3894 replies to this topic

[max.bravo]

Threatening people with a knife and setting a fire inside of an apartment are actions that warrant the use of deadly force. If you’re doing things that could kill others, don’t be surprised if the police come and you get killed when you are not compliant.

The police officer didn’t create a life and death situation. The Crazy lady did that

Edited by max.bravo, 29 May 2025 - 08:12 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Threatening people with a knife and setting a fire inside of an apartment are actions that warrant the use of deadly force.

 

Nope.   Police cannot shoot arsonists and those that are suspects of uttering threats.  

 

The fire was out and the threat with a knife was many minutes or even hours earlier.

 

Wally Oppal was wrong?  He's a former cop, supreme court justice and attorney general.   I think he knows more than we do about the appropriate use of deadly force.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 29 May 2025 - 08:16 AM.

[max.bravo]

Why didn’t the lady just come out and talk to police then?

[Victoria Watcher]

The Crazy lady did that

 

She was not a "crazy lady".  She had known mental and addiction issues.

[Victoria Watcher]

Why didn’t the lady just come out and talk to police then?

 

She was on drugs and had mental health issues.   

[Victoria Watcher]

Why didn’t the lady just come out and talk to police then?

 

Again, are you more qualified than Oppal?    Did you sit in on the hearing?  Do you know the law and use-of-force rules for police and the ARWEN weapon?

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 29 May 2025 - 08:19 AM.

[max.bravo]

If I threaten my roommates with a knife and set a fire inside of the house, and then don’t obey police directions when they come to help, I’m not gonna be surprised if I get killed.

My cousin was killed in police custody because he was having a mental health issue and wasn’t compliant with police orders. I’ve thought a lot about this.

The officer who fired the shot that killed her isn’t a criminal. He woke up to go to work that morning and do a dangerous job protecting society. He had a family to go home to at the end of the day. Unlike the crazy lady who sat inside government provided housing using drugs, threatening people with a knife, and setting fires inside the place.

I Side with the cops on this one. Play stupid games, win stupid prizes.

Edited by max.bravo, 29 May 2025 - 08:29 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

The officer who fired the shot that killed her isn’t a criminal. He woke up to go to work that morning and do a dangerous job protecting society. He had a family to go home to at the end of the day. 

 

I agree with all of this.  But I also agree he used the wrong tactics that day.  And it ended the life of the woman.  It might have been able to go another way.

[pontcanna]

IIO rejects claim that excessive force by police a factor in man's broken leg

 

While the IIO report says the man’s leg was likely injured while a VicPD officer was helping him free it from a police vehicle, they found no evidence of use of excessive force

 

Full report: https://iiobc.ca/app...rm-2024-047.pdf

 

T-C article: https://www.timescol...en-leg-10741101

[pontcanna]

After a workplace death, bring in better practices

Re: “Support Ron Kirkwood, don’t discipline him,” letter, May 29.

Times Colonist - 3 Jun 2025

I saw a comment saying Judge Oppal should be “ashamed” of his decision to discipline police officer Ron Kirkwood, as he doesn’t know what Kirkwood went through in the moments leading up to blindly firing three times to the back of a person’s head.

There was a weeks-long public hearing. I was there. I was disgusted by the police response.

Every officer there said they would have done the same thing, and would do the same thing again. In regard to shooting a weapon blindly at a civilian. Where the civilian ended up being accidentally executed.

At any workplace I’ve been to, when someone gets injured or dies on the job, new rules and practices are immediately instilled to ensure this never occurs again. Police response to this accident shows why this wasn’t the first and won’t be the last time it happens here.

Before Oppal's ruling, I had lost faith in the police in this city, as they have proudly & defiantly presented themselves as gun-wielding, blind-shooting lunatics who are victims of the citizens they’re supposed to protect.

Samantha Tinkler, Victoria

 

 

Consider the family, and their nightmare

Times Colonist - 3 Jun 2025

The letter writer who stated that Wally Oppal should be ashamed of himself due to his decision about Ron Kirkwood’s actions against Lisa Rauch is the one who should be ashamed.

Do police officers deal with these awful decisions regularly? I’m sure they do. Would I want to be this police officer? Absolutely not.

But this woman was no threat to anyone. She was sitting on the couch with her back to the officer.

He says he thought he was shooting into her front torso. Even if that was the case, he had to shoot her 3 times?

The writer suggests “walking a mile” in the police officer’s shoes. How about if the writer walks a mile in Lisa Rauch’s shoes? Or her daughter’s shoes? Or her parents’ shoes?

Kirkwood and family have been “living with this nightmare incident for the last 6 yrs”? What about Lisa’s family?

Kathryn Sihota, Victoria

 

More: https://www.timescol...y-care-10751210

[pontcanna]

Lawyers suggest low-end discipline for VicPD Sgt

 

Submissions were heard Fri on discipline a VicPD officer should face after a retired judge found he used unnecessary force when he fired projectiles that killed a woman Xmas Day 2019.

Discipline Sgt. Ron Kirkwood (44) may face ranges from dismissal to verbal reprimand.

Lawyers agree that Kirkwood’s actions weren't willful blindness, but error in judgement & punishment should be on the low end.

Lisa Rauch, 43, was killed after Kirkwood fired 3 ARWEN rounds, accidentally at her head after she barricaded herself & started a fire.

Counsel suggested Kirkwood should be suspended w/out pay.

Kirkwood’s lawyer: “This is a case of correction & education, not punishment - a 10+ day suspension would be exceptionally punitive”.

Kirkwood received BC's medal of valour for the 2022 BMO shooting. Kirkwood has “severe PTSD” & taken med leave as a result of this incident, & he has the confidence of VicPD from Chief, down.

Counsel for OPCC didn't take a position on specific disciplinary measures, but welcomed recommendations to prevent similar deaths from happening. Rauch family: “It’s 6 yrs in Dec, a long time. Punishment isn’t going to bring Lisa back,” said Lisa’s mom, Audrey, fighting tears.

Adjudicator will announce disciplinary decision, measures & reasons Jun 19.

 

More: https://cheknews.ca/...n-2019-1259494/

 

[pontcanna]

Five years after daughter fatally shot, mother applauds policing changes

The family of Chantel Moore gather June 4 @ Tofino-Ucluelet Junction to remember the loss of a young Tla-o-qui-aht woman

TOFINO — Chantel Moore’s daughter Gracie is 11 this yr.

“She often talks about her mom & how she misses her,” said Gracie’s grandmom Martha Martin June 4, the 5th anniversary of her 26 y/o daughter’s shooting by a Edmundston (NB) officer during a wellness check.

She would ask, ‘When are the angels going to be done with my mom? Can they just send her back now?’ ”

In her memory, Martin walked the 33 km from Tofino-Ucluelet Jct to Tofino’s 1st St Dock w/family & supporters. Last year, pain from an injury and her struggle w/mental health had her in tears.

Now she’s in better health — physically & mentally. “VicPD Chief Manak started a co-response team in honour of my daughter. A couple of wks ago I was there & I was able to do a presentation. I put the yellow pin dress on their co-response team”. She offered “huge applause” to Manak for being willing to make change.

“I look at my granddaughter and I see my nieces & nephews - I want to ensure their safety: Should anyone be pulled over, need a mental health check, they will not be shot multiple times. That’s unacceptable,”

 

More: https://www.timescol...hanges-10779728

 

[pontcanna]

VicPD officer to be suspended 7 days for misconduct in woman's death

 

VicPD officer Ron Kirkwood was found to have committed “serious but not malicious” misconduct when he fatally injured a woman with plastic projectiles. He will be suspended w/out pay for 7 days.

Oppal found dismissal & reduction in rank were not appropriate, because Kirkwood’s misconduct was an error in judgment committed in the context of a “dynamic and challenging call.”

“I am satisfied that his error in judgment was an isolated one. He’s had an exemplary background. He’s a good police officer who has had a bad moment, which unfortunately led to catastrophic circumstances,” Oppal said.

More: https://www.timescol...-death-10801661

[max.bravo]

The optics of that penalty are weird. It would almost be better to have no punishment than 7 days suspension for killing someone.

[Victoria Watcher]

I agree. Try the same argument for impaired driving causing death.

How much money did the discipline hearing cost taxpayers?

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 12 June 2025 - 01:15 PM.

[aastra]

 

The optics of that penalty are weird. It would almost be better to have no punishment than 7 days suspension for killing someone.

 

At this point I honestly wouldn't be surprised if somebody somewhere gets tried for murder but then gets off with only a monetary fine.

[pontcanna]

System failed everyone in Lisa Rauch case

 

by Angela Van Eerd

 

A commentary by the president of the Victoria City Police Union.

On Xmas Day 2019, while on vacation, Victoria Police Const. Ron Kirkwood volunteered to assist his colleagues with the GVERT during a high-risk incident in downtown Victoria.

The call involved a barricaded individual armed with a knife. It was an unpredictable and dangerous situation that tragically ended in the death of Lisa Rauch.

What followed has been its own kind of tragedy: an investigative and disciplinary process that has now stretched more than five and a half years.

 

More: https://www.timescol...h-case-10809432

[Victoria Watcher]

B.C.'s chief coroner will not be holding an inquest into the death of Lisa Rauch, a woman who died after being shot in the head with a less-lethal ARWEN round by a Victoria police officer on Christmas Day in 2019.

 

On Thursday, June 12, a public hearing held by the Office of the Police Complaint Commissioner (OPCC) disciplined the officer, Ron Kirkwood, with a seven-day unpaid suspension after the adjudicator found he was not justified in his use of force.

 

Dr. Jatinder Baidwan, the newly appointed chief coroner, announced on June 19 that they will not be moving forward with a coroner's inquest, which was requested by Rauch's family, as he says it is not necessary under the Coroners Act.

 

 

https://www.vicnews....officer-8083289

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 19 June 2025 - 03:29 PM.

[pontcanna]

IIO Reaches Decision Regarding Incident in Duncan Where one Woman Was Injured

July 4, 2025

Case: 2024-279
Incident Date: November 29, 2024
Location: Duncan
Detachment: North Cowichan/Duncan
Agency: RCMP
Incident Classification: Serious Harm
Case Status: Closed - Without Public Report

The Independent Investigations Office (IIO) of BC has now completed its investigation into the injury sustained by a woman while being arrested in Duncan on November 29, 2024 (IIO 2024-279).

At about 2:05 p.m., officers with the North Cowichan/Duncan RCMP responded to reports from the public about a woman waving a weapon at vehicles near the intersection of Underwood and Craig streets.

Officers located the woman not far from the Cowichan River near Allenby Road. There was then an interaction between the woman and police while she was being taken into custody. The woman sustained a serious injury and was taken to a local hospital for treatment.

The IIO was notified by police the next day and commenced an investigation.

The Chief Civilian Director has now reviewed the evidence – including witness statements, police records and medical information – and determined that there are no reasonable grounds to believe any officer may have committed an offence.

The IIO investigation is now concluded. Due to a concurrent police investigation, the IIO’s public report will not be released on the IIO’s website until that process has concluded.

IIO is Seeking Witnesses to January 2025 Arrest in Courtenay

July 4, 2025

Case: 2025-135

Incident Date: January 5, 2025 

Detachment: Courtenay 

Location: Courtenay

Agency: RCMP 

Incident Classification: Serious Harm 

Case Status: Open - Investigation in Progress

The Independent Investigations Office of BC (IIO) is seeking witnesses to the arrest of a man in Courtenay on January 5, 2025.

Information provided by the RCMP states, that at around 11 p.m., officers responded to a call about a possibly impaired driver in the 2300 block of Mansfield Drive. Police later located the SUV in question in the parking lot of a hotel in the 2200-block of Cliffe Avenue.

Officers located a man inside a Cadillac Escalade SUV and attempted to arrest him. There was then an interaction between the man and police while they detained him, and the man suffered an injury in the process.

He was then taken to the hospital for treatment.

There are two factors that the IIO considers at the beginning of each investigation:

If there has been an injury that meets the threshold of serious harm, as defined by the Police Act, or a death; and If there is a connection between the serious harm/death and police action or inaction.

If both conditions are met, the investigation will continue to examine all available evidence to determine what occurred. At the conclusion of the investigation, the chief civilian director will also consider whether there are reasonable grounds to believe that an offence may have occurred.

The IIO is asking that any witnesses that have not already provided a statement, or who have video footage of the incident, to please contact the IIO at our Witness Line toll-free at 1-855-446-8477 or via the contact form on the iiobc.ca website.

 

[Victoria Watcher]

Esquimalt mayor resigns from police board, citing 'inherent conflict of interest'

 

 

Her final day on the board was last Monday, just over a year after the Police Act was amended to no longer require mayors to chair their municipality’s police board.

 

https://www.timescol...terest-10906308

 

 

Desjardins said she hopes her departure will make the board amend its policy that elected officials can’t be paid for their work, adding that the $8,000 annual stipend should be paid to all members to promote fairness.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 05 July 2025 - 03:29 PM.