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Police staffing and salary discussion


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#21 LJ

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 06:32 PM

We're happily paying teachers that. 

We are? I am not all that happy.


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#22 sebberry

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 07:12 PM

I once had some work done on my house by a guy who works for the BC prison system as a guard.  I thought he was just getting some extra money, but no he was supplementing his 1-3 days a week at the prison since he couldn't get full time hours as he was junior.  Its time to rearrange the police to work this way too.  why are police special?  Having an extra say 100 cops on call throughout Victoria would really cut costs to taxpayers

 

 

I don't think you're going to get part timers of the same calibre as full timers.  I'm not keen on the idea of part time cowboys running around. 


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#23 Mike K.

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 07:48 PM

So how much are Oak Bay cops earning?

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#24 concorde

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 07:50 PM

I don't think you're going to get part timers of the same calibre as full timers.  I'm not keen on the idea of part time cowboys running around. 

Really?  because every company does it including the prisons who are looking after serial killers, rapists, etc.

 

I have been told if you want to work for BC Ferries be prepared to spend several years on call before you become full time.  What makes you think the quality is any less.  They do it because they know there is an excellent well paying job at the other end.  I think you would find the same with people wanting to become cops



#25 sebberry

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Posted 10 August 2014 - 08:53 PM

If we had the resources to hire 10 part-time officers, I'd rather see that go to 4 or 5 full-time officers. 

 

A BC Ferries worker gets up, goes to work, directs traffic, makes food, whatever... then goes home. 

A police officer will have work and projects that span days, weeks or months.  It's a full time commitment requiring a full time presence. 

 

I'm just not sure it's right for part-time work.  And at the end of the day, what are we really saving?  If a full-time officer needs additional time for document preparation, court, etc... then that's where OT comes in.  You can't just shovel that onto a part-timer's desk. 


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#26 spanky123

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 06:51 AM

I don't think you're going to get part timers of the same calibre as full timers.  I'm not keen on the idea of part time cowboys running around. 

 

Many part-timers don't want full time work. I know lots of people with families that have one spouse working full time but need a second part time job to help pay the bills. Often the part time jobs are outside of 8-5 so it works well for childcare. 



#27 G-Man

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:42 AM

I have no issue paying cops a lot of money. Also while you may need only a high school degree the onboarding process takes years where you get nothing or next to nothing. Also with the RCMP you can get stationed anywhere they want to station you in the country. VicPD have some of the highest case volumes in the country. Last I saw they were fourth highest. Yes hiring more would be good but it is not an easy process.

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#28 sebberry

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:52 AM

Many part-timers don't want full time work. I know lots of people with families that have one spouse working full time but need a second part time job to help pay the bills. Often the part time jobs are outside of 8-5 so it works well for childcare. 

 

Indeed, but I was speaking specifically about police officers. 

 

Also the recruiting and training costs are high for the department, so I doubt they'd want to invest heavily in part timers. 


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#29 jonny

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:56 AM

I'd be interested in seeing the starting salary for Victoria PD constables. It seems to me that there are a lot of constables making >$75k.



#30 sebberry

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:57 AM

https://www.vicpd.ca/careers/officers


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#31 thundergun

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 09:37 AM

I've often wondered why the compensation for both police and firefighters continues to increase so rapidly. Let me first clarify I'm not saying they don't deserve a good wage for dangerous work. But it seems like it's extremely competitive field with a large pool of qualified applicants, so why don't the basic rules of economics work here?

 

Then again, the same situation is happening with teachers in the province. I guess these aren't exactly free markets.


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#32 Mr Cook Street

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 09:52 AM

We are? I am not all that happy.

That level of pay would be on the high end of earners, near retirement age if I'm not mistaken. Most are more likely earning in the 50k range. That puts a beat cop well ahead of teachers.



#33 jonny

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 10:12 AM

60 grand for a starting salary is a hell of a lot more than I started out earning after completing my four year university degree.

 

Moving up to $86k after only five years is quite generous.


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#34 Mr Cook Street

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 10:23 AM

I've often wondered why the compensation for both police and firefighters continues to increase so rapidly. Let me first clarify I'm not saying they don't deserve a good wage for dangerous work. But it seems like it's extremely competitive field with a large pool of qualified applicants, so why don't the basic rules of economics work here?

 

Then again, the same situation is happening with teachers in the province. I guess these aren't exactly free markets.

 

No politician wants so suggest that police and firefighters should earn less, or at least have their salaries frozen for a while. It evokes a knee jerk reaction in a segment of the population regardless of budget constraints.

That is an incredible 5 year salary climb!



#35 G-Man

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 12:59 PM

You could not pay me enough to do what either a police officer or Fireman do. It seems pretty fair for putting your life at risk to betterment of the community.
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#36 Mr Cook Street

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 01:41 PM

You could not pay me enough to do what either a police officer or Fireman do. It seems pretty fair for putting your life at risk to betterment of the community.

 

The thing is though, I'm certain there are countless people who would do it for less. I'm not saying that we should low ball critical services like firefighters and cops. For example, I actually think most teachers are underpaid for what they do (whole other ball of wax). But when it comes to contract negotiations, it's hard to argue you should get raises when there is a line up of people to fill the job at the current salary (which I think is very generous).



#37 thundergun

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 01:54 PM

You could not pay me enough to do what either a police officer or Fireman do. It seems pretty fair for putting your life at risk to betterment of the community.

I'm not saying it's not fair at the moment but at some point is has to be too much doesn't it? If the rates keep on this trajectory your property taxes will have to follow suit.

Some balance between supply and demand would help keep some rationale to these emotional discussions. If people aren't being paid enough and interest declines, wages/benefits will rise to counter. Conversely, you would argue that if interest keeps increasing, should wages continue to climb well above other (especially publicly funded) positions?



#38 jonny

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 02:02 PM

How much is a police or firefighters life really at risk though?

 

I don't hear of too many police officers or firefighters who actually die in the line of duty. Farmers, miners and construction workers face far greater risks IMO.

 

10 most dangerous jobs: http://www.theglobea...rticle16352517/


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#39 Gipper

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 02:45 PM

Here's a CBC article from 2012 talking about a Stats Can survey of occupation homicides from 2000-2010. It says taxi drivers are at highest risk for being murdered on the job and police are in second place:

http://www.cbc.ca/ne....work-1.1258776

Regarding current police assault rate, latest stats for Canada are here:

http://www.jibc.ca/s....-14-Issue1.pdf

If you run the numbers it shows in 2012 the general Canadian population was assaulted at a rate of 657 per 100,000. Police were assaulted at a rate of 15,160 per 100,000.

And police work also has amongst the highest non-fatal injury rates. These stats are recent US stats but I'm sure it's similar up here.

http://www.bls.gov/i...os/ostb3569.pdf

So to sum it up, police work: high murder rate, high assault rate, high non-fatal injury rate, medium fatal injury rate.

Sounds fairly dangerous to me.
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#40 concorde

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Posted 11 August 2014 - 07:02 PM

You could not pay me enough to do what either a police officer or Fireman do. It seems pretty fair for putting your life at risk to betterment of the community.

over 200 construction workers died last year and ONE cop died in 2009, the last year I could find stats in a quick internet search (2008 was zero).  Millions of people put their lives on the line every day, cops are no different.  looks like all construction workers need to be getting immediate raises to over $200k to account for the risk.

 

as for Victoria Police having the highest case load in canada, what is that for writing speeding tickets and chasing down drunks because there is no major crimes that I can remember that frequent the CRD in general



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