54 replies to this topic

[Jessica Van der Veen]

Thank you Jessica. Could you please clarify what a "phone-through" is?

A: A "phone through" is when professional canvassers are given a script and phone through the membership lists in a given area. At no time are the lists released from party central and at no time is information about individual's responses to calls relayed in a way that could identify those people responding.

For your information, please read posts # 31 and #34 above.

The title of your post " Rumours versus facts on party lists: Let's not campaign nasty" would suggest that you might believe that the information contained in these posts may not be factual.

A: Yeah I do believe it may not be factual. If it was factual, people would have the integrity to use their real names and give substantive information on their allegations. How do we know they are not Liberal employees?

Questioning the integrity of a political party while lacking the integrity to use your real name -- really, people ought to think more critically about what they read if the poster is anonymous. If the poster is anonymous, I would assume that they have something to hide and I would trust their post far less.

How do you suppose this young gentleman was able to receive this kind of correspondance from the candidate? Accident?

A: Likely this young gentleman's area was a swing (close) vote last time or (also likely) it was a high turnout area so these citizens are being targetted. This is just conjecture, but campaign experience would lead me to believe that this may be the case. Certainly I would be targetting swing areas and high turnout areas in any campaign.

New Democrats (being members of both Federal and Provincial parties) get a lot of mail. Why would we ever release our lists and risk offending our donor base? New Democrats are pretty good at picking up the phone and have a passionate, civil discussion when something is bothering them about the party. Casting aspersions on a blog isn't the best way to find out what's going on. It was only luck that someone tipped me off about this thread.

Like I said: To the best of my knowledge our lists are not released.

J

[Jessica Van der Veen]

Further to what Sparky wrote above, the BC NDP admonished Vision Vancouver municipal candidates for gaining access to the lists and using them to solicit support in 2008.

Thanks Mike. I know. That is called a learning experience. If someone steals or leaks a list, that is very wrong and I hope that never happens again.

My point is that this it is not party policy to release the lists and to suggest that it is party policy is wrong.

To have a blog thread with over 40 unsubstantiated posts by mostly anonymous posters is ugly and unneccessary partisan campaigning in an election that is supposed to be non-partisan.

People should get back to work on the issues and on getting those candidates who share their values elected fair and square.

[Bob Fugger]

Oh, please. Just because this board is semi-anonymous doesn't automatically mean that the claims are any less true. Bernard makes no attempt to shield his identity (he's given out his phone number on this very board); nor does Mike K.

Rather than trying to cloud the issue and deflect criticism with spurious arguments, why don't you consider the possibility that your party brothers and sisters aren't saints and possibly misusing personal information and help get to the bottom of it?

[martini]

New Democrats are pretty good at picking up the phone and have a passionate, civil discussion when something is bothering them about the party.

Trust me, I tried everything to get feedback directly from my MLA, MP and other NDP members.
I will give my MP credit for answering me personally and eloquently, but it was too late; the damage had been done.

A: Yeah I do believe it may not be factual. If it was factual, people would have the integrity to use their real names and give substantive information on their allegations. How do we know they are not Liberal employees?

I actually find that both demeaning and offensive.
This is not an 'anonymous' behaving board. Many members are long term and it's no secret who many of us are.

I am an ex NDP who has never supported the Liberal Party a day in my life.
I have only supported the Green Party during the last election.
Otherwise I am only supporting nonpartisan at this point.

[Sparky]

A letter arrived at our house today from Dean Fortin that could only have happened through use of the NDP membership list.

Thank you for your response Jessica.

Here is a fact however Jessica, that is posted by someone who is not anonymous. If you are the South Island Regional Rep for the Provincial Executive of the BCNDP, you could do us all a favour and ask the candidate in question how he obtained the address of the NDP member who received the letter.

If the address did not come from the NDP membership list, that should clear this rumour up.

[rjag]

To have a blog thread with over 40 unsubstantiated posts by mostly anonymous posters is ugly and unneccessary partisan campaigning in an election that is supposed to be non-partisan.

OMG! That has to be the quote of the day! If there is any partisan politics at the Municipal Level it is solely the NDP......have you even looked at the slate of candidates and their background?

About 90% of them wear orange underwear!



So the NDP are not helping and supporting David Cubberly, Nils Jensen, Marianne Alto, Dean Fortin, Lynne Hunter etc etc?????

Priceless!

[Mike K.]

New Democrats (being members of both Federal and Provincial parties) get a lot of mail. Why would we ever release our lists and risk offending our donor base?

But the list was released, your donor base was offended, and the BC NDP's president sent a letter to Vancouver's municipal politicians requesting that they shape up before further damage is done. If Public Eye Online never caught wind of the letter, the public would have never known that this was taking place.

Jessica, with all due respect, you're making it sound like this never, ever happens, but it clearly did as recently as the previous municipal elections in BC, and there are allegations that this has/is happened/happening on the south Island.

Until NDP supporters who have no affiliation whatsoever with municipal politicians understand why they are receiving addressed mail, while their neighbours who support other provincial parties are not, it is fair to assume that some form of contact list exists that contains mailing information for pro-NDP voters. How that list is propagated is what we're waiting to hear from municipal politicians involved and/or the NDP.

If your (the NDP's) response is that we are all "secret Liberals" talking nonsense, that is fine and we'll take the response at face value. But this issue is one of privacy violations, not partisan politics. Regardless of political stripe, any contact list maintained by a political party ought to be protected and not accessible to individuals with a loose affiliation with that party. What's happened with the NDP's list in the past and what is alleged to be happening again is serious and warrants more than a "shows over, nothing to see here" form of response.

[Bob Fugger]

If your (the NDP's) response is that we are all "secret Liberals" talking nonsense, that is fine and we'll take the response at face value.

I am absolutely gobsmakced that someone who fancies/fancied themselves a "serious" candidate for the House of Commons would suggest that members of this board are somehow in cahoots or are actually Liberal conspiracists trying to make trouble for NDP-affiliated local candidates. It's just so bush league.

[Bingo]

Now we are finding out that a report on the seismic safety of the Victoria Fire Hall was available on March 10, 2010, but was not promptly dealt with.

I wonder how many people would have seen the replacement of the Johnson Street Bridge as the number-one infrastructure priority had they known about the decaying condition of the firehall? Would they have voted differently in the referendum?

Let's hope we do not have a major earthquake in the near future, as that would quickly re-arrange ALL of our infrastructure priorities.

read;
http://johnsonstreetbridge.org/?p=2066

[Bernard]

It should be pointed out that the NDP list has only been made available to one of the NDP members that is running in the City of Victoria and not all of them. Beyond the fact the data was not supposed to be used, it has not been shared fairly among the NDP.

Having asked some of the NDP members running, they have not been offered the list for their campaign.

[ZGsta]

Now we are finding out that a report on the seismic safety of the Victoria Fire Hall was available on March 10, 2010, but was not promptly dealt with.

I wonder how many people would have seen the replacement of the Johnson Street Bridge as the number-one infrastructure priority had they known about the decaying condition of the firehall? Would they have voted differently in the referendum?

Let's hope we do not have a major earthquake in the near future, as that would quickly re-arrange ALL of our infrastructure priorities.

read;
http://johnsonstreetbridge.org/?p=2066

Did you post this in the wrong thread or something?

[martini]

So the NDP are not helping and supporting David Cubberly, Nils Jensen, Marianne Alto, Dean Fortin, Lynne Hunter etc etc?????

Add Pam Madoff to the list.

This was why I finally left the NDP.
Our last by-election was the nail in the coffin.

No one had a snowball's chance in hell against Alto, and neither did the JSB referendum with Victoria's NDP backing and endorsements. Especially MLAs and our MP.

[Sparky]

Hi -- I heard there was some nasty campaign rumours being spread. Here to help clear them up.

For the record: To the very best of my knowledge, nobody is given access NDP member/supporters' lists except for the Provincial and Federal NDP (we are a united party). The lists are the most important asset the party has.

An NDP member in good standing who is running for Municipal Councillor or for School Trustee can apply to the Provincial Executive and (if approved) can pay head office to do a phone-through of the lists in their area. At no time are the lists or personal information released to the candidate or anyone else.

Thank you for your kind attention. Please resume campaigning on the issues that matter to the lower island.

JVDV, South Island Regional Rep for the Provincial Executive of the BCNDP.

ps. If you hear this sort of thing in the future, please don't hesitate to phone me and check in. I'd be happy to help.

Thank you for your response Jessica.

Here is a fact however Jessica, that is posted by someone who is not anonymous. If you are the South Island Regional Rep for the Provincial Executive of the BCNDP, you could do us all a favour and ask the candidate in question how he obtained the address of the NDP member who received the letter.

If the address did not come from the NDP membership list, that should clear this rumour up.

So we are in the last week of the election Jessica, don't you think it would be fair to respond to my post, or are you just spreading a nasty rumour?

[Sparky]

Anyone care to scan and post a copy of correspondence that was addressed to you (not junk mail) from a City of Victoria candidate in this 2011 election? You will need to include the addressed envelope, if there was one. Please blank any names and addresses.

[Jill]

During the City of Victoria by-election last year, we received at least two phone calls composed of pre-recorded messages by Marianne Alto. We were not residents of Victoria and had not been for several years, so our names could not have been taken from the voters list. We figured out that we were being contacted because we were, at that time, members of the NDP. We also received at least one piece of campaign literature through the mail. My memory is less clear about the last municipal election proper, but I feel reasonably confident that we were contacted by Dean Fortin's campaign, including a pre-recorded message on election day, urging us to get out and vote. I don't think the calls we received conform to the description of a "phone through" as outlined by Jessica van der Veen.