553 replies to this topic

[Nparker]

Since there seems to be some confusion, I thought I should post some images of actual parking lots.

[zoomer]

Except according to your definition.. the Hillside Mall parking lot is... NOT a parking lot. It has a very similar oval shape wrap around shape with lots of greenery! I remember Hillside boasting about how green their parking lot would be when they did the redevelopment several years back.  Rows of trees in a parking lot, what a concept!  Heck even Clover Point doesn't have all those nice green trees in it's parking lot. Let me guess, a parking lot has to have a certain number of stalls.. that's the next come back?  Clover Point is a park with a parking lot as most parks do.  Let's not stoop to the language trickery of the far left or far right to make a political point.  You want all parking retained - cool, just say so! It's like folks are embarrassed to admit that or something.

 

 

[tommy]

i am hearing rumours that this "parking lot" up on the malahat is the next target to pedestrianize.... i mean, they call it a "lookout" but it is a parking lot - cars park there and not much else - right?

Attached Images

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Edited by tommy, Today, 11:44 AM.

[Nparker]

Except according to your definition.. the Hillside Mall parking lot is... NOT a parking lot. It has a very similar oval shape wrap around shape with lots of greenery!...

 

You'd be right if that was my definition of a parking lot.

[rmpeers]

I thought we settled this... it's a parking lot, but if you prefer to call it a different type of parking lot I'm good with that. Picture below from the Richmond News article about two vehicles plunging over the edge of the cliffs. Ok, now who in their right mind would picnic in the middle of this? I never have, I never stop there. If you have kids or pets you certainly wouldn't. What part of that ice cream cone shape would you feel safe in with your family? Sure you could fence it all in, then it feels like you're in a small dog park for humans, separated from the main point of going to Clover Point to start with. When they remove the west facing portion of the parking lot, then that land becomes far more usable, but still, can't see it being an ideal picnic spot.

You can tell it's a parking lot because it so green. Obvious.

[Victoria Watcher]

they could have just put the turn-around right about here at the red circle.  leave the parking in at the very tip.  then they could have removed all the pavement on the top (west) side there.  and even moved the entry road as far east as possible.  that would have opened lots of green space connected to the rest of the lawns area up at the top of the bluffs.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Victoria Watcher, Today, 12:09 PM.

[zoomer]

A reasonable solution Victoria Watcher - it preserves most parking including the coveted sunset view while allowing for much better pedestrian use at the same time. Folks it can be that simple. Personally I would remove about 5 more parking spaces in your diagram, but it’s close.

NParker, if your personal definition of parking lot makes you happy, then I’m happy for you too. I tend to go with the dictionary definition:

“an area, usually divided into individual spaces, intended for parking motor vehicle”.

https://www.dictiona...wse/parking-lot

Rmpeers - I’m not sure how often you get down to Clover Point, but that green part is not used for parking*, that’s actually the park portion. It’s green much of the year, but then goes that dry yellow come summer. The parking lot portion is the asphalt section with painted lines for individual spaces around that green space.

*I believe the inside park was used for Deuce Days though a couple years back, but it would have been dry and hard so probably little to damage was caused.

[Nparker]

...I tend to go with the dictionary definition: “an area, usually divided into individual spaces, intended for parking motor vehicle”.

And if that's all there was at Clover Point then it could be considered a parking lot; however there is an abundance of green space that already has non-vehicular uses (for example, those pesky kites you mentioned before), so by the dictionary definition CP is not a parking lot.

[rmpeers]

A reasonable solution Victoria Watcher - it preserves most parking including the coveted sunset view while allowing for much better pedestrian use at the same time. Folks it can be that simple. Personally I would remove about 5 more parking spaces in your diagram, but it’s close.

NParker, if your personal definition of parking lot makes you happy, then I’m happy for you too. I tend to go with the dictionary definition:

“an area, usually divided into individual spaces, intended for parking motor vehicle”.

https://www.dictiona...wse/parking-lot

Rmpeers - I’m not sure how often you get down to Clover Point, but that green part is not used for parking*, that’s actually the park portion. It’s green much of the year, but then goes that dry yellow come summer. The parking lot portion is the asphalt section with painted lines for individual spaces around that green space.

*I believe the inside park was used for Deuce Days though a couple years back, but it would have been dry and hard so probably little to damage was caused.

I will accept "park with roadway/parking area around the outside."

[zoomer]

I agree! Could this all be a simple misunderstanding! Yes, I think so! As I’ve said about 4 times already here, but for one final time (I promise, because this horse is six feet deep already) - Clover Point is a park with green space and rocky shores. It also has a parking lot. That is all. Good day sirs...

[max.bravo]

I agree! Could this all be a simple misunderstanding! Yes, I think so! As I’ve said about 4 times already here, but for one final time (I promise, because this horse is six feet deep already) - Clover Point is a park with green space and rocky shores. It also has a parking lot. That is all. Good day sirs...

It’s not just a park with a parking lot. you miss the point.

It’s a scenic lookout, a viewpoint, a makeout point, etc. I did a google scholar search to find park/urban/land use planning or leisure studies articles about this kind of place, but it seems not much is written about them. I’m guessing it’s because they were (formerly) seen as self-evidently valuable and valid- kind of an implied good type of amenity.

That’s not to say these spaces aren’t important. Google search for ‘lookout point’ or ‘viewpoint parking’ and you’ll find tons of buzzfeed and pop culture love for the kind of place Clover Point already is.

It’s not just a park- it’s the kind of place that’s deeply embedded in our cultural identity. That’s why there is so much uproar about this attempt at ‘place making’ this area— it’s already VERY MUCH a ‘place’ in the minds of its users.

It’s where you parked with your high school sweetheart and kissed her for the first time.

It’s where you went to cry alone in your car after your dad died.

It’s the place you remember laughing with your sister when a seagull shit right on the windshield.

It’s a public place you can enjoy in full intimacy within your car and with whoever you park there with. To lose that is actually pretty sad for the majority of users.

The ‘lookout point’ place is a hollywood trope for a reason. Clover Point is already being put to its best possible use as a loop with lookout parking. People should be very upset that a small minority of anti-car anti-fun looney tunes are taking that away.

Edited by max.bravo, Today, 06:14 PM.

[Mike K.]

It’s not just a park- it’s the kind of place that’s deeply embedded in our cultural identity.

This just won the Internet award today.

[Nparker]

...It’s not just a park - it’s the kind of place that’s deeply embedded in our cultural identity. That’s why there is so much uproar about this attempt at ‘place making’ this area — it’s already VERY MUCH a ‘place’ in the minds of its users.

Exactly. The bizarre 21^st century concept of "place making" is entirely superfluous at Clover Point.

[rmpeers]

Exactly. The bizarre 21^st century concept of "place making" is entirely superfluous at Clover Point.

I can't imagine anyone with any appreciation of beauty and the outdoors looking at a fantastic place like CP and deciding it needs fixing. Boggles the mind.

It'd be as insane as, say, banning traffic from the BHP lookout.