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NDP "machine" in Victoria


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#21 Scotfree

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 10:46 AM

I guess I don't have a 'real job'.
I lease a real storefront, I hire real employees and write real cheques (way too real). But nobody hired me, nobody can fire me, so I guess I don't have a 'job'.

I got politics though. I got the same politics as my parents (entrepreneurs), maternal and paternal grandfathers ( both had their own businesses) and my great grandfather (Captain merchant marine - is that a job?).

And every single one of them a socialist!

All my British Columbia ancestors socialists.

What is this bizarre idea that the only people who vote for the NDP are trade unionists or government dependent or (gasp) teachers?

This is B.C. We have a different political and social culture. Deal with it.

#22 Sparky

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 11:43 AM

^ Welcome to Vibrant Victoria Scotfree. This thread seems to be running off track (not your doing) perhaps we can all get back on track.

This is an interesting topic especially as the municipal elections are right around the corner.

I think the NDP are the only provincial/national political entity that organizes for municipal and school board elections.

I would be interested to know how the candidates receive support. Do they ask for it? Is it an informal thing? Does one need to be a card carrying member?

I will make a point of asking David Cubberly the next time I see him.

#23 Mike K.

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 11:50 AM

Thanks for the that, Sparky. I too am curious how the candidates that receive support from the "machine" go about receiving the support and where the money comes from.

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#24 Baro

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 04:41 PM

I"m a died in the wool npd voter, but I HATE the ndp machine at the city level. The candidates are always extreme conservatives (in the sense that they don't want to change the status quo of this being a no-fun retirement community for the wealthy) and never accomplish anything remotely resembling a progressive socialist ideology.

I'd love to see some real social democrats in office, ones that actually work to lower the cost of living in the city. Encourage more good non-government middle class jobs, cheaper housing, better transit, real environmental initiatives rather than green-washed wastes of money.

Fighting every development, making the city unattractive for business, and wasting piles on money on dead-end study after study is not doing anything to improve the lives of the working class.
"beats greezy have baked donut-dough"

#25 Sparky

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 06:16 PM

Thank you Baro

Your comments are helpful in understanding that there might be a different expectation between municipal NDP'rs and provincial and federal members.

#26 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 06:53 PM

Thank you Baro

Your comments are helpful in understanding that there might be a different expectation between municipal NDP'rs and provincial and federal members.


Is that true though? The NDP always says it's fighting for families, fighting for the working people etc., but then they try to accomplish that by attacking corporations ("they need to pay their fair share of taxes!") that actually employ people.

It doesn't help taxing corporations in marginal industries like forestry (or preventing raw log exports), that just put plants out of business. While I'm on the subject of raw logs, is the NDP in favour of only exporting refined petroleum products, so you get that value-added employment? We could always build lots of refineries. Then we could build three pipelines from the Tar Sands to Texas, one with crude, one with gasoline, one with jet fuel or whatever.

And don't get me going on banks, credit card companies, airlines, cable co's, telcos etc. If the NDP or any government would take some steps to slightly de-regulate them (with proper safeguards in place) and allow some foreign competition, consumer prices would be lower for ALL Canadians using these services. Isn't that helping the middle class?
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#27 Sparky

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Posted 28 September 2011 - 11:09 PM

^ I am no political scientist, but I do know the difference between left and right. The valid point that Baro has made, however is that the political goals of the federal, provincial, and municipal factions of the NDP party may in fact be different from one another.

There is no doubt that a different political goal between socialism and capitalism exists as you have suggested.

That is why Baro's comment is so very relevant. Although the NDP is connected and operates at every political level......perhaps the philosophies at the various levels differ.

Municipal and School Board politics differ greatly from provincial and federal politics that govern the topics that you have suggested. These elected bodies do not govern industry taxes and benefits, but still draw the organized interest of a socialized ideal.

I think what I am attempting to understand is how these three or four levels of democracy appear to be organizationally connected within the New Democratic Party, and the right wing parties do not appear connected at any level.

The Conservatives do not appear to be connected at any level, the Liberals have some connection federally and provincially (David Basi, Erik Bornmann, and Mark Marrisen may have strained that recently though) but they do not appear organized at the municipal level.

The NDP are organized at the municipal level....the question is how are they connected to their provincial and federal counterparts......or are they?

#28 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 05:47 AM

Municipal and School Board politics differ greatly from provincial and federal politics that govern the topics that you have suggested. These elected bodies do not govern industry taxes and benefits, but still draw the organized interest of a socialized ideal.


Sure they do. And local governments like to stick commercial properties with as much as 5x the property tax as residential properties. For no good reason. Why should the corner real estate office pay 5x the taxes as my home of the same size? He might generate a little bit of vehicle traffic, but other than that, doesn't use municipal services any more than my home will.

http://www.bclocalne.../126355833.html

Island stats on the gap: http://www.cfib-fcei...nts/bc09191.pdf
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#29 Sparky

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 05:59 AM

^ You are correct about there being a property tax "gap" but that has existed forever and is not the direct result of any political leaning. Most cities and municipalities have higher "mil" rates for commercial properties than they do for residential. That is a non partisan mind set.

#30 Barra

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Posted 29 September 2011 - 03:44 PM

Barra, would you know if the NDP candidates/Victoria Labour Council receives financial support from unions or publicly-funded organizations?


Individual unions sometimes make a financial contribution. But they make their offices and phones available for use by volunteers to phone NDP members and the story is that towards the end of the last campaign a big group of labour volunteers from Vancouver came over to erect lawn signs all over the city.

Also - NDP candidates make a practice of using NDP membership lists for phoning and mailing. I contacted the Office of the Information and Privacy Commissioner to complain about this practice. As a party member I provide my personal info for matters related to the provincial and federal parties - not for municipal campaigning. Under the Act, this would be considered a purpose that is inconsistent with the Act. I pursued a complaint for a while, spoke to a party official who agreed that the practice is inappropriate, but didn't take it any farther. Now its happening again - just got a mailer from Dean's campaign.
Pieta VanDyke

#31 Mike K.

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Posted 30 September 2011 - 12:09 PM

The conversation about the privacy infringement of pro-NDP Mayor Dean Fortin and NDP-supportive councillors, allegedely accessing NDP voter lists, has been moved to a new thread at http://vibrantvictor...read.php?t=5385 .

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#32 martini

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Posted 08 October 2011 - 11:55 AM

I"m a died in the wool npd voter, but I HATE the ndp machine at the city level. The candidates are always extreme conservatives (in the sense that they don't want to change the status quo of this being a no-fun retirement community for the wealthy) and never accomplish anything remotely resembling a progressive socialist ideology.

I'd love to see some real social democrats in office, ones that actually work to lower the cost of living in the city. Encourage more good non-government middle class jobs, cheaper housing, better transit, real environmental initiatives rather than green-washed wastes of money.

Fighting every development, making the city unattractive for business, and wasting piles on money on dead-end study after study is not doing anything to improve the lives of the working class.

Nice post.
I was a NDP supporter all my adult life.
That ended when both federal and municipal interjected themselves at the municipal level.
That and the fact that blind party loyalty seemed to trump any reasoning or logic.
I let them know how I felt and removed myself completely from the NDP.

That was not any easy thing to go through. It was like a divorce.

 



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