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Victoria tourism issues and discussion


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#241 Ms. B. Havin

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 10:11 PM

^ By blaming the "victim" of the sleazes for being taken in. The guest did do what you suggested ("I selected the One Bedroom Premium with Full Ocean Views and called the hotel directly to book this room. The front desk clerk had no idea what I was talking about so I explained the website room categories to her and booked our room."). If the hotel were honest, the front desk person should have said, "we don't have any full ocean view rooms," but instead the front desk clerk booked the room as if it were a full ocean view room.

What was the guest supposed to do? Fly in and check it out before booking?

I agree that caveat emperor ("buyer beware") are words to live by. But if someone does do homework and gets fleeced, it seems weird to "blame" them when they complain.
When you buy a game, you buy the rules. Play happens in the space between the rules.

#242 Mike K.

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 10:34 PM

Yeesh, playing devil's advocate can be a dangerous thing around here ;)

The client in this case did the opposite of what I suggest she should have done. This situation could have been avoided so darn easily that it hurts me to put myself in this clients shoes:

Client: I'd like to book a room with a full ocean view.
Hotel: What do you mean?
Client: Your website advertises rooms with full ocean views.
Hotel: I don't know what you're talking about.
Client: Thank you for your time. Click!

That should have been the end of the conversation and the end of the deal. Or, better yet, the client should have asked to speak to a manager and explain to him/her why a potential deal was just lost or demand an explanation why rooms are advertised with ocean views but operators have no idea which rooms offer them. Clearly the reaction the client experienced was downright bizarre and should have resulted in not booking the room.

I'm by no means proud of this hotel's treatment of these visitors and if I were the management I would be deeply concerned over the lack of knowledge my staff has of very basic hotel features. But as for the client, why insist on booking a room that the operator doesn't believe exists? Alarm bells can't ring any louder.

#243 Mike K.

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Posted 26 November 2007 - 11:18 PM

This shot is from what appears to be the Delta Ocean Pointe. You can see Harbour Towers on the left.

I assume the view of the straight would be much clearer from HT or Oswego.



#244 aastra

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 10:41 AM

A review of the Marriott over at TripAdvisor.com. The reviewer is from Santa Rosa, CA:

This TripAdvisor Member:
Liked — Free internet kiosk
Disliked — Location, far away from downtown


http://www.tripadvis...h_Columbia.html

#245 G-Man

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 10:47 AM

^ That walk to the front door can be a killer.

#246 Ms. B. Havin

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 11:29 AM

...Interesting ..on that link aastra provides, two other reviews referencing the Aria (?, that's the only residential across the street), as blocker of Inner Harbour views from the lower floors. Hmmm, was it ever possible to view the Inner Harbour from the lower floors? The back of the Empress (and the awful VCC roof) -- that was "viewable," but could you see the harbour ever? Just wondering. The other thing that's interesting, I guess: as the area becomes less of a surface parking lot wasteland and instead morphs into a productive/ useful urban area, hotels that aren't directly on the harbour won't be able to coast on harbour-proximity anymore. That they were able to in the past suggests to me that there was some playing fast and loose with the "harbour view" card, as if that amounted to actual harbour frontage. So, by becoming a more real place (vs a parking lot), the hotels might have to adjust their advertising to reflect the real world?
When you buy a game, you buy the rules. Play happens in the space between the rules.

#247 aastra

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 12:31 PM

A lot of travel reviewers have questioned the validity of "Inner Harbour" in "Victoria Marriott Inner Harbour." But there was (prior to phase 2 of Aria) a decent view corridor extending from the Marriott over the parking lots across the street, over the roof of the Crystal Garden, over the bus station, and between the Empress and the RBCM/curatorial tower.

This picture shows it pretty well:
http://www.rayjanko....bum_pix_1/6.htm

Have we seen the following document before? Notice the emphasis on the skyline view from the south (you know, the view that nobody ever gets to see unless they're in a boat or in Metchosin with a powerful telephoto lens). Also notice the recommendation that Vancouver's Olympic Village is a good model to follow because of its "horizontal emphasis." Meanwhile they show a picture of a 12-story buiding! Do we really want highrises as tall as the ones we already have, except much wider??

http://www.victoria....trm_hghtpw3.pdf

The image on page 16 representing "Urban Proportionality" also happened to make an appearance in our "Aerial Pictures" thread back in October, 2006:
http://www.vibrantvi...read.php?t=1444

#248 Ms. B. Havin

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 01:14 PM

A lot of travel reviewers have questioned the validity of "Inner Harbour" in "Victoria Marriott Inner Harbour." But there was (prior to phase 2 of Aria) a decent view corridor extending from the Marriott over the parking lots across the street, over the roof of the Crystal Garden, over the bus station, and between the Empress and the RBCM/curatorial tower.

This picture shows it pretty well:
http://www.rayjanko....bum_pix_1/6.htm


LOL, that's not a view cone, it's a view spiral (or curve or parabola ...or something; an eyeball exercise?)! ;-)

Have we seen the following document before? Notice the emphasis on the skyline view from the south (you know, the view that nobody ever gets to see unless they're in a boat or in Metchosin with a powerful telephoto lens). Also notice the recommendation that Vancouver's Olympic Village is a good model to follow because of its "horizontal emphasis." Meanwhile they show a picture of a 12-story buiding! Do we really want highrises as tall as the ones we already have, except much wider??

http://www.victoria....trm_hghtpw3.pdf

The image on page 16 representing "Urban Proportionality" also happened to make an appearance in our "Aerial Pictures" thread back in October, 2006:
http://www.vibrantvi...read.php?t=1444


Good points re. the "horizontal" building & Olympic Village shtick. I saw that and thought, "Hmm, looks almost just like Atrium." Then I counted (at least 12 storeys!) and had a similar thought as yours.

Re. that photo: it looks like the same one you posted, that's for sure. Did you ever figure out where it came from originally?
When you buy a game, you buy the rules. Play happens in the space between the rules.

#249 aastra

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Posted 04 January 2008 - 01:50 PM

No idea where I got that pic.

Instead of view corridors, maybe Victoria should try to protect glimpses? "We have a glimpse of the legislative dome from our 3rd floor...in December, when there are no leaves on the trees. But that darned new building will block our glimpse!"

Anyway, you can see from that other pic just how much the quality of the southwesterly views from the entire Y-lot district (including Aria now) depend on there being nothing particularly wide/tall in the Crystal Garden/bus station/rose garden area. Something very tall but very slim could work on the footprint of the bus station, but a typical Victorian fatscraper would pretty much blow the whole deal for a whole lot of people.


Edited by aastra, 23 March 2018 - 02:00 PM.


#250 Holden West

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 11:24 AM

Honolulu Star-Bulletin with a standard travel piece on Victoria. You would think a paper from one of the biggest tourist cities would be a bit hipper when it comes to reviewing other tourist cities. I'm not sure why they would bother mentioning the Titanic exhibit when it ended two months ago.
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#251 Ms. B. Havin

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Posted 05 January 2008 - 04:04 PM

From that article:

It is no wonder that Victoria is almost synonymous with Butchart Gardens.

'nuff said.

Travel writing at its most jejune.

PS: And I like <not> how she's hedging her bets with the addition of "almost."
When you buy a game, you buy the rules. Play happens in the space between the rules.

#252 aastra

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 06:20 PM

A comment on YouTube:

I lived in Victoria for two years 2005-2006, and could not believe how many people were forced to work for cash. There was no meaningful employment anywhere, and most employers paid the minumum wage, with less than a forty hour work week. The cold water log littered beach there was also a joke. The fact the city dumps 100% of all raw sewage into the ocean was pathedic. I was happy to get back to Ontario "and prosperity".



#253 G-Man

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 06:47 PM

I see him retiring here in 40 years.

#254 aastra

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 06:57 PM

I see him sitting in front of a television and not doing much of anything.

#255 Holden West

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 08:44 PM

Council should do something about that cold water beach. And straighten out those jumbled logs.
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#256 aastra

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 08:57 PM

Beaches in Ontario are much better.

#257 Holden West

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Posted 19 February 2008 - 10:48 PM

Another instance of the media breaking the vow of silence regarding Victoria Island. Unless we silence these leaks immediately, we risk the rest of the world discovering our secret island.

Then, in 1977, the lure of a milder climate and proximity to excellent Canadian Sitka spruce supplies drew Larrivée, his wife, Wendy, and the Larrivée shop to Victoria Island, British Columbia.


"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#258 aastra

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 11:44 AM

No worries. They'll take one look at the driftwood on the beaches and go right back where they came from.

#259 aastra

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 06:42 PM

Here's a negative assessment from (will wonders never cease?) a real estate blog:

As I said earlier I am throwing in the towel. There are "parts" of Victoria that are nice but drive around and most of it is pretty depressing.

This particular guy seems to be keen on Toronto. Somebody else on the same page posted a comment about Halifax and how his friends are just loving it. He can't stress it enough. They're loving it.

For some reason I'm seeing a lot of the "it's-impossible-to-make-friends-in-Vancouver-or-Victoria" nonsense all of a sudden. Why do some people suppose it's the fault of the community when they fail to make meaningful social connections? I don't get that at all. On one message board I saw all of these people agreeing with one another that in Victoria people just don't admit new people into their circles of friends. Isn't that paradoxical? How did those circles of friends get established in the first place?

So not only are BC's cities supposed to hand out high paying jobs and fancy homes to every talentless git who shows up, but they're also supposed to hand out friends and love interests, too? Winnipeg does it. Sudbury does it. Can't Victoria do it, too?

I mean, what planet are these people coming from?

#260 gumgum

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Posted 20 February 2008 - 08:08 PM

You'll get a lot of ppl disagreeing with you that Victorians aren't cliquey.
I go either way on it. I've made lots of friends since moving here, all were very willing to invite me in to their circle. None of them were from Victoria.
Nothing against Victoria natives, it's just that people that grow up with a social network see no motivation to branch out as much.
It also depends on where you are in life. I bet ppl that went to university here never had a hard go of making friends, whereas people with families, even people just in the work force might find it tough too.
Keep in mind, more ppl move here at a stage in life and reason that most ppl would never move to other cities. Also, most cities in Canada don't see ppl arrive all the time to simply want to live there. They're not moving to a job or school, where social networks are more easily accessed, or are already preassembled for them. They're often jobless, aimless, or retired, just looking for a chance to fit in because they just want to be here.
And of course, if they get lonely enough they invent reasons to hate it and move back. They, of course, tell all their friends and the internet how a shitty little place it is once you scratch the surface.

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