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Is There a Method in City Planner Madness?


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#1 silentfoto

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 12:18 PM

Having lived in big cities it's painfully obvious Victoria in current boom is 30 years behind the curve on infrastructure.

A horse and buggy town one taxi driver told me.

With boom only in it's infancy Vic needs a couple of freeways the way it is moving or crawling. Easier said than done I know but, as a city bus riding denizen of Vic, getting through downtown is a form of torture.

Curious if any of the city planners take public transportation to work. Even live within confines of Victoria?

Way it's going we will end up walking as a quicker alternative too the laboured bus service from our Air BNB residences because their ain't no apartment on the rental market.
Ive witnessed it before living in Berkeley in the dot com years.

Go to see an apartment only to find into 20 other couples waiting outside in line.

Plus, can your average service sector worker afford a $1300 one bed?
 


Edited by silentfoto, 13 May 2018 - 12:20 PM.


#2 todd

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 03:48 PM

Have you seen the new bike lanes?
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#3 On the Level

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 08:37 PM

It's by design.  Make it less and less attractive to drive/park and you are more likely to take a bus.  Make it less and less attractive to take a bus, and you are more likely to ride a bike.

 

Of course that doesn't take into account demographics or the realities of our climate 4 months of the year, but that's the route we are going.  



#4 LeoVictoria

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Posted 13 May 2018 - 09:14 PM

Having lived in big cities it's painfully obvious Victoria in current boom is 30 years behind the curve on infrastructure.

 

 

There's your mistake.  Victoria is not a big city.   Kinda odd to expect it to have the infrastructure of one.  

 

That said our 13 munis make any kind of large project quite difficult so the development of infrastructure as we grow is going to be likely slower than a region with only one local government.


Edited by LeoVictoria, 13 May 2018 - 09:15 PM.


#5 Wayne

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 07:00 AM

Yes there is a method to the city planning.

 

The transport plan is the new bike lanes. This will be the road system for the homeless (and future influx of more) with their shopping carts.  Homeless RVs.

 

The housing/apartment plan is the millions for the affordable housing for the homeless.

 

You should ask if there is "sane" planning.


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#6 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 11:49 AM

Meanwhile Moon Under Water is having trouble securing approvals for its tasting room because it doesn't meet parking requirements, despite having a large parking lot and adjacent on-street parking.


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#7 Rob Randall

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:07 PM

Is this thread about freeways through Downtown? Is there a need to get from Pluto's Diner to Capital Iron at 90 kmh?


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#8 rjag

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:49 PM

Meanwhile Moon Under Water is having trouble securing approvals for its tasting room because it doesn't meet parking requirements, despite having a large parking lot and adjacent on-street parking.

 

And the stupid part is theres no residential around there within 500 metres so parking on evenings and weekends on the street is not a problem as most of these businesses are closed when this place will be at peak customer


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#9 todd

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 03:09 PM

Is this thread about freeways through Downtown? Is there a need to get from Pluto's Diner to Capital Iron at 90 kmh?


Could probably squeeze in an extra post or two on VV.

#10 PraiseKek

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 05:35 PM

The plan is to make driving in Victoria terrible so no one does it. If you think about that for a minute it'll never work. The key to the plan is to not think about it though.


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#11 LeoVictoria

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 05:39 PM

So, anyone can think of a similar sized city with substantially better infrastructure in Canada?

Infrastructure is great for us. Easy to drive downtown, easy to park downtown, some forward thinking moves on EV infrastructure, easy to bike downtown, easy to take the bus downtown. No rapid transit in sight but I’m not sure how many medium sized towns have that.

Meanwhile on the construction side the city is booming and the council seems to be doing a decent job approving projects given the number being built. We have everything from super luxury condos to affordable housing being built and in a way that is preserving the heritage character of the city.

We are also getting to a point where we as a society (and by extension Victoria council) seem to finally be pushing back against the NiMBYs and not just cowtowing to their every stupid objection.

Things are going well. But I guess it’s more fun to complain.

Edited by LeoVictoria, 14 May 2018 - 05:45 PM.

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#12 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 05:49 PM

For sure. Halifax, Saskatoon, Regina, London, Quebec City, Moncton and St John's. They all have proper highway infrastructure networks. All the other cities are much larger or much smaller.

Victoria got the shaft as far as highways and boulevards are concerned. When smaller towns like Sask and SJ have better developed highway networks you really have to ask what went so terribly wrong here.

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#13 RFS

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:18 PM

For sure. Halifax, Saskatoon, Regina, London, Quebec City, Moncton and St John's. They all have proper highway infrastructure networks. All the other cities are much larger or much smaller.

Victoria got the shaft as far as highways and boulevards are concerned. When smaller towns like Sask and SJ have better developed highway networks you really have to ask what went so terribly wrong here.


I totally agree but having recently been there want to mention that Quebec City really is much larger. Metro population is 800k which is closer to Edmonton or calgary than to victoria

#14 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:22 PM

Oh wow. I had no idea it was that big!

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#15 Rob Randall

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 08:07 PM

This is all too vague. Are we taking about the CRD of the City of Victoria? What practicable steps are you advocating to upgrade traffic infrastructure?



#16 LeoVictoria

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 08:11 PM

For sure. Halifax, Saskatoon, Regina, London, Quebec City, Moncton and St John's. They all have proper highway infrastructure networks. All the other cities are much larger or much smaller.

Victoria got the shaft as far as highways and boulevards are concerned. When smaller towns like Sask and SJ have better developed highway networks you really have to ask what went so terribly wrong here.

 

We're on an island.  We don't have a major port.  We aren't a thoroughfare.   Don't really have to wonder at all.  

 

Oh and we need to amalgamate desperately at least to get rid of the useless munis like View Royal and the Highlands and Central/North Saanich.  Hoping for a positive response on the first step in the fall between Victoria and Saanich.


Edited by LeoVictoria, 14 May 2018 - 08:14 PM.


#17 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 09:34 PM

Victoria was the major west coast port until the mid-20th century, but certainly during the era of the freeway development explosion. Freeways were even proposed across Vic West and into James Bay. Rob may have some schematics of that somewhere.

 

Our civic leaders missed the boat or adopted a growth policy that was far more muted than it ought to have been. We even had multiple rail lines in this region and significant rail resources along the upper harbour, but unlike highways that infrastructure was mostly private.

 

I mean, the fact that we have a less developed highway infrastructure network in not only Victoria but on Vancouver Island than the Saskatoon/Regina centres and corridor says a lot about the local mindset, but we're certainly paying dearly for that now.


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#18 On the Level

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 09:57 PM

^ I agree but it has to be done right.  

 

I didn't much like the highway infrastructure in California, a total mess.  I thought it worked well throughout in New England.  You can drop off the highway and be in residential areas not impacted by the highway.  The commute home slowed at times but it wasn't at a standstill like here, and my trip was much longer.

 

Now instead we have the Old Island Highway, Gorge, Burnside, Helmcken......all being turned into residential with insufficient CRD funding and guidance.



#19 Rob Randall

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Posted 15 May 2018 - 05:49 AM

Here is a small version, sorry if it's too small. Looking south, the Inner Harbour is near the top. This is what civic leaders and planners in the early 1960s assumed Vic West would look like in the distant year of 1990. California-style freeways splayed out in every direction. What a joke.

 

vic-west-freeway.jpg


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#20 Mike K.

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Posted 15 May 2018 - 06:00 AM

Right, and that was a totally bogus vision. But you can see that the drive was once there for a robust and interconnected network of boulevards/major roads.

Nobody is arguing that the future should have unfolded as envisioned in that graphic but my oh my, the strangling of roadways if only to exert influence over motorists through “my turf” is economically stifling this region and a negative symptom of our Balkanized situation.

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