 

 

from https://www.alaskapublic.org

 

*****

 

The Port of Seattle says:

 

 

The Port provides clean shore power at two cruise berths at Terminal 91, the first homeport in the world to do so, and is exploring opportunities to further expand shore power.

 

from https://www.portseattle.org

 

*****

 

The Port of Vancouver says:

 

 

In 2009, the Canada Place cruise ship terminal became the first in Canada and third in the world to offer shore power for cruise ships. Shore power allows cruise ships to plug into the land-based electrical power grid and shut off their diesel generators, thereby reducing noise and emissions.

Canada Place currently has three shore power connection points. The number of cruise ships connecting to shore power has been increasing over the past five years, reducing potential greenhouse gases.

Although it seems straightforward, shore power is not a plug-and-play or one-size-fits-all system. In fact, there are a number of conditions that affect whether a ship can plug in, including configuration of the land-based shore power equipment, the location and limitations of the ship’s shore power connection (if it has one at all), and the availability of power from BC Hydro.

BC Hydro offers a very attractive fixed power rate for vessels connected to shore power to encourage participation in the program. However, because BC Hydro has the right to halt the service if it is needed elsewhere on the grid, such as to homeowners on a cold, winter day, BC Hydro customers are not impacted.

On July 22, 2015, the federal government and the Vancouver Fraser Port Authority announced funding for the installation of shore power facilities for container vessels at two terminals: Deltaport in Delta, B.C. and Centerm in Vancouver.

Shore power plug-inThis is a significant milestone for the shore power project. Total project funding is $12 million: $6 million from Transport Canada’s Shore Power Technology for Ports Program and $6 million from the Vancouver Fraser Port Authority. Both shore power operations are expected to be operational by the end of 2018.

 

from https://www.portvancouver.com


Edited by aastra, 16 October 2019 - 09:32 AM.


#2011 aastra

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:30 AM

Victoria must be a big city/major port today, obsessed with innovation and progress and being on the cutting edge (but on this one issue and this one issue only).



#2012 aastra

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 09:51 AM

Suffice it to say, having some shore power available would be a big feather in the port of Victoria's cap. If this inane political brouhaha is meant to kick off the process then I suppose I can stomach it for a little while.



#2013 Mike K.

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 10:22 AM

The process has already been kicked off, by the harbour authority.

 

But maybe the political goal here was to make it look like this was the City's idea, independent of what the GVHA was already doing (hence no meeting having taken place when the GVHA asked for one).


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#2014 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 11:01 AM

 

 

Greenhouse gas emissions are up from cruise ship visits, but efforts have been made to limit pollutant levels, says a new Emissions Inventory Report released by the Greater Victoria Harbour Authority (GVHA).

 

The report was composed by Synergy Enterprises, and comes out just days after the City of Victoria requested that the GVHA limit its cruise ship expansion plans until more climate measures are put in place.

 

 

 

https://www.vicnews....n-point-report/

 

 

 



#2015 Mike K.

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 11:09 AM

I guess all of the factories at Ogden Point have installed scrubbers on their smokestacks?

 

Because what else would be causing rising emissions at Ogden Point if not a rising volume of cruise ships docking at Ogden Point? The tugboats? A few helicopter flights per day?

 

Furthermore, the sub-title is slanted to create the impression that the GVHA is reacting to the demands of the City, but we now know the GVHA had asked some time ago to meet with the City to present their report.


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#2016 Nparker

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 12:32 PM

...it should have been obvious to every thinking person that it was just another hollow political stunt...

Which is pretty much how one can frame almost every decision made by the CoV council; especially those stunts that are clearly meant to boost Lisa Helps' post-mayoral career.


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#2017 aastra

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Posted 16 October 2019 - 12:59 PM

I know we like to bash Lisa Helps on this board but I still feel like she's playing to political expectations while also actually caring about Victoria and Victorians:

 

 

Helps stressed in an interview that the motion is not an attack on the harbour authority and her report acknowledges the efforts the authority has taken to reduce emissions from buses and shuttle services, and to encourage passengers to walk downtown from the ships.


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#2018 G-Man

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Posted 17 October 2019 - 06:13 AM

Maybe we can use the biowaste from the sewage plant to power the cruise ships? Too bad we couldn't have built a facility there and just had a short pipeline across the harbour rather than the one to Hartland.

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#2019 Mike K.

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Posted 17 October 2019 - 07:14 AM

A pipeline to send our sewage off with the ships to be dumped at sea?


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#2020 G-Man

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Posted 17 October 2019 - 10:25 AM

No a bio-gas facility. We should have built a big one right at Ogden Point and we could have powered the cruise ships with it. I am sure the JBNA would be all over this type of facility.


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