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Downtown Nightlife


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#1 Caramia

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 07:02 PM

Forum members on the "No FUN city" thread have said that they would like to see the city's approach to nightlife become an election issue... here is a thread for it and a recent article for reference.

City talks of closing eateries by 1 a.m.

Proposal for downtown sparked by unease over unruly bar patrons
Bill Cleverley, Times Colonist
Published: Friday, September 19, 2008

Downtown food carts and takeout eateries could be forced to close by 1 a.m. under a bylaw that Victoria councillors are considering.

The city's hope is that by having the food outlets close before the bars, it will eliminate the problem of loud drunks urinating, loitering and fighting around eateries that don't have indoor seating and don't provide public washrooms.

"Staff believe this is the most direct approach, given our resources," said Rob Woodland, the city's director of legislative and regulatory services.
People line up outside Wharf Street eateries after the downtown bars close. Victoria council is drafting a bylaw that would close vending carts and restaurants with less than 300 square feet by 1 a.m.View Larger Image View

The proposed bylaw targets takeout restaurants, restaurants with serving areas of 300 square feet or less and vending carts within a yet-to-be-specified area of downtown, permitting them to operate only between 6 a.m. and 1 a.m...

http://www.canada.co....1-7aeea313dfc5

Well, at least the cops will only have to control the (sure to be much larger) crowds at 7-11 if this goes through.

Someone decided not to keep the structured closing (where bars could keep people inside until 3am) and now they take away another way for folks to cool down and wait for a cab, that is hard to find at 2am.


Nowadays most people die of a sort of creeping common sense, and discover when it is too late that the only things one never regrets are one's mistakes.
Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900), The Picture of Dorian Gray, 1891

#2 Sue Woods

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 08:36 PM

Staff believe this is the most direct approach, given our resources," said Rob Woodland, the city's director of legislative and regulatory services.
People line up outside Wharf Street eateries after the downtown bars close. Victoria council is drafting a bylaw that would close vending carts and restaurants with less than 300 square feet by 1 a.m.View Larger Image View


I think late night food services play an important role to offset (dilute) excessive drinking and as employment for young and certainly hardworking entrepreneurs. I suggest instead to lobby BC Transit (or a private bus company) to run late nights busses out of downtown until bar closing. My main concern lies with crime on the streets - which in my view has nothing to do with legal businesses marketing to an audience of young people that no one else attends to. (We're all home asleep!)

Sue

#3 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 08:57 PM

OK, all good stuff there.

There was a 6-month pilot project where bars could let patrons stay until 3am. No change in the liquor service, they still had to stop at 2am, but instead of insisting everyone leave the premises at 2:30, folks could chill, stay until 3am.

That allowed taxis to make a second run into town and grab one more wave of people. With no people on the street making noise/being drunk. That project from what I understand, and I'm in the business, never even got a review to see how it was doing, it just sort of ended. When I phoned the City and the liquor authorities to see what the result of the "trial" was they didn't even know it had ended.

Now, hold on:

I would also want to work with bar owners - whose businesses make a lot more income from partying youth then food stands - to install extra washrooms and provide security for the buses.


Most - no, let me make that "many" - bar owners are willing to work on the problem. But the perception that bar owners are swimming in cash is wrong.

Yes, if you just look at liquor mark-up, it seems like any bar is making lots of cash, but most cabarets are only open from between 8 and 28 hours per week. And I can assure you taxes and insurance, security costs etc. are very high for those few hours of money-making. Plus addl. staff cost is high. Try finding lots of folks to work from 9pm-2am just Friday and Saturday, especially in non tip-paying jobs like doormen/security/porters/bussers.

#4 Sue Woods

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 09:08 PM

Most - no, let me make that "many" - bar owners are willing to work on the problem. But the perception that bar owners are swimming in cash is wrong.


Thanks for pointing that out. I have little experience with the nightclub business and should have been more careful when making that point. It sounds like the project you mentioned was a success. I wonder why it was not referred to. I would support a revisit of it.

Do you agree that eateries should be permitted to do business until the bars close?
Sue

#5 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 09:58 PM

^ Eateries are good for 2 reasons.

It gives peeps a chance to sober out, food is good for booze saturation.

It means some folks can wait an extra 30-45 minutes for a taxi, which are in seriously short supply at 2 or 2:30. If they can eat until 3, they can catch the next wave.

#6 zoomer

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Posted 25 September 2008 - 10:12 PM

More info from the Victoria News:

For some reason, the online version is incomplete compared to what's dropped off on my porch.

The paper version stated that only Sonya Chandler, Bea Holland and Pam Madoff did not agree to the necessity of the bylaw (the online version only mentions Sonya).

Mayor Lowe was interviewed by Joe Easingwood earlier in the week regarding this issue. Lowe admitted that he never goes downtown to take in the nightlife - bars, nightclubs, etc. Joe Easingwood however, was incredibly rude (more so than usual!) to Mayor Lowe, taking several shots at him, including asking if he would bring back Paul Battershill to clean up the problem. At one point Lowe asked Joe what he would do, considering that Joe had considered running for mayor.

#7 Caramia

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 12:09 AM

Well good for Sonya Chandler, Pam Madoff, and Bea Holland. I have the deepest respect for the others but I think one of the things that makes downtown special is the way it is alive at night.
Nowadays most people die of a sort of creeping common sense, and discover when it is too late that the only things one never regrets are one's mistakes.
Oscar Wilde (1854 - 1900), The Picture of Dorian Gray, 1891

#8 Rob Randall

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Posted 26 September 2008 - 08:23 AM

I have talked about this issue often with Councillor Charlayne Thornton-Joe (our Councillor liaison for Downtown) and she favours more eateries in more locations but does not support take-out places that don't provide adequate washrooms, seating or staff to monitor behaviour. Some places close their washrooms to avoid the hassle of cleaning and repair.

 



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