1919 replies to this topic

[Nparker]

..."The system is teetering," said  @jjhorgan today...

But there's still $789 million to replace a perfectly functional museum*.

*fears of earthquakes and flooding are red herrings

 

As an aside, I am currently experiencing a fairly bad bout of sciatica. With no family doctor and no real access to a clinic, if things get worse, it's off to the Emergency Room I go.

[JohnN]

To fix Canadian health care, let’s try the Dutch model

 

AKE BLOMQVIST AND ROSALIE WYONCH

Globe and Mail May 30

 

Excerpt:Canada should give serious thought to drawing on the Dutch example and modifying our model of universal health insurance so that it would also allow consumers to choose among alternative competing plans, whether public or private.

 

The Dutch multipayer model of “managed competition” preserves the principles of universal insurance and an equitable sharing of health care costs. Universality is ensured by means of compulsory insurance, and equity is attained through requirements that plans have open enrollment.

[dasmo]

I lived in the Netherlands. Their system was way better. Lots of choice, inexpensive and included dental.

[phx]

I lived in the Netherlands. Their system was way better. Lots of choice, inexpensive and included dental.

 

How did the plans from different providers compare?  Did you get better care if you paid more?

[dasmo]

I’m going off memory here… I remember an easy website, choosing how much coverage 25% cost 50% cost 75% cost covered and associated price scale. Something like that. Some other options as desired. We had medical dental at 75% with some massage etc. I think $79 EU /month for three. Kids under a certain age are just free for dental care. There are entire dentist offices dedicated to children. Cool interior design with play rooms and sweet rewards. Lots sucked about Rotterdam but not this!

Edited by dasmo, 31 May 2022 - 09:29 PM.

[lanforod]

^ okay, so whats the difference between a plan that is 25% cost covered and 75% cost covered? Why would you choose one over the other? Does the 25% cost covered one get you more or faster health care since you're paying more out of pocket? Or is there qualifiers needed for higher cost covered scale, such as tied to income or wealth assessment?

[lanforod]

I don't know much about the dutch system. That article has a couple of tidbits that hint at 'the more you pay, the better your care':
"Consumers will choose the plans that offer what they see as the best combination of cost and expected quality of care"
and

" More efficient delivery of health care typically means lower spending on some services, and hence less revenue for those who supply them."

[dasmo]

^ okay, so whats the difference between a plan that is 25% cost covered and 75% cost covered? Why would you choose one over the other? Does the 25% cost covered one get you more or faster health care since you're paying more out of pocket? Or is there qualifiers needed for higher cost covered scale, such as tied to income or wealth assessment?

You pay $10/month and get 25% of your cost covered for medicine and other medical services. Dental for kids still free. get the 75% you pay $79/month and get 75% costs covered. I don't remember explicit details but If I was say a 20 year old I would probably take the cheapest option. Right now i have to pay 100% for dental  including for my kids. I haven't used medicine or seen a Doctor in almost three years. I wouldn't mind the 25% off dental. My wife's teeth suck.... 

 

Nothing tied to income. Just design your own insurance. All options were cheaper than here though. 

[JimV]

Here’s a little story about our wonderful system.  My sister-in-law has a painful knee problem.  In September her GP (yes, she actually has one!) referred her to a specialist.  She finally got to see the surgeon in April.  Before an operation date can be scheduled there are several steps to be taken (consultation with pharmacist, additional x-rays, etc.)  She was assigned a “nurse navigator” to facilitate these procedures.  Over the past week she has called the navigator three times.  Of course nobody answers.  She left messages but hasn’t received any callbacks.  Best system in the world!  I’ll bet Dutch medical care sucks compared to this.

[spanky123]

Here’s a little story about our wonderful system.  My sister-in-law has a painful knee problem.  In September her GP (yes, she actually has one!) referred her to a specialist.  She finally got to see the surgeon in April.  Before an operation date can be scheduled there are several steps to be taken (consultation with pharmacist, additional x-rays, etc.)  She was assigned a “nurse navigator” to facilitate these procedures.  Over the past week she has called the navigator three times.  Of course nobody answers.  She left messages but hasn’t received any callbacks.  Best system in the world!  I’ll bet Dutch medical care sucks compared to this.

 

Have your SIL tell them she works for the NDP.

[Midnightly]

You pay $10/month and get 25% of your cost covered for medicine and other medical services. Dental for kids still free. get the 75% you pay $79/month and get 75% costs covered. I don't remember explicit details but If I was say a 20 year old I would probably take the cheapest option. Right now i have to pay 100% for dental  including for my kids. I haven't used medicine or seen a Doctor in almost three years. I wouldn't mind the 25% off dental. My wife's teeth suck.... 

 

Nothing tied to income. Just design your own insurance. All options were cheaper than here though. 

 

the trouble i see with a monthly pay system is that some may not be able to afford the monthly costs.. (take seniors on a fixed income for example they would most likely need medical care and least likely have the extra fees to afford it) we live in a country with a high level of people who are struggling financially barely scraping by or living paycheck to paycheck adding another $50-100 a month could break them

[Nparker]

...we live in a country with a high level of people who are struggling financially barely scraping by or living paycheck to paycheck adding another $50-100 a month could break them

What if those people's net income increased by $50-$100/month by no longer having to pay into a government health care system?

[phx]

Any changes to health insurance are a tough sell in current day Canada. A large segment of the population would rather everyone have poor care than some have better care.

[Nparker]

...A large segment of the population would rather everyone have poor care than some have better care.

Sadly, I think you are right. Not only that, but they probably even believe Canada offers superior health care.

[phx]

Sadly, I think you are right. Not only that, but they probably even believe Canada offers superior health care.

It is surprising how, in a time when everyone has internet and overseas travel is commonplace, people can be as parochial as they are.

[Mike K.]

How does the Dutch system differ from ours, which had the medical premiums until the province offloaded them to employers?

[dasmo]

Includes dental is the big one. And choice. Choice of scale and cost and choice of extras or not. It’s like having an excellent corporate extended coverage into the base system.

[Mike K.]

Right. But I was paying something like $75 a month, give or take? I think? It’s been a few years. What would we be paying for that level of service (under the Dutch model) if we were already paying $75 in the 2010s just to participate in the existing system?

[dasmo]

I remember paying 70ish EU for family 75% cost coverage, medical, dental, (free for kids) medicine (including natural) massage also.

[Mike K.]

Ok, so about $150CAD. For that to include dental and drugs is pretty good, at 75% coverage.