31 replies to this topic

[VicHockeyFan]

So I noticed the other day that the former Blanshard Court housing project has mucho cameras all over the place. And this is just a straight-up subsidized housing project for low income families. I'd say there must be over 25 cameras covering the whole place. Although they had signs up saying they are part of Crime Watch or something or other, no sign actually talked about the cameras

[sebberry]

Did you pose for it?

[D.L.]

there should be laws against painting too many buildings all the same colour

[sebberry]

there should be laws against painting too many buildings all the same colour

Then we'd be whining about laws making developments look like rainbows

[D.L.]

would we?

[martini]

These cameras were installed at least a year ago. It's part of CFMH. Crime Free Multi-Housing. It's been very successful.
http://www.vicpd.ca/...ti-housing-cmfh

[VicHockeyFan]

These cameras were installed at least a year ago. It's part of CFMH. Crime Free Multi-Housing. It's been very successful.
http://www.vicpd.ca/...ti-housing-cmfh

I bet it's the only one with 25 cameras.

[martini]

I bet it's the only one with 25 cameras.

No doubt. Evergreen is a large complex. I'm not sure how many units to be honest.

[VicHockeyFan]

No doubt. Evergreen is a large complex. I'm not sure how many units to be honest.

150+ townhomes, plus the apartments at the south sector, or "district 9" as we call it...

[martini]

150+ townhomes, plus the apartments at the south sector, or "district 9" as we call it...

I found it. 183 units.

District 9?

One of the largest is Skeena Terrace in Vancouver with over 300 units.
It was with these large complexes that B.C. Housing realized it was not prudent to house so many with income issues together.

So I think they have come a long way in maintaining these larger complexes.

[VicHockeyFan]

I found it. 183 units.

District 9?

One of the largest is Skeena Terrace in Vancouver with over 300 units.
It was with these large complexes that B.C. Housing realized it was not prudent to house so many with income issues together.

So I think they have come a long way in maintaining these larger complexes.

I agree, it's nothing like Blanshard court was in the 80's, it's a remarkable transistion. Part of it might be that social housing opportunities tightened up, folks knew they could not f around and still live there.

[http]

These cameras were installed at least a year ago. It's part of CFMH. Crime Free Multi-Housing. It's been very successful.
http://www.vicpd.ca/...ti-housing-cmfh

As near as I can tell from looking at the vicpd website, it is not part of the CFMH.

http://www.vicpd.ca/...i-get-certified makes no mention of video cameras.
http://www.crime-fre...lti-housing.htm doesn't openly mention them either.

Can you please tell us more? I feel a rant coming on, but I don't want to run my mouth off in ignorance. Near as I can tell, it's bad form around here, and I've already offended someone this year.

[martini]

As near as I can tell from looking at the vicpd website, it is not part of the CFMH.

http://www.vicpd.ca/...i-get-certified makes no mention of video cameras.
http://www.crime-fre...lti-housing.htm doesn't openly mention them either.

Can you please tell us more? I feel a rant coming on, but I don't want to run my mouth off in ignorance. Near as I can tell, it's bad form around here, and I've already offended someone this year.

I'm not sure I'm understanding why you think Evergreen Terrace is not part of Victoria Police's CFMH.
That link states it is:
http://www.vicpd.ca/...ti-housing-cmfh
Plus if you go to Evergreen Terrace...there are signs up for CFMH. I'm pretty sure they state video surveillance but I can't say 100% as I haven't been there for awhile.

I'm not sure what else I can tell you. I do know the program is very successful in reducing crime.
What would you like to rant about?

[VicHockeyFan]

I'm not sure I'm understanding why you think Evergreen Terrace is not part of Victoria Police's CFMH.
That link states it is:
http://www.vicpd.ca/...ti-housing-cmfh
Plus if you go to Evergreen Terrace...there are signs up for CFMH. I'm pretty sure they state video surveillance but I can't say 100% as I haven't been there for awhile.

I'm not sure what else I can tell you. I do know the program is very successful in reducing crime.
What would you like to rant about?

http just means that video cameras is not a defined part of CFMH. And I looked for signs that said you were on video at Evergreen, there are none. There are plenty of CFMH signs, but they don't say anything about video.

[martini]

http just means that video cameras is not a defined part of CFMH. And I looked for signs that said you were on video at Evergreen, there are none. There are plenty of CFMH signs, but they don't say anything about video.

Aaaaahhh I get it now. Sorry.
Well if the cameras are not part of CFMH, then B.C. Housing has done this on their own?
I agree there should be signs warning you are under surveillance.
I have to dash out, but will see if I can find out any other info.

[victorian fan]

About 20 per cent of all the world's surveillance cameras are in the U.K. the average Londoner is caught on video 300 times a day. The national network of 4.2 million surveillance cameras have failed to reduce crime, with only three per cent of London's street robberies being solved using security cameras.

[sebberry]

The problem with cameras is this: Cameras are installed, crime drops where the cameras point, cameras are considered beneficial in reducing crime, police and government consider cameras a success and use that to justify rolling out more cameras.

Now, as more areas are given these crime fighting cameras, crime gets pushed around until all areas are covered by cameras and crime once again returns to the monitored areas.

The success of a camera in one place should not be used as justification to install more cameras that cover all places.

[Mike K.]

There are police cameras installed all over Chicago's nastier parts. I was surprised to see as many as I did, but I suppose without those cameras when a crime occurred it was hard to get anyone to talk who may have witnessed something.

At times the cameras flash a bright blue light, which I suppose means it's actively shooting or someone operating the camera wants to remind peeps of its presence.

[martini]

The problem with cameras is this: Cameras are installed, crime drops where the cameras point, cameras are considered beneficial in reducing crime, police and government consider cameras a success and use that to justify rolling out more cameras.

Now, as more areas are given these crime fighting cameras, crime gets pushed around until all areas are covered by cameras and crime once again returns to the monitored areas.

The success of a camera in one place should not be used as justification to install more cameras that cover all places.

Yes I can agree with you to an extent, but I believe in the case of social housing there is the benefit of lessening crime around families.
Crime will occur no matter what.

This ripple effect also occurs when the police concentrate downtown. Then everything spreads outwards. I think the police call it the 'balloon effect'.

As far as your theory to crime returning where cameras are...I suppose if there's no eyes on the street. Cameras alone are not the answer anyway.
They are part of the solution.

I'm guessing the rant that could come on are your rights being violated because you don't know you're being filmed?

Well we're on candid camera when:
-Using any ATM
-Shopping at grocery stores, drug stores, convenience stores, clothing stores, sports stores, shopping malls, food courts, fast food joints, and coffee shops.
-Getting gas
Well you get the point I'm trying to make.

Do each and every one of these establishments hang a sign to inform you?
I doubt it.
So if we want to get our feathers ruffled over B.C. Housing improving the conditions for families in subsidized housing, call Const. Derek Tolmie at Victoria Police. CFMH is his baby.
Or better yet, ask the tenants. Especially the ones who've lived there long term.

I'm certainly not pro-camera, but am curious at the objections in this particular case.

[G-Man]

I don't have an issue myself with their being cameras there. My issue would be more with being a resident there. This is their home and in general you can expect a reasonable degree of privacy in your home and nearby. I would certainly hope they got written permission from each resident before installing the cameras because to me it comes across as that the residents in this project are not trustworthy whereas residents in higher income buildings and stratas are trustworthy and therefore don't require cameras.

You can't tell that none of the cameras inadvertantly record through residents windows.