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[Marine] BC Ferries


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#3861 FirstTimeHomeCrier

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 06:29 PM

^Thanks, but I own several medium sized corporations and I have never guaranteed in anyway shape or form "service levels" to my clients.  You were the one who explained that call centres must meet "rigid service levels that if not met can cost his firm multiple thousands of dollars in penalties, and in a worse case scenario lose his job all together" and I don't have a clue what that means specifically for a call centre rep at BCF.  That is what I am asking

 

I see no difference between a pizza kid answering the phone and taking an order than a BCF call centre agent answering the phone, with the exception of the wage.  Same level of education, same skills, etc.  I am all ears if you can tell me the difference.

 

For one thing, most call centre agents are required to deal with a much wider scope of concerns than those answering phones at a pizza place. People call a pizza place to order pizza, maybe to ask for a location or opening hours. Perhaps they occasionally call to complain about a pizza, and the employee likely passes that call along to a manager. People might phone the BCF call centre for many reasons including reservations, questions about sailing times for one of many vessels, lost property, complaints about prices, onboard amenities, locations of terminals, promotional deals, Assured Loading cards, travel policies, technical help with the website, etc. Call centre agents are also usually asked to keep extensive notes in complicated client relationship management systems. Pizza place employees can scribble the order on a pad of paper. 

 

All this is not to say that food service workers are compensated fairly. Everyone deserves a living wage, and most food service workers don't make one. But to imply that the work done by BCF call centre employees and those answering the phone at a pizza place is equivalent because they both answer phones is just false.


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#3862 SamCB

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 06:58 PM

BCF has to meet targets for customer service satisfaction, among other targets, as laid out in the coastal ferry act. That's why the call centre exists. And it's the same reason there are always customer service satisfaction surveyors on the ferries asking you about your experience onboard.

Who will deliver the service if bcf fails to meet targets? Great question. Probably nobody else, and maybe BCf would face a financial penalty, but thinking and acting at a policy-level doesn't do the BC ferry services corp much good. The executives act as if they are a real private corp delivering a service to the provincial gov. If the current CEO isn't up for playing that shell game, the board would find someone else who is. That's how BCF operates.

Re: call centre wages. The job requires a pretty intense 6 week training program before you are ready to take calls. There is a lot more to BCF's network than just major routes. You need to be able to figure out the multi port routes and reservations for gulf island routes. I'm not kidding when I say only a handful of people inside BCf understand that shmozzle of routes and how they interact. It's as complex a multi-nodal network as you'll find anywhere in the world. You also need to answer dangerous goods questions that require interpreting the TC TDG regs correctly. You need to be able to accurately explain and book northern route vessels -- which are an entirely different ballgame. All this in addition to taking calls from fuming customers. I've done the job -- it's not easy. Of course it's not worth $23/hr, but cmon-- that's because of union. BCf would pay min wage if they could get away with it. But then again, they'd also scrap the entire customer service department if they could get away with it. As I said, it's all a shell game. They do what they do because the contract mandates it.
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#3863 Nparker

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Posted 16 November 2017 - 09:07 PM

...Of course it's not worth $23/hr...

I am more surprised that anyone still thinks $23/hour is some sort of s***-hot wage in 2017.


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#3864 Mike K.

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 06:12 AM

It is for a young person getting their foot through the door. Plus there’s a plush benefits package.

And you have to remember that the pizza call taker is also making tax-free tips, so really they’re making fat cash if their joint is half decent. As are food service workers just about anywhere outside of the fast food chains. But if you want those fast food workers to earn a quote-unquote “living wage” (above their already over minimum wage pay) then expect robots to replace them. That’s probably a few years off.

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#3865 jonny

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 08:32 AM

Tips aren't tax free. Legally, at least. 


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#3866 Mike K.

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 09:05 AM

Legally being the key word here.

 

I saw a tip-out the other day at a restaurant. Some dude (manager?) was handing out envelopes stacked with cash to staff.


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#3867 Mike K.

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 09:09 AM

I walked into a McDonald's this morning in lieu of taking the drive-thru during a coffee run (drive-thru was packed).

 

I must have wasted about 10 minutes in there as there was confusion over several coffee orders containing two creams, three creams, and double doubles. The staff mixed the wrong ratios into the wrong sized cups and couldn't figure out how to untangle the mess. Customers were looking on perplexed and some folks were starting to get agitated, including the staff who didn't understand why nobody was picking up the large double double (which should have been a medium double double).

 

Good times.


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#3868 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 09:11 AM

Legally being the key word here.

I saw a tip-out the other day at a restaurant. Some dude (manager?) was handing out envelopes stacked with cash to staff.


That’s the way tips are handled at 97%* of restaurants and bars. The employee is to declare them they have nothing to do with the business even if they are paid by credit or debit.
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<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#3869 shoeflack

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 09:14 AM

Bingo. As VHF mentions, tips are always paid out in cash. A lot of food service workers don't even realize they should be keeping track of every tip they receive so they can self report come tax season.

 

I've had a couple acquaintances who've been audited by the CRA for not reporting tips. It's not pretty.


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#3870 Nparker

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 09:26 AM

I don't want to do this, but I feel I must...

off-topic.jpg


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#3871 Bingo

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 11:21 AM

BORING!  :drillsergeant: 


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#3872 Nparker

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 11:33 AM

BORING! 

Agreed. The topic of tips is boring in the BC Ferries thread.



#3873 Mike K.

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 12:55 PM

That’s the way tips are handled at 97%* of restaurants and bars. The employee is to declare them they have nothing to do with the business even if they are paid by credit or debit.

 

Well yeah, of course that's how its done. But 97%* of employees will not remit that cash as income for income tax purposes.

 

I guess my point is every $1 earned tax free is really like earning $1.50, so the kid working for $12/hour at the pizza place going home with $40 in tips after a five hour shift actually made $60 + $40 + $20. Not bad.


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#3874 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 01:07 PM

91%* of service employees that actually add their tips to their income for tax purposes just use some figure, normally 10 or 15% of their salary, as their tip calculation.

 

So if they made $20,000 in salary on their T4, they throw in another $2,000 or $3,000 as tips on their tax return, and call it a day.

 

It is of course, woefully under-reported.


Edited by VicHockeyFan, 17 November 2017 - 01:07 PM.

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<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#3875 jonny

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 01:29 PM

If you are a server and report $0 for tips or even a low tip amount, an audit is coming your way. 


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#3876 Rob Randall

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 02:46 PM

If you tip the Chief Steward do you get priority lifeboat boarding in an emergency?



#3877 Nparker

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 02:50 PM

How many BC Ferries employees receive tips?



#3878 tjv

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 05:05 PM

Thanks SamCB for clarifying what BCF call centre does and also confirming $23 is overpaid.  I used the pizza kid as an example, but I think there are better examples out there like the conseriege at a 5 star hotel.  Regardless I think we can all agree that without the union that they would earn a lot less

 

Regardless this wage isn't free and it all adds up to the cost of an expensive ferry trip.  I would only guess that 25% of BCF staff have some real education or skills that wouldn't be affected if it was union or non-union like the people on the bridge or engine room

Bingo. As VHF mentions, tips are always paid out in cash. A lot of food service workers don't even realize they should be keeping track of every tip they receive so they can self report come tax season.

 

I've had a couple acquaintances who've been audited by the CRA for not reporting tips. It's not pretty.

I know a few people who own restaurants and they are required by CRA to keep track of all tips paid by debit, credit card, etc and put it on their T4 at the end of the year.  Anything done by non-cash is easy to trace these days

 

Frankly I agree with it, otherwise maybe more companies will be "tipping" at the end of year.  If a restaurant tip is "tax free" why isn't a Christmas bonus?



#3879 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 05:12 PM

No. Restaurants do not put anyone’s tips on T4s. Because rarely does the entire tip on a servers bill go entirely to him. Often he gives some to the bartender, the host, the kitchen and even the doorman.

Of course you have to save your records, but nobody’s tips are added to the T4s unless they are a strictly “controlled tip”. Only really lame restaurants do that.

https://www.canada.c...gratuities.html

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 17 November 2017 - 05:13 PM.

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<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#3880 shoeflack

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Posted 17 November 2017 - 06:00 PM

Thanks SamCB for clarifying what BCF call centre does and also confirming $23 is overpaid.  I used the pizza kid as an example, but I think there are better examples out there like the conseriege at a 5 star hotel.  Regardless I think we can all agree that without the union that they would earn a lot less

 

Probably better to stick with the pizza boy analogy. Many (if not most) 5 star hotels are unionized. At the Empress, for instance, there are only a handful of low level roles below $20/hr. Also, the role of Concierge at a 5-star hotel is typically an exempt management position. Both concierge's at the Empress are exempt managers who make well beyond $23/hr.


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