1101 replies to this topic

[aastra]

Shocking and unexpected turn of events:*

 

Times-Colonist
June 27, 2019
 

"Hyper-abundant" wildlife brings call for senior governments to help

...the province should be helping with all manner of wildlife whose populations are exploding.

Deer are a huge problem on the Gulf Islands...

...there are an estimated 6,000 deer on Salt Spring Island alone.

Metchosin Mayor... said grey squirrels are the bane of his existence these days.

"...they are having a serious impact on our berry crops..."

"Bears are continuing to cause a problem...

...five residents have lost sheep to marauding bears and "they’re on the increase."

CRD chair... said not enough is being done to manage geese...

...there are between 4,000 and 6,000 Canada geese in the region.

 

*not really, these overpopulation issues are everywhere, involving both native and invasive species alike

 

Some current news stories:
July 2, 2019 - Iguana population in Florida grows as temperatures stay high, residents urged to "kill"

July 3, 2019 - Denver (Colorado) residents protest killing of Canada geese at city parks to manage the growing population

June 24, 2019 - Canada is losing a war against feral pigs that are infesting the Prairies

June 21, 2019 - Get used to living with coyotes in Newfoundland, wildlife expert says

June 19, 2019 - Invasive Muscovy ducks taking over native wildlife habitats in Florida

June 9, 2019 - St. Andrews, New Brunswick seeks solutions for deer overpopulation

 

The deer overpopulation stories are almost innumerable. Absolutely everywhere. FYI: check out Oak Bay's 2019 deer study progress report here...
 

Edited by aastra, 04 July 2019 - 08:39 PM.

[todd]

I told you so.....

 

 ....The report claims that 95 percent of an Oak Bay deer’s time is spent within a 0.64 square kilometre range. Half of their time is spent in an even smaller 0.14 square kilometre core home range.

 

“Those are really small home range sizes,” Fisher said. “I’m not sure if they’re smaller than home range sizes in the wild because we don’t really have great estimates of black tailed deer in the wild, but I’m still struck by the fact deer tend to linger around a pretty small area.” ...

 

 

https://www.vicnews....says-scientist/

 

[aastra]

I'm not trying to give them a hard time, but several pages of that report are spent describing the methodology for counting deer in 10 square kilometres of Oak Bay neighbourhoods. And the result is an indefinite count of somewhere between 72 and 128. Meanwhile, we can read other wildlife management reports that purport to reliably estimate the number of Minke whales in the world's oceans, or the number of polar bears in the arctic, or the number of wildebeest in Kruger National Park, etc.

 

Come on. When we're talking about doing a count of a singular large wild animal in a specific designated environment, counting deer in Oak frickin' Bay would surely qualify as one of the least challenging counts in the entire world. Heck, I'd love to know what other count would be easier. Maybe counting the elephants in your attic? Counting stray cats in a large abandoned house would probably be more difficult than counting deer in Oak Bay.

 

I present the following juxtaposition for your edification.

 

 

Victoria News
February 25, 2019

That... might be why certain Oak Bay residents feel the deer are out of control.... it’s an example of the representative heuristic – a phenomena where humans believe there’s a lot of something because they see it often.

...the small home ranges mean some residents are seeing the same deer frequently, not an abundance of deer.

"We’re talking about 100 deer in this population..."

"It’s a mistake to automatically assume that there’s an unnatural and unprecedented increase in deer in the Oak Bay region, because none of us have the time frame or the proper temporal scale to make that call..."

 

 

Canadian Press
Dec 29, 2013

"I get regular updates," Mr. Jensen said, as he gestured to his cellphone. "There it is, the deer count, 38 so far."

That number of dead deer in Oak Bay in 2013 is a huge increase, Mr. Jensen said, considering there were zero reported deer deaths in 2008. But the number has been rising steadily over the years.

 

So... the deer were always there in city neighbourhoods, but you just couldn't see them or see any evidence of them? And you just couldn't find their carcasses? Maybe the urban deer were burying their dead prior to the late 2000s, but then suddenly decided to abandon the practice?

 

Note to self-proclaimed deer lovers/nature lovers: the authorities claim the deer population in Oak Bay is around 100 (impossible to know for sure, because the conditions in Oak Bay make it such an overwhelming challenge to get an accurate count). Meanwhile, the authorities also claim that dozens of deer carcasses are removed from the streets and yards and swimming pools and fence tops of Oak Bay EVERY FRICKIN' YEAR. If this is what deer lovers enjoy then I don't even want to speculate about the horrors inside the minds and hearts of deer haters.

 

 

National Post
July 19, 2013

"I think it's fair to say the process we’re using right now is a "cull by car," " said Nils Jensen, mayor of Oak Bay, the poshest of Victoria’s 13 municipalities.

Only five years ago, Oak Bay passed an entire year without discovering a single deer carcass within its borders. In 2012, by contrast, city staff hauled 23 dead deer out of Oak Bay, with another 11 corpses racked up in early 2013.

Deer have drowned in swimming pools, been disembowelled by cars...

"We’ve had deer that are jumping over a fence, they haven’t made it and the pointy part of the fence pierces their midsection and they’re hanging when we get there,” said Deputy Chief Constable Kent Thom, a spokesman for the Oak Bay Police.

In cases where the animal cannot be revived, he added, police will be summoned to finish them off with a pistol or shotgun, one of the few times Oak Bay Police officers are ever called upon to discharge their firearms.

 

Seriously, if this stuff floats your boat then seek professional help ASAP.

Edited by aastra, 05 July 2019 - 09:32 AM.

[aastra]

I've noted before that one of the keys to media literacy is recognizing how your jurisdiction's unique local issues are often unique local issues in a thousand other jurisdictions, too. Google search for urban deer in Pittsburgh, urban deer in Philadelphia, urban deer in New York City, urban deer in Detroit, urban deer in St. Louis, urban deer in San Francisco, urban deer in New Brunswick.... the news stories and wildlife reports go on and on. A lifetime worth of reading, no exaggeration.

 

Methinks the following excerpts from a Minneapolis news article provide a tidy summary of the situation:

 

 

TwinCities.com
January 8, 2011

Deer are everywhere in the (Minneapolis/St. Paul) metro area — and cities are fighting back

Where's the best deer-hunting area in Minnesota?

Chances are, you’re living in it.

The state's greatest concentrations of deer are in the Twin Cities metro area and a part of southeastern Minnesota...
 

SPOILED BY CIVILIZATION

For 100 years, the deer population has grown along with the United States population. About 500,000 white-tailed deer lived in the U.S. in the early 1900s — a number that has exploded into 25 million today.

Like people, deer have migrated to cities. "Cities have so many advantages for them," said Bryan Lueth, urban wildlife manager for the Department of Natural Resources.

Cities have no predators, such as wolves or rifle-shooting hunters. Food is plentiful — in homeowners' gardens. And the lure of the city is irresistible in winter.

 

 

But Oak Bay's situation is unique. No doubt.

[Jason-L]

I'm not trying to give them a hard time, but several pages of that report are spent describing the methodology for counting deer in 10 square kilometres of Oak Bay neighbourhoods. And the result is an indefinite count of somewhere between 72 and 128. Meanwhile, we can read other wildlife management reports that purport to reliably estimate the number of Minke whales in the world's oceans, or the number of polar bears in the arctic, or the number of wildebeest in Kruger National Park, etc.

 

Come on. When we're talking about doing a count of a singular large wild animal in a specific designated environment, counting deer in Oak frickin' Bay would surely qualify as one of the least challenging counts in the entire world. Heck, I'd love to know what other count would be easier. Maybe counting the elephants in your attic? Counting stray cats in a large abandoned house would probably be more difficult than counting deer in Oak Bay.

 

I present the following juxtaposition for your edification.

 

 

 

So... the deer were always there in city neighbourhoods, but you just couldn't see them or see any evidence of them? And you just couldn't find their carcasses? Maybe the urban deer were burying their dead prior to the late 2000s, but then suddenly decided to abandon the practice?

 

Note to self-proclaimed deer lovers/nature lovers: the authorities claim the deer population in Oak Bay is around 100 (impossible to know for sure, because the conditions in Oak Bay make it such an overwhelming challenge to get an accurate count). Meanwhile, the authorities also claim that dozens of deer carcasses are removed from the streets and yards and swimming pools and fence tops of Oak Bay EVERY FRICKIN' YEAR. If this is what deer lovers enjoy then I don't even want to speculate about the horrors inside the minds and hearts of deer haters.

 

 

Seriously, if this stuff floats your boat then seek professional help ASAP.

Interestingly, in 2011 UVic removed the bunnies ... and a short time later, the deer population in Oak Bay started rising.

[aastra]

Or did it?

[aastra]

Are you speculating as to whether the presence and/or habits of the invasive rabbits were somehow impeding the advance of deer into the city? Interesting food for thought, but the rabbits were localized to a few well-separated sites for the most part, were they not?

[aastra]

Methinks it would be really interesting to know if successive generations of urban deer get better at living in the urban environment. In other words, is the carnage increasing, decreasing, or holding steady over time? Do the urban deer get hit by cars, drown in swimming pools, get stuck in fences etc. less frequently? Heck, do the urban deer populations gradually demonstrate less hostility toward dogs and people?

 

If the scope of the carnage is gradually diminishing over the years then I suppose we could use that to rationalize our tolerance of the current situation.

[todd]

 
I don't even want to speculate about the horrors inside the minds and hearts of deer haters.
 

Mostly just inconvenient common sense.

[aastra]

Looking back in this thread I can see that I've made many of these same points before, almost word for word. I should stay away from this topic.

 

So whatever happened to Bingo?

[todd]

Have we sent off the invoice for our report yet?

[mbjj]

I don't know what the answer is, but this year so much of our garden has been consumed by deer. We're in Fairfield, not really that far from downtown, but we've had to put up quite a lot of deer netting. Never had such a problem in the forty years we've been here. Just last week saw a doe and two fawns crossing all the Cook St. traffic.

[LJ]

"We’ve had deer that are jumping over a fence, they haven’t made it and the pointy part of the fence pierces their midsection and they’re hanging when we get there,” said Deputy Chief Constable Kent Thom, a spokesman for the Oak Bay Police.

In cases where the animal cannot be revived, he added, police will be summoned to finish them off with a pistol or shotgun, one of the few times Oak Bay Police officers are ever called upon to discharge their firearms.

 

I had this exact scenario play out in my back yard. A pistol was used.

[LJ]

I'm not trying to give them a hard time, but several pages of that report are spent describing the methodology for counting deer in 10 square kilometres of Oak Bay neighbourhoods. And the result is an indefinite count of somewhere between 72 and 128. Meanwhile, we can read other wildlife management reports that purport to reliably estimate the number of Minke whales in the world's oceans, or the number of polar bears in the arctic, or the number of wildebeest in Kruger National Park, etc.

 

Come on. When we're talking about doing a count of a singular large wild animal in a specific designated environment, counting deer in Oak frickin' Bay would surely qualify as one of the least challenging counts in the entire world. Heck, I'd love to know what other count would be easier. Maybe counting the elephants in your attic? Counting stray cats in a large abandoned house would probably be more difficult than counting deer in Oak Bay

 

If they shot them every time they saw them it would make counting them so much easier.

Edited by LJ, 05 July 2019 - 07:41 PM.

[todd]

The concept of sterilizing an entire population is far more creepy to me than a cull still definitely killing them just unborn. Makes a lot more sense to me to use them for food as we have no idea what’s going on why we are here but the food chain is obvious.

Edited by todd, 07 September 2019 - 11:37 AM.

[RFS]

Super creepy and weird and probably requires way more effort, all for some misguided moralism.

[Victoria Watcher]

Nobody is entirely sure what brought an explosion of urban deer into Greater Victoria’s core neighbourhoods over the last 10 years


huh? we know what brought it. inaction. we stopped culling or capturing them.


she isn’t so much mad as she is angry?


https://capnews.ca/d...ocontraception/

who writes that?

Black tailed deer are native to what is now Vancouver Island,


what?


Oak Bay’s chief of police would probably agree, having been hospitalized by a deer


huh?

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 23 September 2019 - 05:32 AM.

[Mike K.]

Indeed, it was years of not knowing/deciding collectively on what to do with them once the population rose to a high enough number.

There was the “we're taking over their natural habitats” theory, which makes zero sense, but predominantly their population grew due to emotion (not wanting to deal with them). That is, until cougars started showing up, and cyclists started colliding with feral deer. Add to that the threat of Lyme disease and we finally saw some government action (no, the people hunting them with bows weren’t government).

[jasmineshinga]

Let me eat them! Get the local bowhunters together and allow tagless hunting, the population will drop rapidly.

[laconic]

Deer can be difficult to spot. In the spring the does kick out the yearlings and keep the bucks away from their new fawns. In the fall they all tend to group back together for a while.

 

The "Dockside Deer" have birthed generations in the empty part of the property. The fawns stay inside the fenced area until this time of the year when they're large enough to escape the fencing and move to other areas. The group has a range that extends around Dockside, the park by the Shell station, the back garden of Promontory and through to the Roundhouse area.

 

Even with a great overview, for most of the day it is almost impossible to spot any deer in the Dockside property. Even if you see them, unless you marked them all you'd have trouble identifying them since they wander quite a bit.

 

The (upside down) picture below is from the park by the Shell station a couple of days ago. It is the first time I've seen this year's crop of three fawns outside of the Dockside area. There were four more bucks testing their new antlers out of frame. It must have been their yearly fall deer AGM.

Attached Images

•