2245 replies to this topic

[Star Dust]

I said from the Get Go that Round-A-Bouts would have been the most efficient design to have at each end of the new overpass, so that traffic could flow without having to "Stop"  But too much complaining from people who don't know how to use round-a-bouts (even though they are required to by law to hold a license in BC) during the public consultations, caused them to currently settle with Traffic lights at each end of the bridge. This will only further congest traffic along McKenzie/Admirals.

 

In reality the Round-A-Bout/Traffic Circle is a rather simple system to navigate that has been used in many parts of Europe for the better part of a century with ease and success. Once you get used to them, they are as easy as using a 4-way stop.

 

The first thing is to understand that in this category we have two options: Traffic Circles and the other being Round-A-Bouts.

 

Traffic Circles are the smaller ones you find in residential areas that contain only one lane of traffic going around the circle. When you approach it, you simply Yield to any traffic in the traffic circle. NOW THIS FOLLOWING PART is where I constantly see people screw up at traffic circles..... If another vehicle arrives at the traffic circle at the same time as you do, by law you MUST yield to the vehicle on your right, just as you have to do at a 4 way stop. Unfortunately is what I see every day is people just driving right into the circle even when the other vehicle has the right of way .I've seen some pretty close calls when a car enters a traffic circle and almost smashes into another car that is already in it.

 

Round-A-Bouts are larger traffic circles that contain more then one lane of traffic within the circle. In Greater Victoria the only place I can currently think of one is at the McTavish Interchange by the air port. Know where you want to go before you enter a round-a-bout and enter either the left lane or the right lane. You are NOT permitted to change lanes once inside a round-a-bout, so know where you want to go before you enter. Lane use signs or road markings will show you which lane you need to use. If you want to turn left, make sure you are in the left lane.If you want to turn right, use the right lane. If you want to go straight, you may use either the left or right lane.But remember whatever lane you enter in, you must stay in that lane while inside the round-a-bout.

 

When approaching a Round-A-Bout you MUST yield to any pedestrians using a cross-walk or who are about to use the cross-walk located at the entrance to the round-a-bout. You MUST YIELD to any traffic that is already in the Round-A-Bout.  And that's it.  You will find this information on pages 46&47 of the ICBC Driver's guide.  The one rule change to a round-a-bout in comparison to a traffic circle, is that in a round-a-bout you don't have to yield to vehicle on the right when entering one, as you do with a traffic circle.

 

Below are two graphics: One depicts a traffic circle, and the other a round-a-bout

Attached Images

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Edited by Star Dust, 13 February 2018 - 02:26 PM.

[Cats4Hire]

One at each end of the overpass, yes, that's how I understand it. Basically the same arrangement as the other TCH interchanges in Langford (ex. Millstream)

or just up the highway at Helmcken https://www.google.c...12!8i6656?hl=en

[malahatdrive]

Langford has a multi-lane roundabout at the intersection of Langford Parkway and Westshore Parkway

 

I believe with respect to McKenzie that the ministry said that traffic volumes were too high for roundabouts. Roundabouts don't work in cases where traffic volumes are too high and/or the traffic volume on the incoming roads are not balanced. Look at many of the multilane roundabouts in the UK - they have added traffic lights on them now as they can't handle the volume: https://www.google.c...!7i13312!8i6656

[lanforod]

I always remember standing at the top of the Arc de Triomphe and just watching the mess of the 5-10 lane (depending on time of day and how crazy drivers are) roundabout that goes around it.

 

https://www.youtube....?v=-2RCPpdmSVg 

Edited by lanforod, 13 February 2018 - 04:23 PM.

[satellite]

Too bad - I thought Admirals traffic would be flowing without lights. In this case I wonder how much of the congestion around Craigflower and up Mckenzie will be altered by this. 

[Mattjvd]

Too bad - I thought Admirals traffic would be flowing without lights. In this case I wonder how much of the congestion around Craigflower and up Mckenzie will be altered by this.

If would have been nice if there was a cloverleaf for light-free left turns off Admirals onto Hwy1 northbound. But that really isn't feasable with thebland constraints. I think Admirals/Mckenzie through traffic is fine with a light though.

Edited by Mattjvd, 13 February 2018 - 06:41 PM.

[malahatdrive]

While it does mean 2 lights for north - south McKenzie/Admirals traffic, the delay should be a lot less than present since that traffic wont have to interact with the highway through traffic.

Edited by malahatdrive, 13 February 2018 - 08:41 PM.

[Mike K.]

Oh yeah, it'll be fine.

 

Consider that very few vehicles need to engage the left turn onto Admirals from TCH northbound, and the west intersection light will only be triggered by buses and pedestrians, no? There's no cross-traffic onto McKenzie as it uses the cloverleaf.

[exc911ence]

they are as easy as using a 4-way stop.

 

 

 

Which is something that many Victoria drivers can't seem to figure out either.... 

[nerka]

Which is something that many Victoria drivers can't seem to figure out either.... 

In defense of Victoria drivers "stop" is a pretty difficult concept. :-)

[Freedom57]

In defense of Victoria drivers "stop" is a pretty difficult concept. :-)

....did you say Victoria bike riders....   

[aastra]

Google "why are [insert any city here] drivers so bad?". For any city you can think of you'll find articles or a message board etc. talking about how drivers in that city are exceptionally bad. Miami, Boise, Tulsa, St. Louis, Atlanta, New Orleans, Edmonton, Halifax, Vancouver... they're all home to their nation's worst drivers. And the good citizens of those places love to note how drivers in [insert any other city here] are absolutely excellent.

 

This guy from Nova Scotia says:

 

 

...as in Scotland, motorists in Alberta seem to respect the rules of the road and also each other. Such a treat.

 

And he theorizes about Nova Scotia's unique circumstances:

 

 

So what’s happening to turn so many Nova Scotian motorists into impatient, aggressive, get-outta-my-way jackasses? Let me share a few theories:

•Vehicles have become faster, peppier and more manoeuvrable, giving too many people a dangerous sense of being in control under all situations;

•Trucks and SUVs have grown so big and tall that they impart a sense of invincibility to the driver;

•Our culture promotes such a sense of empowerment and entitlement that many drivers, especially younger ones, truly believe they own the road;

•Today’s drivers have so many high-tech “toys” around them that they are becoming increasingly distracted. The same is true of their passengers who, busy texting, no longer contribute a second pair of watchful eyes on traffic;

•And, of course, there’s no escaping the fact that there’s lots more traffic on the road today.

 

You know, because none of that stuff would be applicable in Scotland or Alberta or anywhere else. Just in Nova Scotia.

Edited by aastra, 15 February 2018 - 11:30 AM.

[Bingo]

 

And he theorizes about Nova Scotia's unique circumstances:

 

You know, because none of that stuff would be applicable in Scotland or Alberta or anywhere else. Just in Nova Scotia.

 

Alberta doesn't have a fundy bay with sticky mud shrimps though.

[Nparker]

Alberta doesn't have a fundy bay with sticky mud shrimps though.

Sticky Mud Shrimps are opening for Notley Crew at Rogers Place in Edmonton.

[nerka]

....did you say Victoria bike riders....   

that too

[moretrain]

Too bad - I thought Admirals traffic would be flowing without lights. In this case I wonder how much of the congestion around Craigflower and up Mckenzie will be altered by this. 

 

I don't think there was ever a point in the current design where there wasn't going to be traffic lights. The most poignant issue with the current intersection is the 60 second long left turn light Southbound onto Mackenzie followed by the remaining 135 seconds before the sequence repeats. The current layout means there will be a single traffic light the former left hand turners have to go through, but the light will only change for buses (not frequently at all) and the less than a handful of left turns onto Admirals from Northbound. This will be quite efficient without the headache of a roundabout.

[lanforod]

In the morning, anyways. In the afternoon, its the major backup on McKenzie and the stalls with getting through traffic through due to lights.

Edited by lanforod, 16 February 2018 - 12:13 PM.

[moretrain]

In the morning, anyways. In the afternoon, its the major backup on McKenzie and the stalls with getting through traffic through due to lights.

Not 100% sure what youre trying to say, but there will be an additional turn lane from Mackenzie westbound onto Northbound TCH with only the current light up the road. The length of the merge lanes is also much longer meaning drivers can speed up faster meaning more effective merging. 

[nagel]

Paving of the on ramp from McKenzie southbound to TCH westbound began overnight.  These photos are from the Goose at 6:30am.  I hardly had the decency to stop pedaling to take them so don't whine about the quality.

 

[nagel]

Update on paving.  Things are really moving along.  For once on this project I am impressed (I was there at the initial announcement in October 2015, and IMO the speed of this project is absolutely glacial, bordering on JSB slow).  They have basically paved the entire on-ramp except for some odd patches.  The paving equipment has been moved to the TCH westbound (outbound) off-ramp to McKenzie northbound.  It's possible that will be paved today or tomorrow IMO.  There are also temporary traffic signals in the air now all around these new ramps, so they are really gearing up for the changeover.  The changeover is moving the TCH westbound off the old highway and through these new ramps, so they can dig it down several metres.  I suspect before they start that dig they will use the former westbound lanes to handle the eastbound (inbound) traffic, so they can build the inbound on and off ramps.  That will take us well past summer before the central dig out begins.