11042 replies to this topic

[HB]

When pedestrians are nearly hit in a crosswalk and shout an obscenity at the driver, is the takeaway from that also that they should just be run over next time, or do you reserve your completely insane sense of "might makes right" driver entitlement exclusively for cyclists?

 

People are genetically programmed with a "fight or flight" mechanism. When someone endangers a person's well-being through gross incompetence, it is not that unusual to have an initial reaction of anger. I'm not saying it is a great thing, or helpful, or that when it happens to me it is a particularly proud moment. I'm just saying it is a pretty normal reaction for someone that nearly got ran over by a car,

 

On the other hand, I'd like to think that for the person who made the error, and nearly seriously harmed someone, that it is in fact not a perfectly normal reaction to think "I'll just run the prick over next time." That sounds more like the reaction of someone who should never be allowed to drive a car under any circumstances.

Usually what I do it apologize to the person because I truly feel bad that I almost hit them...however, when I get a perosn freaking out and screaming at me that I almost hit them I tell them " Yes, I Almost hit you but I didn't....see,I am stopped...if I had hit you , you would be laying on the road , now get the F out of here...sometimes they spend far too much time yelling and screaming about things that I already am aware of.

Edited by HB, 12 May 2017 - 05:16 AM.

[Greg]

In any event, the driver had the wherewithal to stop on a dime. That's pretty good. Clearly the cyclist was not seen. But technically speaking, if he had realized other vehicles were stopping he should have stopped as well. Mistakes were made on both sides, but clearly courtesy got in the way of safety here.

There are freak accidents like this all of the time, right? I mean when you're on the road anything can happen, and sometimes incidents are a combination dumb luck more than anything.

 

Actually Mike, in this case he was in a separated bike lane with a row of parked cars between him and the traffic. There would be no reason at all for him to have "stopped as well." Had the cyclist have been hit here, this would not have been a "freak accident" based on "dumb luck", it would have been the direct fault of the driver.

[Greg]

Usually what I do it apologize to the person because I truly feel bad that I almost hit them...however, when I get a perosn freaking out and screaming at me that I almost hit them I tell them " Yes, I Almost hit you but I didn't....see,I am stopped...if I had hit you , you would be laying on the road , now get the F out of here...sometimes they spend far too much time yelling and screaming about things that I already am aware of.

 

FWIW, I've never lost my temper with a driver who apologized, no matter how ridiculous their initial action. People screw up and make mistakes. But you might be surprised how often drivers, after nearly running you over from their own misunderstanding of the rules of the road, actually double down and tell the cyclist or pedestrian to "get out of the road" like they were trespassing in his front yard, or simply remain blissfully unaware that they nearly killed someone.

[Mike K.]

Yes, it would have been, but common sense has to prevail, too. If you see other users of the road reacting in a certain way that defies the norm, pay attention. Accidents happen when things don't go as planned, right?

[nerka]

But you might be surprised how often drivers, after nearly running you over from their own misunderstanding of the rules of the road, actually double down and tell the cyclist or pedestrian to "get out of the road" like they were trespassing in his front yard, or simply remain blissfully unaware that they nearly killed someone.

I've actually seen this scenario when I lived in Edmonton. Angry women in an SUV yelling at the cyclist she just knocked over.

[VicHockeyFan]

So here is my overall take on the bike lanes.

 

There is no possible way you, as a biker, can go fast in these lanes.  You simply need to be able to react to cars breaking the rules.  Because even if there are less cars doing it today, there are still going to be cars that screw up.  

 

So I think if you agree that you have to ride slowly, then I do not see how these lanes are safer than secondary roads for bikes.  Or the old-fashioned way, where you keep as far right as possible and/or in the painted bike lane.

[nagel]

So here is my overall take on the bike lanes.

 

There is no possible way you, as a biker, can go fast in these lanes.  You simply need to be able to react to cars breaking the rules.  Because even if there are less cars doing it today, there are still going to be cars that screw up.  

 

So I think if you agree that you have to ride slowly, then I do not see how these lanes are safer than secondary roads for bikes.  Or the old-fashioned way, where you keep as far right as possible and/or in the painted bike lane.

Oh my gosh what garbled nonsense.  It's the difference in speeds that makes shared roads a disaster.  If cars are doing 35 and bikes are doing 35 it's actually fairly safe.  When someone is biking 15 and cars are driving 45, that's where there are issues.

 

True statements - "you cannot go fast in these lanes", which means they're working as intended.  They're not intended to be used at 35kph.  Also, yes cyclists will need to be aware of people breaking rules and crossing the lanes when they are not supposed to.  So the risk has been reduced but not totally eliminated.  It's not possible to 100% remove the risk.  The risk has been lowered to a level that is acceptable for more novice bike riders, and parents to allow children to use Pandora as anecdotal evidence shows.

 

Problems with "secondary roads" - getting doored, no room for cars to safely pass bikes (especially given dooring), totally inadequate infrastructure at major crossings, and the fact that they don't go where people need to go OR provide access to services along the way.

[Coreyburger]

So here is my overall take on the bike lanes.

 

There is no possible way you, as a biker, can go fast in these lanes.  You simply need to be able to react to cars breaking the rules.  Because even if there are less cars doing it today, there are still going to be cars that screw up.  

 

So I think if you agree that you have to ride slowly, then I do not see how these lanes are safer than secondary roads for bikes.  Or the old-fashioned way, where you keep as far right as possible and/or in the painted bike lane.

Funny how we have that thing called science which can study this statement. And find it false:

[GabriolaGirl]

From years of motorcycling we have always ridden/driven as if everyone is out to get us.  Trust no one.  Having been in Victoria last weekend, I can say that some of the cyclists are going to be on the losing end of a battle with vehicles whether they are in the right, dead right or not.

We saw the Pandora bike lanes for the first time & finally have a notion of what you are talking about.  We had the green right turn light & a cyclist heading toward downtown just barely stopped in time for their red light, he was going to blow it off.

[Nparker]

From years of motorcycling we have always ridden/driven as if everyone is out to get us.  Trust no one...

That's just a good philosophy for living in general.

[Mike K.]

Here's another pissed off cyclist. Lol...

 

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S9YsDIvDimA&feature=youtu.be

[North Shore]

Alcohol - bringing the world wise decisions for 5,000 years...

[Kungsberg]

Celebration of the new Pandora protected bike lanes was today.  

 

Some councillors riding and some walking across for the 'official' ribbon-cutting.

 

The Province contributed $1 million to the project (one-third).

 

Council has been unanimous in their votes whenever bike infrastructure projects were voted on.

 

 

 

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[Nparker]

...Council has been unanimous in their votes whenever bike infrastructure projects were voted on.

Why not? For the councilors that don't live in the CoV it's not like it's their money being spent.

[hotdoglegz]

So here is my overall take on the bike lanes.

 

There is no possible way you, as a biker, can go fast in these lanes.  You simply need to be able to react to cars breaking the rules.  Because even if there are less cars doing it today, there are still going to be cars that screw up.  

 

So I think if you agree that you have to ride slowly, then I do not see how these lanes are safer than secondary roads for bikes.  Or the old-fashioned way, where you keep as far right as possible and/or in the painted bike lane.

 

As an experienced cyclist, I can ride "pretty fast" on the bike path and I love my commute to work. As a father who rides down Pandora with my 11 year old daughter on our way to school, the protected bike lane is the best thing to happen in this city in years

 

As I've mentioned before, I also drive down Pandora daily and I haven't noticed a disturbance with the bike lane apart from drivers ignoring the traffic lights 

 

- I'm not defending cyclists with my post. I think many of them are bad drivers as well. They are just less likely to cause injury when compared to a car

Edited by hotdoglegz, 15 May 2017 - 06:56 AM.

[VicHockeyFan]

I meant you'd be foolish to ride fast in them.

[LJ]

I drove down to take a look at the new bike lanes so I would have some idea of what they actually looked like and how they operated.

 

I saw two people turn into the bike lane in their vehicles, and if you are not paying attention or are unfamiliar I can see that happen pretty easily. Maybe a bollard in the middle of the entryway to the bike lane would help there.

There are certainly a lot of lights at the intersection, the right turn red light seems to line up with the through lane so you have to pay attention to that as well.

 

I don't drive down there often so it probably not problematic for me but for regular users it may be more of a pain.

[VicHockeyFan]

Maybe a bollard in the middle of the entryway to the bike lane would help there.

 

There is some move to take the bollards off the Goose at road interfaces.  So I do not think solid bollards on the new lanes will be favourable.  If someone goes down them it's not the end of the world.  There are far worse car violations over the bike lanes outside of them now as is.

[dasmo]

I was downtown today and man the pandora bike lane was busy! Kids riding on them even! Instant Europe. I declare it a huge success already!

[nagel]

There is some move to take the bollards off the Goose at road interfaces. So I do not think solid bollards on the new lanes will be favourable. If someone goes down them it's not the end of the world. There are far worse car violations over the bike lanes outside of them now as is.

Yep it's not the end of the world. People end up driving in them and realize they f'd up quick. Nobody is doing 45 down them in a truck like it's GT3.