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Canada vs. Saudi Arabia


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#61 Cassidy

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 06:54 AM

You said it was weird that he called him "Uncle K".

I said I though it wasn't weird at all.

 

But your post above has nothing to do with JT calling him "Uncle K", and everything to do with what seems to be just a little more JT "hate" ... which isn't a conversation I feel I need to participate in.

 

Sorry for the distraction.



#62 Mike K.

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 07:30 AM

Hate is a strong word. Disappointment is far more fitting.

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#63 jonny

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 07:39 AM

Trudeau is not in the wrong, per se, but he continues to fail to advance Canada's economic interests, abroad. 


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#64 Wayne

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 07:43 AM

jonny, on 09 Aug 2018 - 08:39 AM, said:

Trudeau is not in the wrong, per se, but he continues to fail to advance Canada's economic interests, abroad. 

So true!

 

Not the first country that JT (and team) has preached Canadian values. Including NAFTA.

 

Easy to wear rose tinted glasses and fling tweets. Following up is another story, including within our own country.



#65 jonny

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 07:51 AM

I wonder what Canadian values will be when we're broke because nobody wants to do business with preachy, holier than thou Canada?

 

Look, the west is the minority. Most countries are massively sexist, racist, violent and intolerant. 


Edited by jonny, 09 August 2018 - 07:51 AM.


#66 Cassidy

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 11:16 AM

 

Look, the west is the minority. Most countries are massively sexist, racist, violent and intolerant. 

Best we let them be then? ... to their own devices as it were, and simply continue to call these countries out for what they truly represent.

 

Pandering to evil is evil in and of itself ... thank God we're in Canada, with a government that isn't afraid to stand up for human rights. The United States used to be with us on that issue, but now we're going it alone in North America.

Joining us are most of the European Union, Australia, and New Zealand ... but beyond that it's pretty much a crap shoot in terms of human rights.

 

The Saudi's are acting like children, like they always do. They create these issues for no reason, and then struggle to get back out of them without losing face. 

They're an abysmal, horrid nation, truly barbarians at the core ... I couldn't care any less than I do that they've chosen to try and teach Canada a lesson ...  nobody is really paying their tantrum any attention though, which is already causing them to lose face - and equally driving them crazy that they're not getting any more traction than a passing mention in Canadian papers, and nothing at all in other countries national papers.


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#67 Rob Randall

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 11:34 AM

If Saudi Arabia is trying to make an example of us, to show the rest of the world the repercussions of criticizing the Kingdom--what is the downside of Canada calling their bluff and doubling down on the criticism?

 

Seems to me they chose to spank us because they figured Canadians would apologize. What if we don't? I doubt SA wants to die on that hill. 


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#68 jonny

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 11:56 AM

The Saudi's are acting like children...

 

I agree. What Canada has done is not at all unusual. We throw out these sorts of condemnations monthly, if not weekly. SA's response, on the other hand, is very unusual. 



#69 Mike K.

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 12:00 PM

Did you guys miss the memo?

US court allows 9/11 victims' lawsuits claiming Saudi Arabia helped plan terror attack: https://www.google.c...279236.html?amp

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#70 dasmo

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 12:04 PM

Exactly, it’s words and nothing more. SA is overreacting big time. Under no circumstances should JT apologize for criticizing something that 100% should be criticized. Now is not the time to be cowardly on this front. Basic human rights is something that goes beyond social justice and is a worthy thing as a first world to try to influence on the third world, even if they are wealthy third worlders....
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#71 Wayne

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 06:46 PM

http://www.msn.com/e...b9&ocid=DELLDHP

 

Good article that differs from the general consensuses.

 

Was the Minister's tweet good for Canada or the objective?

 

Why tweet?  If the objective was to bring up our Canadian values, why express directly one to one? Foreign minister to Foreign minister.

 

Tweeting as way to convey foreign policy is mickey mouse.



#72 lanforod

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Posted 09 August 2018 - 10:03 PM

Didn't you get the memo? Twitter is the 'new' medium for all important announcements. Trump and Musk are the masters.



#73 Cassidy

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Posted 10 August 2018 - 05:31 AM

 

Tweeting as way to convey foreign policy is mickey mouse.

I actually agree with this.

It's amateurish, and seems more a quest for attention (on the part of the tweeter) than it does a demonstration highlighting a professional politician seeking a solution to a difficult diplomatic issue.

 

It's to the point where elected Federal and Provincial politicians speaking from their platform should be banned from tweeting personal or party "opinions" in any form ... permitted only to tweet relevant, timely, and general information that might be of interest to Canadians.

 

Twitter diplomacy, and attempts to advance a political agenda via a tweet are childish at best, and potentially dangerous at worst.

 

Canada is absolutely in the right to call the Saudi's out on their abysmal human rights record ... but through proper channels might actually get some sort of result, as opposed to Tweeting it out and forcing the Saudi's hand in terms of their childish aversion to public criticism of any kind.


Edited by Cassidy, 10 August 2018 - 05:33 AM.

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#74 Mike K.

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Posted 10 August 2018 - 05:32 AM

Obviously Canada wants to be more like Trump.

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#75 Cassidy

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Posted 10 August 2018 - 05:40 AM

Obviously Canada wants to be more like Trump.

I think lesser talented politicians very likely do see how Trump has managed to target his base through his Twitter use, and also very like think they might advance their agenda (or career) by trying to do the same thing.

 

But realistically, this current affair has nothing to do with "Canada" ... and everything to do with the departmental minion that controls the Foreign Affairs Twitter account, who may (unlikely), or may not have (likely) sought permission from Chrystia Freeland prior to posting.



#76 G-Man

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Posted 11 August 2018 - 09:38 AM

^ From working in the public service myself, I would find it almost impossible to believe that the tweet would have gone out without direct approval from their Minister's Office. 


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#77 Cassidy

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Posted 11 August 2018 - 10:00 AM

I think your key words are "Ministers Office".

 

An office usually occupied by a dozen or more people on a daily basis (maybe double that for a Federal Cabinet Minister), any one of those minions could use the company account to tweet something along party lines, but that Freeland might not even realize was happening.

 

Devils advocate to my own thinking:

Perhaps Freeland writes, and tweets from her own phone on the External Affairs Twitter account ... it's just that I kind of doubt that's the case here.



#78 Mike K.

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Posted 11 August 2018 - 10:02 AM

If it was just some minion, the post would have been deleted and Trudeau wouldn’t have focused in on the fallout.

That was a premeditated, policy-driven statement. Its location is irrelevant in a day and age when Twitter/Facebook/blogs/websites are used to post official and sanctioned statements from a federal government.

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#79 Cassidy

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Posted 11 August 2018 - 10:14 AM

Perhaps ... but the underlying concept that was expressed in the tweet with regards to Saudi Arabia is hardly a shocker, or any sort of "surprise" to anybody.

It's pretty much a Canadian institution, and one of this Liberal governments cornerstone policies.

The Saudi's are just pis_ed because it was done in a tweet rather than the normal private channel from embassy to embassy.

 

As I noted though, perhaps Freeland types External Affairs tweets in on her own phone, and then presses "send".

I'd bet on a minion though, be it her Executive Assistant or Deputy Minister ... a minion nonetheless.


Edited by Cassidy, 11 August 2018 - 10:15 AM.


#80 Mike K.

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Posted 13 August 2018 - 07:47 AM

Elon Musk has admitted that last week’s fracas over his tweet about taking Tesla private was driven by discussions with Saudi Arabia which insinuated the Kingdom may wish to invest to privatize the company. But that desire has fizzled out, at least for now.

Musk couldn’t of have been happier, human rights violations and atrocities be damned. He’d also have been in bed with the Kingdom of Oil. Square that one up for an electric vehicle company.
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