1112 replies to this topic

[A Girl is No one]

Yes, he’s been a huge proponent of closing it down to traffic. He’s also a big cycling advocate.

His wife is the seniors advocate. Haha guess none of those concerns about seniors who can’t walk/run/bike to Dallas road crossed her mind either.

[aastra]

 

I bet it’ll be as popular as that table tennis table is on Humboldt.....

 

Are you implying there aren't a lot of people sitting in parked cars on stormy days so they can comfortably enjoy the table tennis?

[rjag]

Are you implying there aren't a lot of people sitting in parked cars on stormy days so they can comfortably enjoy the table tennis?

 

Might need weighted balls. They discovered that on Humboldt. Of course one of the biggest advocates for this change is the Placemaking group which is linked at the hip to the GVCC and of course you'd be shocked to learn that...

[On the Level]

I find people tend to be more likely to comment when they're outraged by change than when they're happy about change. Even just looking at the "reactions" on FB, it's a fairly even split between like/love and angry/sad. Vibrant Victoria also tends to be more popular with the reactionary crowd to begin with. Looking at my friend's list, the only ones that I have that follow VV on Facebook are older or conservative-leaning, and most of them live out in Central Saanich, Gordon Head, Langford, etc. I'd hardly say it's an accurate sample of the residents of the CoV. Even I stopped following on Facebook when I got tired of the whining about cyclists and homeless people.

 

There is going to be different segments of society which are attracted to different social media segments for sure.  While I don't always agree with your point of view, I think your input makes this site more whole and more representative overall.

 

VV can be more conservative and/or older than other sites but it does support a large segment of the population.  The reactions you see can be based on impact to your fellow Victorians that are most likely in a different stage of life than you. 

 

The reaction is based on council decisions that are not inclusive.  This example means that some are now shut out of enjoying a place they grew up with.  

 

It would be better to add attractive choices for alternate modes of transportation instead of taking away from others.  The current approach will be viewed as "others get everything and I lose everything" to a segment of the population.   That will cause a reaction.

[Mike K.]

Funny thing is, now that we’re 15-years-old, we’re the old guard to today’s 20-somethings engaged in urbanism and civic issues. When the forum appeared in 2006 we were the young ones taking on the old guard of that era, challenging notions like arbitrary height limits and pushing for smart design to create desirable urban areas. Remember, circa 2006 living downtown was an exception to the rule.

Seeing this transition from young and determined to older and reserved is pretty satisfying.

[Nparker]

...The reaction is based on council decisions that are not inclusive...

You would think I'd be used to the CoV style of governing for the vocal minority by now, but it still irks me.

[Jackerbie]

Adding to the conversation on reactions, the Reddit thread is generally positive at the moment, with the most up-voted comments being either enthusiastic support or questions about where people will go to watch the submarine races.

[Rob Randall]

Well you know, I didn't think I'd like the Dallas Road improvements but I think that new pedestrian realm looks pretty inviting.

[Mike K.]

As if those nerds race submarines.

[Midnightly]

if they make it pedestrian only it will just become another dead spot... yes you will see people down there... but it will be far far different from those photos... you won't see dozens and dozens of people walking and wheeling around enjoying the view and playing on the grass... you may see a handful of people if that....and probably only on good weather days...

 

now as for events and festivals down there.. when was the last time the city allowed or hosted a festival down there? realistically i don't see that happening all that often.. the last one i remember was the kite festival and that was years and years ago.. and where do they expect to get all the visitors for these festivals to come from? will it be for the neighbourhood only? if not there will be a huge parking issue you can't host a festival with thousands of people and not expect people to well drive to it especially if they have kids and are coming from some distance...

 

no one is stopping the city from hosting a food truck fridays down at the point (great for local businesses!) but have they put any effort into doing that? or anything?

[Brantastic]

if they make it pedestrian only it will just become another dead spot... 

Yes, only waterfront parking lots make public space lively and enjoyable... 

 

[Midnightly]

Yes, only waterfront parking lots make public space lively and enjoyable... 

 

how many people park down there then take their dog for a walk down at the water, or along Dallas road pathways? a fair few, i've know many parents (myself included) who have parked there to go check out the tide pools in the spring and summer months, or take kids down to fly kites (that is one of the better places in town to fly a kite safely).. parking allows people to come and well park while they enjoy their time along the waterfront...

[Nparker]

Yes, only waterfront parking lots make public space lively and enjoyable... 

As I stated above, a well-designed Clover Point can accommodate all users. When I lived in the CSV I often went for walks here and never once was I concerned about my safety. Could CP use a re-fresh? Yes. Does it need to exclude cars? No, that is just being short-sighted and driven by dogma not common sense.

[Victoria Watcher]

As I stated above, a well-designed Clover Point can accommodate all users. When I lived in the CSV I often went for walks here and never once was I concerned about my safety. Could CP use a re-fresh? Yes. Does it need to exclude cars? No, that is just being short-sighted and driven by dogma not common sense.

 

i agree with NParker here.

 

those sunny and festive pictures in the renderings are great.  but let's not forget about the other 6 or 9 months of the year where there is zero possibility of events or crowds there.

 

some things don't need a major fix.

 

look at mt. tolmie.  i think it has had one maybe two minor refreshes in all of the last 50 years.  a great place to go.  mostly by car.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 07 February 2021 - 07:48 AM.

[rjag]

Yes, only waterfront parking lots make public space lively and enjoyable... 

 

 

Why does it have to be one way or the other with you?

 

There is ample room to make it what it has always been. An accessible viewpoint that people from all over the region can venture to in whatever mode they so choose to take in the ocean and the scenery. Storm watching from that location has always been a thing. being so low and close to it and feeling the wind and the spray buffet your car is an experience that you don't get from 200 meters back on the road. 

 

There is lots of room to create a drive down area and 40+ view spots to park your car and create a pedestrian pathway that doesn't cross a road (this wouldnt even be a road but like a parking lot, but I get the anti-car fear **rn that is weaponized) 

 

The reason why people lash out at the bike zealots is simply that. The GVCC, (Placemaking etc fall under their umbrella as its literally the same people) are so black and white, they cant compromise, its not in their DNA. Its anti-car, decolonize, etc etc 

 

Name 1 bike lane project that has been completed in this City where any of these groups has said it was a bad idea? Clover Point is like BHP, its there for ALL citizens of the REGION not just the people who live within a few blocks or 1-2km away. Just look at how BHP is these days, and thats as a result of the influence by similar connected groups.

 

And here's something from a person you would define as a car person, I'm fine with it being revisioned and a consultation to take place involving citizens from varying backgrounds, not just padded with special interest groups as these studies usually are. Where it can be looked at from a neutral perspective. (that would mean, no GVCC etc lobbyists with personal agendas) And you'll find that prevailing opinion would be what is called the mainstream. Where you will find there is zero room for compromise is from the anti-car lobby such as GVCC, Placemaking etc they have zero tolerance or ability for holistic approaches and compromise. End result is the likes of BHP fiasco, Wharf St, Vancouver at North Park etc. Its all the same. Faux consultation full steam ahead agenda 

Edited by rjag, 07 February 2021 - 08:23 AM.

[sebberry]

For the sort of people who grow fennel in their backyard so they can make their own toothpaste, the GVCC/placemaking folks are sure pretty angry at the thought of people having freedom and choice.

[rjag]

For the sort of people who grow fennel in their backyard so they can make their own toothpaste, the GVCC/placemaking folks are sure pretty angry at the thought of people having freedom and choice.

 

Of course they want you to have the freedom to choose...but only what they put in front of you, dont you dare have an opinion thats counter to the intolerant left, you'll open yourself up to be labelled...father knows best and all that!!!

[Victoria Watcher]

they should put one of those glass-bottom viewing platforms sticking out over the water.

 

 

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 07 February 2021 - 08:28 AM.

[Jackerbie]

There is ample room to make it what it has always been. An accessible viewpoint that people from all over the region can venture to in whatever mode they so choose to take in the ocean and the scenery.

Well, that's what it's been since the 1950s. It's been many things before that. There's a very interesting history page online: https://beaconhillpa.../appendix_C.htm

I'd wait for Aastra to find this and post in the things never change thread, but I'll do the work for him this time:

[Nparker]

Even the mostly sane council members are kind out there in the CoV. It's like all the crazy in the nation eventually finds its way to Victoria.