3483 replies to this topic

[Mike K.]

To Barrister’s point, are we sure it’s universally new people, and not people already here?

Kids eventually leave the house. Couples split. Seniors downsize. Workers choose to move closer to the office. Etc.

[dasmo]

Why must we provide housing for “the people that want to move here”?

Because it’s verboten to talk about the effects of immigration on house prices. Perhaps if it’s rebranded as colonization?

[dasmo]

IMO it’s all crocodile tears from our officials. It’s not our woes that motivate their actions it seems.
“Residential investment, as a share of nominal gross domestic product, soared to about 10 per cent at peak times over the past two years”
https://www.theglobe...anadas-economy/

[Barrrister]

Victoria has a greater death rate than birth rate. So it is not natural population increase. The population for the GVA has increased over the last ten years so obviously it is people moving here. Since you already know this it is obvious that you are just doing word salad to obscure the reality. Shame on you Mike, I used to expect more from you.

Edited by Barrrister, 27 July 2022 - 07:28 AM.

[Mike K.]

Victoria has a greater death rate than birth rate. So it is not natural population increase. The population for the GVA has increased over the last ten years so obviously it is people moving here. Since you already know this it is obvious that you are just doing word salad to obscure the reality. Shame on you Mike, I used to expect more from you.

Oh lordy, Barrister. Don’t try that with me.

You know how I got my apartment when I lived downtown? Someone built it. You know how my spouse got hers when she lived downtown? Someone built it, too. Both of us were raised here.

And there are more deaths here than births, possibly because more older/retired people choose to move here, than young couples have children here. If you want to talk statistics, let’s go, but leave the tropes at the door.

[Barrrister]

Oh Lordy Mike, dont care about your apartment (more word salad). The point you were questioning is whether it is people moving here and so lets look at the stats. Population increase and not due to birth rate means that it is people moving here. Divorce rate does not change the population stats. 

 

Maybe it is time to really look at whether endless growth and densification might only benefit the developers and people in the real estate game.

[Nparker]

If you don't build it they won't come.

[Mike K.]

Oh Lordy Mike, dont care about your apartment (more word salad). The point you were questioning is whether it is people moving here and so lets look at the stats. Population increase and not due to birth rate means that it is people moving here. Divorce rate does not change the population stats.

Maybe it is time to really look at whether endless growth and densification might only benefit the developers and people in the real estate game.

It’s simple math, and facts don’t care about your feelings.

A family with two kids 20 years on could be consuming 4 units of housing, but consumed only 1 unit 20 years prior, because mom and dad split, and the kids moved on. Now multiply that by 5,000 households and see what happens.

We’re also living in times when single occupant
residences are in higher demand than they have ever been.

Yeah, the population is growing, but don’t tell us -all- new housing is destined for newcomers, when the facts refute that.

The real issue is we can’t handle local demand plus newcomers very well, and thanks to Langford we hid those pressures for quite some time, but now Langford voters say they’re done with it.

What now? Pretend the pressures don’t exist?

[Mike K.]

If you don't build it they won't come.

Yes they will.

And they’ll outbid you for every local unit of housing.

And the immigrants have to come. Because I guarantee you Barrister’s kids (if he has them) are not the ones cleaning toilets at hotels and restaurants.

[Nparker]

I was being facetious.

[dasmo]

Toilet cleaners aren’t outbidding anyone or buying million dollar homes.
“ Canada is one of the foremost countries in the world for millionaire immigrants to move to, a new study shows.

The New World Wealth report reveals Canada gained 4,000 high net worth individuals (HNWIs) in 2018, the third most of any country in the world.”
https://www.immigrat...ada-study-shows

[Mike K.]

We do realize, that not all immigrants are multi millionaires, yes?

Have none of you grown up in an immigrant household where English wasn’t the first language, and wealth was earned here, not back in the old country? Are we that lacking in context? Because I can fill in the gaps here, and I promise you it will not be poetic.

[dasmo]

Of course. My wife is an immigrant. I wish she was a multi millionaire!

[Mike K.]

Our labour problems are largely a result of cheap labour no longer being in abundance, and so much of that cheap labour was courtesy of immigrants.

Eventually labour trickles up the ladder, and finds better employment. But if there isn’t enough at the bottom end, the results are what we are seeing now.

But sure, stop the supply of new housing. We’re all rich and comfortable in our mansions, what do we need more housing for? Life would be better if we all just lived in mansions, telling others how much empty space we have, etc.

[dasmo]

But we also can’t discount the effects of colonization. Just ask the First Nations. It’s just verboten to talk about in any real way because most of us are immigrants or are only a few degrees of separation from immigrants. This combined with the woke weapons of mass destruction to any public figure that would dare bring this up for consideration.
Not to mention 10% of GDP means we are hooked on building and need customers for the product.

[Mike K.]

Maybe it should be 15% of GDP, because clearly we’re not building enough, and have one of if not the lowest ratio of housing among western nations.

[dasmo]

I’m not proposing anything personally. I actually think more building is fine, I like density and wild space in general even. I built. My dad was a developer. I like immigration. I married an immigrant and hired some. Etc etc… I just think the conversation should be open because we also have a big problem with affordability and all I see is actions that will only make that worse. I lost one of my hires because of this very thing actually. They could trade their condo for a SFD in Calgary. I couldn’t pay him enough to afford that here.

[Mike K.]

The affordability dilemma will only be answered in one way: more developable land.

[Mike K.]

And I also have a friend moving to Calgary. Sold his place here, will buy mortgage-free there.

We’re up the creek on the south Island. Literally. The moment we capped developable land, we sealed our fate. And it’s going to get much, much worse.

[dasmo]

More supply is definitely an obvious part. Less demand can’t be discounted though. Also manipulative practices like the step code and other regulations that greatly impact building costs. And don’t forget the letter everyone gets telling them their house is now worth $2,000,000….