53 replies to this topic

[Victoria Watcher]

You said this:


But today vehicles are costing well north of $100k, for anything practical for business or a larger family vehicle.



I submit that only a tiny subset is priced over $100,000. Then I provided many examples with links.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 13 February 2024 - 11:30 AM.

[Mike K.]

Fair enough, I meant to say a nicer trimmed larger family vehicle, i.e. minivan, full-size SUV, full-size quadcab pick-up.

 

I encourage you guys to check out the ownership costs of vehicles we took for granted just a few years ago. A Lariat F150 now starts at $83k, for 2024. And it's a mid-trim. A fully loaded F150 is over $100k now sticker price, before taxes, before interest, and not totally optioned out. The Raptor is almost $110k, starting.

[lanforod]

Pigs are flying somewhere, Mike walked back his hyperbole.

 

Anyways, back on topic before Mike tried to lead this on another attack vs Tesla - I think if we go too far down the regulation road that can cause issues too. By all means though, provide legal avenues to go after unscrupulous developers like this one - though IMO, there should be some punitive damages here as well - perhaps that coming yet. At the same time, don't red tape and strangle everything to death because of some bad apples.

[Mike K.]

Real-estate is among the most regulated industries. New regulations were also just announced this year.

The auto industry could use some of these regulations.

[Mike K.]

Btw, that used Tahoe and Expedition you want to buy as the family car. Care to guess how much they cost now, new?

[lanforod]

About 90. You never said new. And a middle class family shouldn’t be buying those new

[Mike K.]

$90, plus tax, plus interest over 5-8 years, right?

Someone has to buy them new, and a lot of middle class families do. It’s not for us to decide whether it’s sensible or not. But should they not benefit from better protections? I think they should.

[lanforod]

I said it in another thread - debt culture is stupid. Stop encouraging people to go into debt, especially for a depreciating asset.

[Mike K.]

Oh I’m with you.

But someone has to buy new, so others can buy 3-6 years old. I think my daily driver costs $150k new now, plus tax, plus interest. It’s a $200k vehicle if you’re not paying cash.

Insanity.

[lanforod]

If people would just stop financing these things and going into debt, prices would drop so people don't have to pay ridiculous prices for them.

 

Anyways, every single family I know uses a mid size SUV or a minivan, not these truck based things except for a couple, in which case both of them bought older, mid range trim ones. Normal families are not buying upper trim luxury trucks or SUVs new OR used. I'm looking only because I actually need the seating space for 6+ AND I tow a TT. I 'could' finance or spend 100k on one, but that makes NO sense at all.

Edited by lanforod, 13 February 2024 - 03:13 PM.

[Mike K.]

Look at a Toyota AWD minivan. It’s $85k new, total cost of ownership at today’s rates. And that’s not the top trim, just the first trim with AWD.

A budget Chrysler/Dodge Caravan, all in with interest is $76k now. There’s only one trim, couple of basic options. The up-market Pacifica Pinnacle, all-in cost, is $108k. It’s a minivan!!!

[lanforod]

Then those Odysseys VW posted are a steal. Those are the best vans anyway.

[Mike K.]

Those are base prices, then you add tax, and then the interest. You’re at around $90k for the nice one, probably more.

[lanforod]

Or do what I did and buy used for 20k cash. My 2012 will probably last till 2045