9623 replies to this topic

[VicHockeyFan]

I honestly wonder how many people take the bus that have a insured, available car sitting in their driveway. I'm sure not many. But I guess they may decide not to purchase that second car if they have good transit.

“You try to be competitive where you can with the automobile.

“People are very sensitive to travel-time variations and increases. We find that more than price and other factors, if it takes too long or if it’s not predictable, then they’ll tend to stay with their car.”

Bus service boost proposed for West Shore
Higher fares, property taxes and provincial grant will pay for expansion
Bill Cleverley, Times Colonist
Published: Tuesday, April 10, 2007

A transit plan that calls for more rush hour buses between Langford and downtown Victoria will be before Greater Victoria transit commissioners for approval Tuesday.

The proposal is part of the fall service plan due to go into effect Sept. 4.

Under the plan, transit service is to be expanded, paying particular attention to the rapidly growing West Shore communities. “It’s targeting all of the growth pressure,” said Ron Drolet, B.C. Transit senior vice-president.


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B.C. Transit is paying more attention to the West Shore as population there grows. Service needs to be more convenient to attract more riders, transit officials say.
Times Colonist

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“You try to be competitive where you can with the automobile.

“People are very sensitive to travel-time variations and increases. We find that more than price and other factors, if it takes too long or if it’s not predictable, then they’ll tend to stay with their car.”

Expansion plans include:

• During rush hour, buses travelling between the Langford terminus and downtown Victoria would run every five minutes in whatever direction most of the traffic is going, and every 10 minutes in the opposite direction. Service in both directions would be every 15 minutes at other times. On weekends, service would be more frequent than it is now, and hours of operation would be extended.

• Increases in local community bus services to connect with the rapid bus service. (Buses would serve major Colwood and Langford neighbourhoods every 15 minutes — now generally every 30 minutes or less — and 30-minute service would be provided to Metchosin.) Service to Triangle Mountain, Selwyn and Langford Meadows would be increased to every 30 minutes and service would be extended to new areas.

Other planned service increases include:

• Major routes in the core to address traffic congestion or capacity issues, and to increase service in the shoulder period.

• Route extension of the northern portion of the 24/25 bus to provide better connections to future McKenzie Express buses and to growth centres in the Quadra/McKenzie and University Heights areas.

• Improved service to Victoria airport.

The service improvements translate to about an eight per cent increase in conventional bus service on the major routes and community bus service in the West Shore.

Over the past three years the Victoria commission, wrestling with tight budgets, has been making only modest improvements to service, such as introducing community bus service to lower-density areas on the West Shore and the Saanich Peninsula.

Response to those initiatives has been good, says a report going to the commission.

Total passenger trips has increased by more than two million in the last two years.

Last week, for the first time in more than five years, the province announced approximately $600,000 in funding to offset the costs of service expansion to high-growth areas.

The commission raised fares April 1 and increased property taxes to pay for expansion plans that include acquiring more than 40 new buses over the next two years.

Adult cash fare increased by 25 cents to $2.25 for a one-zone trip and $3 for two zones. Youth and senior fares went up by 15 cents to $1.40 for one zone and $2.25 for two.

Fares for handyDART, the service for those needing assistance with public transportation, increased in line with conventional fares to $2.25 for a one-zone trip and $3 for a two-zone trip.

The transit commission has also agreed to increase Greater Victoria homeowners’ property taxes by about $11 — based on the assessed value of a typical home — to pay for transit improvements.

[Mike K.]

Commissioners approve upgraded transit plan

Times Colonist staff

Greater Victoria transit commissioners have approved a fall service plan that will focus on providing increased service to the rapidly growing West Shore. Expansion plans include:
• During rush hour, buses travelling between the Langford terminus and downtown Victoria will run every five minutes in whatever direction most of the traffic is going, and every 10 minutes in the opposite direction. Service in both directions will be every 15 minutes at other times.

Service on weekends will be more frequent and hours of operation would be extended.

• Increases in local community bus services to connect with the rapid bus service. Buses will serve major Colwood and Langford neighbourhoods every 15 minutes — now generally every 30 minutes or less — and 30-minute service would be provided to Metchosin. Service to Triangle Mountain, Selwyn and Langford Meadows is to be increased to every 30 minutes and service will be extended to new areas.

Other planned include:

• Major routes in the core to address

service

increases traffic congestion or capacity issues and to increase service in the shoulder period.

• Route extension of the northern portion of the 24/25 bus to provide better connections to future McKenzie Express buses and to growth centres in the Quadra/McKenzie and University Heights areas.

• Improved service to Victoria airport.

[Mike K.]

Mayor: Barren bus stops a blight
Saanich’s Leonard looks for ways to make that wait for the next bus more inviting

BY BILL CLEVERLEY Times Colonist staff

More people might be encouraged to ride buses if bus stops were more than a post in the ground, says Saanich Mayor Frank Leonard.

“It bothers me, even in our own municipality, and I’ve been there a long time so I have to take some of the blame for it, that a lot of bus stops look like a pole in the dirt at the side of the road,” Leonard said at a recent Greater Victoria transit meeting.

“With a carrot, maybe we’d all start fixing up these bus stops to be better environments and at the same time get some consistency,” Leonard said in a later interview.

Leonard wasn’t talking about the bus stops on major routes where advertisers will pay to build shelters, but the stops on the side streets and feeder routes.

“There it’s almost a pole in the dirt on the side of the road. That’s not going to attract ridership. It doesn’t make our customers feel like we care, that their business is valued and we want their business. We put so much effort inside the bus but if it’s unpleasant waiting for the bus we’re just not going to attract the customers,” he said.

The stops are a municipal responsibility, but municipalities, including Saanich, might be more willing to make them more attractive — perhaps even consider installing lighting or benches — if transit had a program of matching municipal funds for improvements.

There is a small cost-share program in which transit pays 50 per cent of the cost of making bus stops accessible — putting in a small pad so someone can wheel from the sidewalk to the pad.

“I think a lot of us would move quicker if there was a small cost share just to bring them up to some sort of standard,” Leonard said.

“I think we need to improve the environment in which people wait for a bus. Standing is a difficult thing for some people and they do need a bench. I think lighting is an issue and Carmanah and other firms have come up with these solar-powered lights,” Leonard said.

“So I’d like to see them put together a cost share program and a set of standards so that you could go to one standard, say a concrete pad, or a metal bench which is standard to all bus stops; or a sign with routing as another element and then even lighting as an element. So you’d have ingredients, and then the more the municipality put into the stop, the more cost sharing from transit.”

It’s an idea that has merit, say representatives from some Saanich community associations.

The Cordova Bay Community Association has already partnered with Saanich in installing a bench at one bus stop on Cordova Bay Road at Maxine Lane and is considering a similar partnership for one at Galey Way this year, said association president Roger Stonebanks. He didn’t know if the improvements would attract new riders.

“But those who do ride the bus appreciate it because there’s somewhere to sit and wait. Will it attract more people? I don’t know. That’s the great challenge of the time,” Stonebanks said.

Gorge Tillicum Association president Paul Gerrard thinks it’s a great idea.

“I think if you make the infrastructure more comfortable and available for transit riders you’re probably going to get more transit riders. I think it’s a simple thing. Unfortunately we’re all in our cars and everyone seems to think we should be putting money into highways,” Gerrard said.

Leonard said if transit was in partnership in the cost of improving the bus stops then it might think twice about moving them as well.

Transit planner Mike Davis said he would have a report to the commission on bus stops next month.

Leonard said he’d like to see an improvement program in place soon.

“I’d like to see something in place by June, so come fall we can do a lot more than what we’re doing now,” he said.

[Holden West]

I get a kick out of Frank Leonard talking "cost sharing". He's all for it when it suits him.

[rayne_k]

I think Mr. Leonard is on to something, I think all bus stops deserve at least a roof and bench.. But now I'm going to take it a step further and suggest what should be done to major routes - ie the planned rapid transit corridor.

Imho comfortable, fast-functioning station facilities matter *alot*, and integrating them with services that get people on and off buses as quickly as possible is essential to making the system appealing to riders - a string of glorified (in name only) bus stops would be a let down.

This is what we need for the busiest stops: Movie: http://www.gzbrt.org/videos/on-off.swf
(it comes from the Guangzhou Rapid bus website: http://www.gzbrt.org/en/stations.asp)

We are not Vancouver with its largely younger population riding the B-Lines to UBC or Richmond. We've got enough older folks (and likely always will) who are slow getting on and off that all-door, level boarding would make a huge difference for them and everyone else, including those with strollers - plus it gets people waiting for the bus up off the ground (and avoiding splashes during our increasingly wet winter season).

The original major bus rapid transit lines have level and fare-paid boarding fixed stations - and for some reason this hasn't translated well to North American rapid bus transit.. But Victoria doesn't have to be like North American transit, we can look broader for better solutions, even within the bus realm.

http://www.nctr.usf.edu/jpt/pdf/JPT%209-3S%20Kantor.pdf
The introduction and page 11 are of interest.

[VicHockeyFan]

I think Mr. Leonard is on to something, I think all bus stops deserve at least a roof and bench..

I agree.

[VicHockeyFan]

Popular bus stops to get facelifts
Transit, muncipalities to share cost of shelters, benches, lighting
Bill Cleverley, Times Colonist
Published: Tuesday, June 26, 2007
Greater Victoria's most used bus stops are in for a makeover.

Under a new plan to be presented at a Victoria Regional Transit Commission meeting Tuesday, the 300 most-used stops around the region will get a series of improvements - everything from accessibility ramps, shelters, schedule information, benches, garbage cans, bike racks and specialized lighting.

B.C. Transit wants to split the cost of the facelifts with area municipalities, and will allocate up to $50,000 this year, and $100,000 in 2008, to get them done.

Each municipality will be provided with a list of the top priority stops needing improvements within its jurisdiction.

"What we'd like to see from an impact or effectiveness point of view is targetting the busier stops - the top 300. We'd like to get through that list as quickly as possible and then move on down from there," said Ron Drolet, transit senior vice-president.

Transit should get a good bang for its buck by targetting the busiest stations.

There are 2,156 stops in the Victoria Regional Transit System with 174,874 boardings and alightings on an average weekday.

About 75 per cent of all this activity happens at only 308 stops, about 14 per cent of the total stops. A further 195 stops accommodate the next 10 per cent of transit activity.

According to the transit report on bus stops, the three most requested amenities at stops are shelters, schedule information and accessibility for disabled customers.

Of the 308 busiest stops, 138 don't have shelters, 78 don't have schedule information, and 17 aren't accessible.

Of the 195 next-busiest stops, 134 don't have shelters, 142 don't have schedule information, and 39 aren't accessible.

Transit intends to bring all those numbers to 100 per cent - the first 308 stops within three years, and the next 195 stops within five years.

Drolet is confident transit can do it.

"I think we can. I expect there will be pressure on us. It will start to grow as people see amenities at some stops," he said.

"Our current standard is pretty basic," he added.

Saanich Mayor Frank Leonard, a transit commissioner who's been calling for funding for bus stop improvements, is pleased with the report.

"I think it's a great start," Leonard said. "We'll get 75 per cent of them done in the first three years and then 85 per cent in the first five years. ... That's a really good start."

In the past, the only funding B.C. Transit offered to municipalities for bus stop improvements was for accessibility issues, on a 50/50 basis.

Transit normally picked up the tab for including schedule information at stops, while shelters were funded through a variety of ways.

There are 389 bus stops with shelters in the system. Installation and maintenance of most shelters is a responsibility of the municipality in which it is located.

Some 244 shelters are owned by municipalities; 129 are installed at high visibility locations through advertising contracts negotiated by the municipalities.

B.C. Transit owns shelters at three locations and the remaining eight are owned and maintained by institutions such as B.C. Ferries or Camosun College or private businesses like Butchart Gardens.



How much the improvements cost on average:
Changes to sidewalks to make them accessible: $6,000
Small standard glass transit shelters: $3,500
Bench: $2,000
Litter container: $1,200
Bike rack: $500

[Mike K.]

Hybrid buses axed from plans
Don Denton/ News staff

By Andrei Bondoreff
News staff
Saanich News

Jul 11 2007

Hybrids may be the future of engine technology, but for now, BC Transit officials believe diesel engine buses are the most cost effective for Capital Region routes.

Over a year ago, BC Transit unveiled three hybrid buses in Victoria as part of a trial to gauge their reliability and efficiency.

Officials optimistically believed that the introduction of the new technology would, “set the standard for fuel efficient, environmentally friendly bus fleets in Canada.”

After careful monitoring, Transit found the buses, which utilize an electric battery power source for low speeds and switch to an internal combustion system for higher speeds, were well suited to Victoria’s stop- and-go urban environment. Fuel savings targets that were set at 20 per cent over the fleet’s 1992-2003 generation of buses, were exceeded by the hybrids and ran, in some cases, as high as 28 per cent.

Compared to the newest Nova Cummins clean diesel buses procured since 2003, however, the hybrids performed with only eight per cent greater fuel efficiency.

Officials determined that the savings realized from hybrids, calculated over the 20-year life expectancy of the buses, could not offset its comparatively expensive purchase price – hybrids cost roughly $800,000 while Nova diesels cost $500,000.

“There is no business case for buying hybrids,” said Ron Drolet, BC Transit vice-president of customer service.

“For now we’re going with Nova buses,” Drolet said. “We do expect hybrids to become the standard once the price differential disappears. My sense is that will take about five years.”

Made in Montreal, the 280-horsepower Nova Cummins diesel buses run on ultra-low sulfur bio-fuel and are lighter and quieter than previous diesels. Nova Bus, which is owned by Volvo, is one of three diesel bus manufacturers in Canada.

BC Transit plans to upgrade its fleet in 2008/2009 and may be purchasing between 85 and 90 new buses for Victoria through a competitive bid process.

[obscurantist]

[url=http://www.martlet.ca/view.php?aid=39572:bcba8]BC Transit ponders late-night bus service[/url:bcba8]

Kim Magi
The Martlet

Late-night bus service to UVic and other parts of Greater Victoria may be an option for students in the near future.

On June 26, members of the Victoria Regional Transit Commission discussed the pros and cons of extending transit service to 1 a.m., 2 a.m. and 2:30 a.m. The Commission has considered adding the service on Saturday only, Friday and Saturday, Thursday to Saturday, and six days per week.

In 2004, a group of students from UVic requested that bus service hours be extended. But increasing the service has significant financial implications. There was not enough financial support from outside parties at the time.

In the past three years, the number of shift workers and people working and enjoying entertainment downtown has increased dramatically. As a result, the Victoria Hotel Association has also asked for longer operation hours.

To operate extended service on the five busiest routes (4, 6, 14, 27/28, 30/31), the annual costs range from $66,000 on Saturdays only until 1 a.m., to $1.25 million to operate six days a week until 2:30 a.m.

Extra drivers would be needed for the service, as well as four additional staff members: maintenance staff at two garages, a dispatch staff member and a road supervisor, said Ron Drolet, BC Transit’s senior vice president of customer service.

UVic is one of the busiest transit destinations in Victoria. Roughly 30 per cent of all transit users have a UPass, and last year there were 4.2 million swipes of a UPass.

Over the next year, BC Transit will closely evaluate public demand for increased transit service. Although the six-days-a-week service will not be implemented right away, the Commission will continue to study the issue.

[amor de cosmos]

i like that idea, it's probably a $20 can ride to uvic from downtown. it would be good on thurs, fri, sat nites but i don't think it woul dbe needed on the rest of the week.

[m0nkyman]

I know that I would have appreciated it when I was going to UVIC in the 80's and worked at a nightclub downtown... I lived close to the uni .... It's not just the people drinking that would be using it, it's also the hotel, bar and restaurant staff that are disproportionately university students.

[Holden West]

it's probably a $20 can ride

Ah, not only is the Beacon Hill watering can a decorative feature it also buses students up to UVic. That's what I call multi use.

[amor de cosmos]

[quote name='Holden West'][quote name='"amor de cosmos":5ff76']it's probably a $20 can ride[/quote]

Ah, not only is the Beacon Hill watering can a decorative feature it also buses students up to UVic. That's what I call multi use.[/quote:5ff76]

CAB! $20 CAB RIDE!!!!!

:smt076 :smt093 :smt076 :smt093

:wink: :razz:

[m0nkyman]

On the bright side, the reference could have been the other can we've been talking about. As in 'going to the can'

[gumgum]

Falcon welcome to try West Shore bus
Times Colonist
Published: Sunday, July 15, 2007

I have commuted from the West Shore to downtown Victoria via public transit for almost two years. My commitment to public transit is largely motivated by environmental concerns. Sadly, these concerns are in direct conflict with family time: A 20-minute drive takes me up to 11/2 hours via transit.

So I would like to issue a challenge to Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon and the Victoria Regional Transit Commission. Can you commute via public transit for one year? You can borrow my bus pass, as I have given up and am taking the car.

Jacqueline Whiteway,

Victoria.


© Times Colonist (Victoria) 2007

[Holden West]

...

LJ, why wouldn't you want a 10-year old on public transit, if s/he is traveling with a friend? (Just curious...)

I was not much older than that when I began taking transit downtown.

[UrbanRail]

Falcon welcome to try West Shore bus
Times Colonist
Published: Sunday, July 15, 2007

I have commuted from the West Shore to downtown Victoria via public transit for almost two years. My commitment to public transit is largely motivated by environmental concerns. Sadly, these concerns are in direct conflict with family time: A 20-minute drive takes me up to 11/2 hours via transit.

So I would like to issue a challenge to Transportation Minister Kevin Falcon and the Victoria Regional Transit Commission. Can you commute via public transit for one year? You can borrow my bus pass, as I have given up and am taking the car.

Jacqueline Whiteway,

Victoria.


© Times Colonist (Victoria) 2007

My advice to the writer, is to publicly challenge Falcon and the transit commission on TV to take transit for a year. I am pretty sure that the media would love that. But you know they will never take the bus, as its "TOO INCONVIENENT FOR THEM!" Besides we wouldnt want to take them away from their SUVs.

[Baro]

Another good example is the 75. Most poeple get it up to the keeting crossroads industrial park but it zig zags all over saanich on its way up there.

There needs to be a balance between covering a wide neighbourhood and actually getting people somewhere in good time. A bus that goes straight up the highway up to the industrial park (where about 75% of the people get off) would be great. We zig zag on and off the highway so much on the way up, but never pick up more than 1-2 people for all the detours.

Slow zig-zagging busses are fine for short local trips, but when you're going from one town to another, just take a straight line or the only people riding the bus are those who have no other options.

The bus shouldn't be a hellish last resort for people who can't afford cars, but an actual efficient alternative. if the bus takes 25-50% more time, I'll still ride it. If it takes 100-200% more time, that's just ridiculous.

PS
You ****ing lazy cyclists who take forever putting your bikes on the front of the bus only to ride the bus for a couple k then spend forever to take their bikes off again arn't making the situation any better.

PPS
I know all the community imput and expert (ie the actual drivers) opinions won't change anything. BC transit planners have a vested interest to keep up the myth that only THEY are educated enough to plan our transit (most get out of school and move here and don't even know the city and never rode a bus) so they will NEVER listen to any advise given by citizens or drivers. No matter how logical, no matter how much anyone spells it out for them in a ironclad logical by the numbers approch, they will always be ignored by the transit planners.

[Holden West]

Here's a great videogame for you transit fanatics that simply can't get enough bus action in real life.

It gets slightly more interesting toward the end once it gets into school bus mode:

http://www.youtube.c...h?v=-UZKj3Fmfik

[hungryryno]

Mr. Falcon is mandating BC Transit to commence service between Cowichan Valley and Victoria. His reason? It is the cheapest "fix" to the Malahat because all $$$ is going to Hwy. 99 for the olympics!

It is too late to commence this September, so my guess is September of 2008 this service will start. It will be commuter service to start only to see just how popular it is. Obviously if it takes off with the people expansion to a daily service would follow.

Greyhound Canada is upset over this, but I cannot see why. They do not offer any commuter trips and just recently eliminated the Mill Bay stop on three of its six daily trips (even though they have to drive through Mill Bay anyways).

I don't see how the competion can complain when they really don't compete. When Greyhound runs on the island were operated by Island Coah Lines they actually did have one commute trip from Duncan south to meet work time starts, but cancelled that a long time ago.

Bus types for this new service are questionable at this time. Having said that, 26 double deckers (some are destined for Kelowna)are due to arrive by September of 2008. It is not known who the manufacturer is, but my sources tell me they will be Volvo double-deckers. Volvo owns Prevost who owns Nova Bus, the company BC Transit is currently oredering from. BC Transit's relationship with Dennis is non-existant so I am sure we won't see anymore Dennis double-deckers anytime soon!


All in all this is good news for the Cowichan Valley!