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Schools in Victoria and school issues discussion


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#21 tedward

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:10 AM

Or how about we stop pretending that South Park is anything more than a fad for urban hipsters and is not significantly better than any "regular" public school and stop worrying what these entitled snobs waste their time doing.

 

And BTW we have "Coastal Kindergarten" at James Bay School as well. Another silly fad that will eventually be dropped in favour of simply taking kids outside more.


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#22 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:15 AM

And BTW we have "Coastal Kindergarten" at James Bay School as well. Another silly fad that will eventually be dropped in favour of simply taking kids outside more.

 

Ya, I kind of mentioned that earlier.  You have a great location, take the kids out more.


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#23 Bingo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:18 AM

Whenever the program gets off the ground and into the park, safety for the kids will be the primary concern.

 

You can't have kids falling off of the swings, jumping from the bridge into Goodacre Lake, being attacked by roaming peacocks

or falling over the Dallas Road cliffs..... otherwise I think it is fantastic they want to get kids out of the boring classroom and back into nature. :thumbsup:



#24 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:18 AM

It's not like lining up for an iPhone. You have to talk to someone a year in advance, get on a list. Then you have to register /RSVP months in advance. The you line up if you really want it. So already you are competing against a limited pool. It's the most fair and democratic way for a limited resource that's in demand. Otherwise you go for a socialist system that's simply equally unfair for all? Are any of the outraged even parents with a remote connection to this program?

#25 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:20 AM

Plus, what Tedward says is true... It's not like it's a Waldorf program or something. They don't go if it rains. They watch videos about nature instead ;-)

#26 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:21 AM

You can't have kids falling off of the swings, jumping from the bridge into Goodacre Lake, being attacked by roaming peacocks

or falling over the Dallas Road cliffs..... 

 

We did all that stuff when we were kids, just by ourselves on the weekends, no teachers or parents required.


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#27 Rob Randall

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:31 AM

 It's not like it's a Waldorf program

 

Are you sure you don't mean "Walden"? I think the Waldorf program is mainly salad-related.


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#28 jklymak

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:35 AM

It's the most fair and democratic way for a limited resource that's in demand. Otherwise you go for a socialist system that's simply equally unfair for all? Are any of the outraged even parents with a remote connection to this program?

 

How is it the most fair and democratic way?  You are saying the parents with limited resources have a year to plan so they can do this, and that is somehow fair?  How is a lottery "unfair to all"?  I'm not following your logic at all.  

 

What you are really saying is that you want this to be a competition for the parents who want this the most for their children.  I'd be fine with that if the competition were remotely fair.  Two parents? Way easier to spend the weekend taking turns at the campsite while the other parent looks after the kid(s) at home.  9-5 job w/ weekends off?  Far easier to spend the whole weekend "bonding" with your fellow parents.  I don't see how you can think any of that is fair.  

 

And yes, my child is going into kindergarden this year, though we had no interest in Coastal Kindergarden.  But French Immersion was similarly "first-come-first served" and there were lineups the day before for some programs, and there is absolutely no justification for it, other than some vague elitist idea that parents who care more will somehow have children that excel.  



#29 Mike K.

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:40 AM

It's not like lining up for an iPhone. You have to talk to someone a year in advance, get on a list. Then you have to register /RSVP months in advance. The you line up if you really want it. So already you are competing against a limited pool. It's the most fair and democratic way for a limited resource that's in demand. Otherwise you go for a socialist system that's simply equally unfair for all? Are any of the outraged even parents with a remote connection to this program?


Collectively tax payers have more connection to these programs than just the parents. I don't like gimmicks like this employed by a socialized education system. Make it 100% equitable or bust. If this were a private school the parents could be lined up for months for all I care.

Now the whole process prior to the camping out is all good, but then the line up hijinks come into play and that's where things get all amateurish and hokey.
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#30 jonny

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:51 AM

Spots for a public school program should be allocated based upon a lottery if there is this much demand.



#31 Nparker

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 09:57 AM

Spots for a public school program should be allocated based upon a lottery if there is this much demand.

Preferably something like Shirley Jackson's "Lottery"; then you'd REALLY see who the dedicated parents were.


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#32 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 10:08 AM

Spots for a public school program should be allocated based upon a lottery if there is this much demand.

They are. It's called French Immersion. Except parents who already have children in the program who have siblings get an automatic spot even if they are out of catchment. So if you want in you are in a lottery with hundreds vying for 2 spots. So this is fair?


Edited by dasmo, 12 January 2015 - 10:08 AM.


#33 lanforod

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 10:14 AM

Supply/demand issue. If the demand is that high, they have need to increase the supply. Convert another school to French immersion, add more 'nature' Kindergartens...

If you have a handful not getting in, that's fine, do a lottery. If you have demand for more than double your current capacity, the school boards need to add more supply!



#34 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 11:15 AM

We should have lotteries for jobs too...

#35 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 11:18 AM

We should have lotteries for jobs too...

 

I think we should actually have auctions for jobs.  Once you meet the minimum qualifications criteria for the job, you go into an auction, whoever bids for the lowest salary gets the job.


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#36 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 12:13 PM

I guess I see it as fair because it's an opportunity that's pressent in a transparent fashion. You know what needs to be done to get it. It's not based on who you know, how much money you have, race, religion, where you live etc. It's based on how much effort you put in to get it. You don't even need to be good looking, talented, educated, or smart. Just put the effort in.

#37 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 12:19 PM

It's not based on who you know, how much money you have, race, religion, where you live etc. It's based on how much effort you put in to get it. You don't even need to be good looking, talented, educated, or smart. Just put the effort in.

 

Except if you can't afford to camp, have a medical condition that would prevent you sleeping outdoors (you can't medically handle the cold/moisture, maybe you do dialysis at the hospital every second day etc.).

However, with the lottery,it's not based on who you know, how much money you have, race, religion, where you live etc.  You don't even need to be good looking, talented, educated, or smart.   And on top of that, nobody has to camp out for a weekend in January.

 


 

 

 


<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#38 dasmo

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 12:34 PM

life is more difficult for those with disabilities. Im not sure how that changes the equation. A lottery is simply unfair for all and lucky for a few...

Edited by dasmo, 12 January 2015 - 12:37 PM.


#39 G-Man

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 12:47 PM

I like the idea of volunteer work line-ups rather than just staying in front of the school. Parents that put in x amount of hours with the following non-profits receive priority. So camping overnight is likely about 12 hours of anyone's time. Have people put in 12 hours at Our Place over the course of December and you receive a spot.
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#40 http

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Posted 12 January 2015 - 02:27 PM

life is more difficult for those with disabilities. Im not sure how that changes the equation. A lottery is simply unfair for all and lucky for a few...

Am I understanding you correctly?  if you are or become disabled, your child should be denied a chance at this opportunity?

 

A lottery removes the possibility that who gets selected for the program is based on who you know or how many favours you can put in an unmarked envelope, and more importantly, removes the possibility that entry to the program is viewed as requiring knowing someone or having large piles of cash.


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