152 replies to this topic

[Nparker]

The province via one of its agencies makes up the shortfall.

Great, so I get to pay for those who choose not to pay their taxes?

[VicHockeyFan]

They pay them eventually.

[todd]

They pay them eventually.

Suppose you could put your children, grandchildren maybe even great-grandchildren on the title just before you start the deferring?

Edited by todd, 28 November 2017 - 07:22 PM.

[VicHockeyFan]

The deferment will be registered as a charge on title, no matter who owns it.

[todd]

The deferment will be registered as a charge on title, no matter who owns it.

So in theory you could keep deferring for 100+ years?

Edited by todd, 28 November 2017 - 11:09 PM.

[Mike K.]

Once the senior who is on title and applying for the tax break passes, their child or benefactor will no longer be able to apply for the tax break unless they themselves live in the home and are a senior.

[rjag]

I think VHF misses my point here. These are costs that residents should have been paying all along.

 

As a resident and taxpayer in OB, I expect my council to look after the infrastructure that current and prior residents/taxpayers have paid for over the years. This is not new news and any Councillor that acts surprised should resign. These warnings about infrastructure have been going on for the last 15-20 years, that a policy of funding 1% of infrastructure should be built into every budget to build reserves to act when needed. 

 

This should be common standard practice in every Muni, and should be sacrosanct. Deferring these costs down to future generations is irresponsible.

 

For a small Muni like OB with very little in the way of a business base and no undeveloped land the ability to raise taxes can only happen by either increasing taxes or growing the tax base. With such a vocal contingency of Nimby's here fighting projects there is really only one route to go and thats to increase taxes. 

[VicHockeyFan]

I think VHF misses my point here. These are costs that residents should have been paying all along.

 

As a resident and taxpayer in OB, I expect my council to look after the infrastructure that current and prior residents/taxpayers have paid for over the years. This is not new news and any Councillor that acts surprised should resign. These warnings about infrastructure have been going on for the last 15-20 years, that a policy of funding 1% of infrastructure should be built into every budget to build reserves to act when needed. 

 

This should be common standard practice in every Muni, and should be sacrosanct. Deferring these costs down to future generations is irresponsible.

 

For a small Muni like OB with very little in the way of a business base and no undeveloped land the ability to raise taxes can only happen by either increasing taxes or growing the tax base. With such a vocal contingency of Nimby's here fighting projects there is really only one route to go and thats to increase taxes. 

 

Fair enough, I do not think I missed your point though.

 

Absolutely these costs have been deferred too long but it's by the politicians that were voted in by taxpayers.

 

So they - the politicians and the voters - brought it on themselves.  And Oak Bay residents will now have to lift themselves out of it.  Or suffer some serious water main, sewer and storm drain issues here and there.

 

My point is that Oak Bay residents are in the very enviable position of having made lots of money just by appreciation on their homes over the last 5 years, so the vast majority of them can afford some higher taxes to get this stuff done.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 29 November 2017 - 08:56 AM.

[rjag]

Fair enough, I do not think I missed your point though.

 

Absolutely these costs have been deferred too long but it's by the politicians that were voted in by taxpayers.

 

So they - the politicians and the voters - brought it on themselves.  And Oak Bay residents will now have to lift themselves out of it.  Or suffer some serious water main, sewer and storm drain issues here and there.

 

My point is that Oak Bay residents are in the very enviable position of having made lots of money just by appreciation on their homes over the last 5 years, so the vast majority of them can afford some higher taxes to get this stuff done.

Saanich, Victoria and Esquimalt are going to be faced with the same issues......its not unique to OB....so just jack everyones taxes up by an extra $1k as all their property values have increased so they can all afford it...... Problem solved. 

[VicHockeyFan]

^ Would you rather the money come out of your income taxes, or some other magic pot?  It seems very reasonable to me that property taxes pay for sewers, water mains, sidewalks, and storm drains.

 

I think you'll find Saanich is not so bad off, they have a very diverse range of infrastructure age.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 29 November 2017 - 09:04 AM.

[rjag]

^ Would you rather the money come out of your income taxes, or some other magic pot?  It seems very reasonable to me that property taxes pay for sewers, water mains, sidewalks, and storm drains.

 

I think you'll find Saanich is not so bad off, they have a very diverse range of infrastructure age.

 

I have no problem paying my taxes, but again you miss my point, its the lack of action by prior councils and the irresponsible decisions to defer while continually increasing the taxes annually and there is nothing to show for it....taxes at this level should be paying for stable infrastructure....it should be a given....you are focusing on the extra money and being dismissive, I'm focusing on the lack of ability to manage that money to begin with

[VicHockeyFan]

I have no problem paying my taxes, but again you miss my point, its the lack of action by prior councils and the irresponsible decisions to defer while continually increasing the taxes annually and there is nothing to show for it....

 

Well, you Oak Bay residents voted them in. 

 

And as far as "nothing to show for it", you can read each and every annual report, see where all the money goes.   

 

It's right here > > https://www.oakbay.c...eport FINAL.pdf

 

In 2016 you paid 44 staffers (not including police) over $75,000.  And of those 44, you paid 32 of them over $100,000, and you paid 23 of those over $125,000, and you paid 8 of those over $150,000.

Edited by VicHockeyFan, 29 November 2017 - 09:30 AM.

[rjag]

Well, you Oak Bay residents voted them in. 

 

And as far as "nothing to show for it", you can read each and every annual report, see where all the money goes.   

 

It's right here > > https://www.oakbay.c...eport FINAL.pdf

 

In 2016 you paid 44 staffers (not including police) over $75,000.  And of those 44, you paid 32 of them over $100,000, and you paid 23 of those over $125,000, and you paid 8 of those over $150,000.

 

Hehe, no argument from me....it begs the question, can small municipalities like OB survive with the specter of such debt burdens?

[Bingo]

A mystery of how sewage is being dumped into the Gorge Waterway has finally been solved.  It's been determined that sewer lines from as many as 400 homes in Esquimalt could be draining into the Gorge - causing outbreaks of contamination in the waterway.

Oak Bay is going to have some of these issues, Saanich is going to have some of these issues. Anyone with old buildings is probably going to come across this."

http://www.iheartrad...terway-1.352452

[Coreyburger]

Well, you Oak Bay residents voted them in. 

 

And as far as "nothing to show for it", you can read each and every annual report, see where all the money goes.   

 

It's right here > > https://www.oakbay.c...eport FINAL.pdf

 

In 2016 you paid 44 staffers (not including police) over $75,000.  And of those 44, you paid 32 of them over $100,000, and you paid 23 of those over $125,000, and you paid 8 of those over $150,000.

 

Even if Oak Bay had zero staff (which it couldn't), the amount "saved" wouldn't even begin to cover one project.

[todd]

Even if Oak Bay had zero staff (which it couldn't), the amount "saved" wouldn't even begin to cover one project.

 

Depends how long your bike lane is.

[todd]

Well, you Oak Bay residents voted them in. 

 

And as far as "nothing to show for it", you can read each and every annual report, see where all the money goes.   

 

It's right here > > https://www.oakbay.c...eport FINAL.pdf

 

In 2016 you paid 44 staffers (not including police) over $75,000.  And of those 44, you paid 32 of them over $100,000, and you paid 23 of those over $125,000, and you paid 8 of those over $150,000.

 

How does that compare to other municipalities?

[rjag]

Interesting, went to OB today to pay for the mutt license and discover they are closed from Dec 22 to Jan 02....I wonder if this is a paid or unpaid holiday?

[Bingo]

Interesting, went to OB today to pay for the mutt license and discover they are closed from Dec 22 to Jan 02....I wonder if this is a paid or unpaid holiday?

 

If bicycles don't need a license then I don't think mutts should need one, especially in Oak Bay where all mutts are civilized. 

[North Shore]

 in Oak Bay where all mutts are civilized. 

 

That just means that they don't poop on cricket-pitch/bowling green mowed lawns - if you're so uncouth as to use a rotary mower, then it's fair game