33 replies to this topic

[ressen]

With the advent of self driving cars, will we need LRT. or LRB. Do we need to build more overpasses (Mckenzie / Admirals excepted)

[Coreyburger]

With the advent of self driving cars, will we need LRT. or LRB. Do we need to build more overpasses (Mckenzie / Admirals excepted)

 

A self-driving car (or an electric car) takes up exactly the same amount of road space. Given space is at a premium in cities, the basics of geometry don't change.

[lanforod]

A self-driving car (or an electric car) takes up exactly the same amount of road space. Given space is at a premium in cities, the basics of geometry don't change.

 

I find that statement true, but completely missing the point. Which is very ironic, coming from you!

[Coreyburger]

Right, then I guess to answer the question: yes, we will need more overpasses. Although self-driving vehicles can also be buses or trains, reducing the cost of operating them (at the cost of well paid jobs)

[zoomer]

There will be no congestion as traffic lights are eliminated once vehicles communicate with each other through an advanced traffic control system.  No more stopping, if main roads get overloaded some cars will be redirected automatically to secondary routes. But as we're likely ten years at least away from that...  Oh, and likely less people will own a car if you can just order one up for less cost when you need it. 

[lanforod]

There will be no congestion as traffic lights are eliminated once vehicles communicate with each other through an advanced traffic control system.  No more stopping, if main roads get overloaded some cars will be redirected automatically to secondary routes. But as we're likely ten years at least away from that...  Oh, and likely less people will own a car if you can just order one up for less cost when you need it. 

 

Maybe 30 years. There will be a fairly significant transition period. The only way to completely go that way faster woud be to mandate all vehicles must be self driving from a certain date. I don't see that happening for a long, long time. Car centric culture is shifting, but very slowly.

[zoomer]

Yes it would have to be mandated, and perhaps only automated cars would be allowed on main roads.  The cost of insurance may force people to move to automated vehicles a lot quicker than we think - dramatically  reduced number of accidents if fully automated - who will want to pay a huge premium for the privilege of driving a manual vehicle? Smokers are looked at now as a irresponsible dangerous burden on society, maybe that's how we'll think of manual car drivers - how dare they risk our lives because they want to have a little fun?!  Of course it's taking away personal freedom, and manual car owners will flock to private driving tracks and back country former logging roads where they will pay to play. 

[Coreyburger]

There will be no congestion as traffic lights are eliminated once vehicles communicate with each other through an advanced traffic control system.  No more stopping, if main roads get overloaded some cars will be redirected automatically to secondary routes. But as we're likely ten years at least away from that...  Oh, and likely less people will own a car if you can just order one up for less cost when you need it. 

 

Uhh no. You are forgetting two key group of road/street users: people biking or walking. Highways might look like this, but your average downtown isn't going to lose traffic lights anytime soon.

[lanforod]

Uhh no. You are forgetting two key group of road/street users: people biking or walking. Highways might look like this, but your average downtown isn't going to lose traffic lights anytime soon.

 

I agree, though they may not look anything like the current setup if no manual drivers were permitted.

 

Other than purpose designed cities or the odd forward thinking one, I don't see that happening in most of our lifetimes!

[zoomer]

True, I was speaking about not requiring overpasses in the future, not downtown intersections.  And then there are motorcycles, would they be banned on highways?  Would there be autonomous motorcycles and if so what's the point!  Also, speed limits on highways could be eliminated- imagine zipping to the western communities at 120 km/per hour under ideal conditions. 

[zoomer]

Well, I'm planning on living to 150.. so, I'm sayin' there's a chance! 

 

I agree, though they may not look anything like the current setup if no manual drivers were permitted.

 

Other than purpose designed cities or the odd forward thinking one, I don't see that happening in most of our lifetimes!

[sebberry]

Also, speed limits on highways could be eliminated- imagine zipping to the western communities at 120 km/per hour under ideal conditions. 

 

That doesn't happen already?

[nagel]

Interesting possible scenario:

 

A suburban father rides his driverless car to work, maybe dropping his daughter off a at school. But rather than park the car downtown, he simply tells it to drive back home to his house in the suburbs. During the day, it runs some other errands for his family. At 3 pm, it goes to the school to bring his daughter home or chauffeur her to after-school activities. Then it's time for it to drive back into the city to pick up Dad from work. But then, on a lark, Dad decides to go shopping at a downtown department store after work, so he tells his car to just circle the block for an hour while he shops, before finally hailing it to go home.

[lanforod]

^ that would work far better if people just didn't own cars. All cars were part of the transit system, you just get the nearest available one.

[nagel]

^ that would work far better if people just didn't own cars. All cars were part of the transit system, you just get the nearest available one.

That's crazy talk.  Why would I willingly pay a couple of bucks when I needed a car instead of using it all I want (at the bargain low cost of about 9,000 a year)?  I wants to own it not share it with other peeps!

 

[Coreyburger]

Privately-owned autonomous cars are going to drive up driving a lot. But I also suspect that tolling empty cars won't be nearly as controversial as tolling full cars.

 

MOD: Can we get a less shouty thread title please?

[nagel]

^ doesn't all caps always improve your argument though?

[Coreyburger]

^ doesn't all caps always improve your argument though?

 

ABSOLUTELY. WAIT. WHY IS EVERYBODY LEAVING AND IGNORING ME!!!!11!!!

 

(lol)

[jklymak]

Yes, driverless cars are going to be a nightmare for the environment and the built form of cities.  Just as we are hitting the limits of acceptable sprawl now in many cities, they'll enable the next level.  Its possible that the driving improvements will counterbalance this (i.e. the cars won't have to stop and accelerate as much, cars on the highway could drive a lot closer and draft each other) I doubt it'll be a net positive.

[Greg]

Why would anyone want to own a driverless car. Why not just call the driverless Uber to pick you up. I'm betting this results in way less gridlock and traffic and a huge positive impact on the environment FWIW. This is like having a street-level tram that will take you anywhere you want to go, whenever you want to go there, with no intermediary stops. And no massive public capital expenditure to make it happen.