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[Bicycles] Bike lanes and cycling infrastructure in Victoria and the south Island


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#7501 nagel

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 12:03 PM

It might be a different story this afternoon.


I’m sure if I die you’ll have an opportunity to shame me on social media, probably on the VV Facebook page too.
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#7502 Nparker

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Posted 08 February 2019 - 12:09 PM

I’m sure if I die you’ll have an opportunity to shame me on social media, probably on the VV Facebook page too.

I am cruel, but not THAT cruel.



#7503 spanky123

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 10:33 AM

So much for on time and on budget. Looks like City staff want to hire 5 more people in order to complete the bike network by 2022 or else risk the project being delayed up to two years.

 

https://pub-victoria...ocumentId=32073


Edited by spanky123, 16 February 2019 - 10:34 AM.


#7504 rjag

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 10:40 AM

So much for on time and on budget. Looks like City staff want to hire 5 more people in order to complete the bike network by 2022 or else risk the project being delayed up to two years.

 

https://pub-victoria...ocumentId=32073

 

Gotta love how they still cling to the fallacy that 1 in 10 Victorians bike to work

 

Victoria has become one of the top cycling cities in Canada, with 1 in 10 Victorians now cycling to work - the second highest mode share in North America. The implementation of the All Ages and Abilities (AAA) bicycling network over the last few years has been a key enabler of this by delivering a safe, inviting and comfortable cycling environment.

 

 

I guess if you keep saying it you will believe it and dont need to test it.


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#7505 FogPub

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 12:16 PM

Interesting how they want to reduce "engagement" going forward.  Guess they're tired of hearing how bad the whole idea is.

 

The report does mention one good idea, but they can't even get that right: off-street bike paths.  The report wants these to be shared with pedestrians etc., where such paths should be bike-only and made suitable for high-speed bike commuters as well as casual riders.


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#7506 jonny

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Posted 16 February 2019 - 09:48 PM

Definitely ain't 1 in 10.

Maybe 1 in 10 reported biking to work once or occasionally or that they would like to bike to work. 10% though of total commutes? No way. Not a chance.

#7507 Mike K.

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 10:11 AM

Risks: The Bicycle Master Plan has relied largely on federal gas tax program contributions, but is also funded through Development Cost Charges and grants. While Gas Tax funding has restrictions that require the use of external contractors, consultants and service providers, Development Cost Charges do not and can be used to fund these additional positions.

 

Note that staff favour using development cost charges (DCC's) to pay for the additional staffers. DCC's, of course, are the tacked on fees City Hall levies when developers are moving a project through the proposal phase. DCC's continue to creep up and their costs are directly passed on to the end-user, be it a residential occupant or a commercial tenant.


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#7508 rjag

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Posted 18 February 2019 - 10:46 AM

Note that staff favour using development cost charges (DCC's) to pay for the additional staffers. DCC's, of course, are the tacked on fees City Hall levies when developers are moving a project through the proposal phase. DCC's continue to creep up and their costs are directly passed on to the end-user, be it a residential occupant or a commercial tenant.

 

Making housing in Victoria more affordable 1 additional tax at a time....got some real rocket scientists working over there... :whyme:


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#7509 laconic

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 08:47 AM

This is at least the third accident I've seen at this spot, all with the scenario.

 

Someone is in a hurry to drop off their vehicle for service. Cars don't typically think of a bike lane as a "vehicle lane" so don't do a good job of checking to see if the lane is occupied or if someone is approaching in the lane quickly.

 

Cyclist is gaining speed down the hill, happy with the clear lane all the way to the bridge.

 

Hard to see from the picture, but the entire front wheel of the bike was underneath the front passenger wheel of the car.

 

 

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#7510 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 08:58 AM

certainly a problem can be if the car does not remember “recently” passing a bike in the lane. chances are this happened when the car lane was moving much slower than the bike lane. this is exactly the kind of place you’d expect it. not the bikes fault but defensive riding would say you can’t go blazing down there even though you want to to take advantage of the momentum.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 19 February 2019 - 09:00 AM.


#7511 Mike K.

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 08:59 AM

That’s a tough one, for sure. Cyclists can travel at a very fast clip there and it takes just seconds to arrive at the dealership entrance after the curve at the intersection.

Right turns are no doubt a huge cause of accidents between vehicles and cars.

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#7512 Daveyboy

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 09:32 AM

I think it is called a shoulder check!  Doesn't always work (especially if the bike is racing) but usually makes the difference.  I don't see too many people shoulder checking while they are driving (or biking for that matter!).



#7513 Cassidy

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 09:55 AM

If you're driving and you've got a big van, a one ton cube, or even a pick-up with a camper on it immediately behind you ... and if that vehicle happens to be straddling as close to the bike lane as is possible (and still legal) ... your shoulder check won't show you anything more than a couple of vehicle lengths behind you. Your shoulder check won't show you the cyclist racing down the hill at 40kph (or faster)

A bike traveling at 40kph (the speed limit for everything on that section of roadway) or more would be right beside the car in the time it took to make the shoulder check and start the completely legal turn into the car dealership.

 

It's an inherent design flaw in bike lanes everywhere, and not specifically the fault of the rider or the driver if the cyclist was completely out of view during the shoulder check (although not a prime example of defensive cycling).

 

Cars turning across bicycle lanes kill people riding bicycles (personal first hand knowledge, twice over), and represent an unacceptable and fundamental design flaw in the entire concept of bike lanes.


Edited by Cassidy, 19 February 2019 - 09:59 AM.


#7514 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:02 AM

the driver could also be more defensive and slowly enter the bike lane and indicate the turn from much further out.

but the driver likely did not do that and the cyclist also might not have exercised enough caution and as usual we have more than one factor for the crash.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 19 February 2019 - 10:03 AM.


#7515 Cassidy

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:30 AM

.... the driver likely did not do that and the cyclist also might not have exercised enough caution......

That's why I wrote "not specifically the fault of the rider or the driver" ...  clearly implying shared responsibility.

 

But as noted in a post earlier in this thread, it's the cyclist who gets maimed or killed (not the driver), and further that it's the incredibly poor design of bike lanes as they relate to the vehicle portion of roadways that perpetuate the potential for such accidents to happen.



#7516 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:33 AM

what’s the design solution though? a separated lane still would have a gap for the vehicle entry. no bike lane at all would likely be safer here.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 19 February 2019 - 10:33 AM.


#7517 DustMagnet

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:43 AM

  • Speed humps in the bike lanes to slow down the cyclists leading up to the entrance?
  • Flashing lights embedded in the lane marking line at the dealership entrance that are triggered by approaching cyclists?
  • A requirement that all bicycles have DRLs?

Edited by DustMagnet, 19 February 2019 - 10:48 AM.

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#7518 Cassidy

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:50 AM

... no bike lane at all would likely be safer here.

You're absolutely right of course.

Sometimes a false sense of security, or the notion that you've got a safety net (when you really don't have a safety net of any kind) can be detrimental to the cyclists own safety.

 

Perhaps the lack of a bike lane causes both cyclist and driver to mutually exercise just that little bit more caution.



#7519 DustMagnet

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 10:53 AM

Perhaps the lack of a bike lane causes both cyclist and driver to mutually exercise just that little bit more caution.

 

I wouldn't bet my life on that.



#7520 Cassidy

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Posted 19 February 2019 - 11:25 AM

I wouldn't bet my life on that.

Neither would I, which is why I plan on using only the Goose to get in and out of town when I purchase my electric bike.

Nothing is 100% safe when you're sitting on a bike with your body 100% exposed to whatever might accidentally hit you, but at least on the Goose you don't have this kind of right hand turn situation lurking to bite you.

 

Which brings me to my next point, which is actually a cycling question.

Where, in the downtown core, does one safely lock up an electric bicycle for the full workday when one can't put the said bicycle in their office?

So far, I can only really see the locked cage at the Bay Centre ($30,00 per month) as fulfilling that requirement?

Are there other safe locations for locking up bicycles that I'm unaware of?

 

I'll be a fair weather cyclist to and from work, all in an effort to live a few more years, lose a bit of excess weight ... and hopefully still be around to walk my daughter down the aisle when the time comes to do so :)


Edited by Cassidy, 19 February 2019 - 11:26 AM.


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