2544 replies to this topic

[Nparker]

I hope you are right Taco, but CoV voters are a strange bunch.

[Stephen James]

I hope you are right Taco, but CoV voters are a strange bunch.

true and I'm not betting the farm (now a homeless encampment)

[JimV]

The time is not now, but when it is, I think an endorsement by Cynthia Diadyk would swing a lot of weight.  She is not a political presence, but she has mobilized the opposition to the BHP mess.  A lot of people who signed are very angry and my guess is that more than half of them are Victoria voters.  Many, I suspect, who never bothered to vote last time.

 

A careful recommendation for a candidate who represented the views of the signatories would, I think, yield a lot of votes.  It would also help winnow the field of candidates.

 

The candidate, in turn, would have to stand firmly on side and not gaslight us with blather about “inclusivity” and “challenges.”  (Take note, Stephen Andrew.)

[Greg]

A single issue can win a special election. 20k people have signed the BHP petition. If half of them are CoV voters, tackling that issue head-on seems to have the greatest likelihood of electoral success.

[Victoria Watcher]

most candidates will be wishy washy even on an easy issue like BHP.

look at Stephen Andrew.

this by-election is pointless.

[Stephen James]

The time is not now, but when it is, I think an endorsement by Cynthia Diadyk would swing a lot of weight.  She is not a political presence, but she has mobilized the opposition to the BHP mess.  A lot of people who signed are very angry and my guess is that more than half of them are Victoria voters.  Many, I suspect, who never bothered to vote last time.

 

A careful recommendation for a candidate who represented the views of the signatories would, I think, yield a lot of votes.  It would also help winnow the field of candidates.

 

The candidate, in turn, would have to stand firmly on side and not gaslight us with blather about “inclusivity” and “challenges.”  (Take note, Stephen Andrew.)

Lots to think about here.

Both Rachel M and S Hardmann look, whether they like it or not, the same and too much like TV.  

Someone has an opportunity to carve some white space but it will need a line in the sand, an unambiguous statement about how and why he/she is different.  Having said that, we're all too world weary (I hope and believe) to accept that the right answer is someone parked at the opposite end of the spectrum because this see-saw, pendulum, trading-power-back-and-forth is rightly making us cynical.

So how to message a middle path?  Hard to do but, if it's credible, it's the message we're hungering for after how many years of this dogmatic bullshit. 

Look, I believe leadership is very, very hard and thankless but immensely fulfilling.  Leading for everyone means you're not in anyone's camp, real OR perceived.  That's lonely, but it's also authentic.  You must be flexible as a leader or you will be seen, quickly and clearly, to be interested more in your ideas than in leading people.  Being flexible means being ready to be shocked at how wrong you were when thousands of people explain it to you.  Funny, if you've got the courage to admit it, but too often true.

[JimV]

Having said that, we're all too world weary (I hope and believe) to accept that the right answer is someone parked at the opposite end of the spectrum because this see-saw, pendulum, trading-power-back-and-forth is rightly making us cynical.

I haven’t seen too much see sawing going on.  The last time we had a sensible, middle of the road mayor was Alan Lowe in 2008.  The see saw has been firmly planted in the SJW sandbox since then.  Some of the existing council members at one time showed some common sense but long ago drank the  kool aid.

[Nparker]

 

...Some of the existing council members at one time showed some common sense but long ago drank the  kool aid....

I know. It's like CTJ and MA are afraid to be called out in front of the "cool kids" on council. GY is the only one who dares to offer a different opinion. I suppose he doesn't care if the rest of the council thinks he's woke.

[rmpeers]

I know. It's like CTJ and MA are afraid to be called out in front of the "cool kids" on council. GY is the only one who dares to offer a different opinion. I suppose he doesn't care if the rest of the council thinks he's woke.

Yes, CTJ and MA surely must feel some sort of pressure to toe the line, no matter how visibly insane the actions of Helps, Ben, Ben Junior and Ben's Staff (AKA the Together Victoria kids) may be. You'd think at some point they'd be embarrassed by it though.

[mbjj]

I can't fathom why CTJ and MA don't express some sort of opinion on some of these matters. Is something being held over them?

[A Girl is No one]

Worried about the legions of UVic trained activists that would come out of the woodwork and call them haters, racists, homophobic etc perhaps? It’s a big machine and very intimidating, particularly for a politician that lacks courage.

[JimV]

Worried about the legions of UVic trained activists that would come out of the woodwork and call them haters, racists, homophobic etc perhaps? It’s a big machine and very intimidating, particularly for a politician that lacks courage.

Watching them call CTJ racist and MA homophobic would be a fascinating display of language perversion.

[Nparker]

Watching them call CTJ racist and MA homophobic would be a fascinating display of language perversion.

This was more or less the tactic used against Stephen Hammond and the NewCouncil "slate" in 2018.

[spanky123]

I may not be objective (bwahahahaa) but this standing assumption may be weakening.  Isitt is kryptonite for TV when mentioned at the door.  If enough people knock on doors and mention Isitt, I think the extended playdate is over.

 

One day when I was a kid, I was sitting on my duff whining about how my buddy had all of the cool new toys and I had nothing.  My father walked over to me and lovingly clipped the side of my head and told me that if I wanted something I could go get a job and earn it like everyone else. I got two jobs.

 

These days sitting on your duff, feeling sorry for yourself, and blaming others for your failures is the calling card of the progressive movement.  If your neighbour has a nicer house it is because of intergenerational wealth and not because they saved money. If she earns more money than you it is because of workplace inequities and not because you took a useless degree from a second tier university. 

 

People underestimate the power of the message, especially when we have economic peaks where prices and consumption stand out. TV and Ben can draw 10,000 people by telling them they are being mistreated and marginalized and that they will stand up for them to end inequality. On the other hand the 70,000 who are generally happy with the status quo don't vote.

[rmpeers]

This was more or less the tactic used against Stephen Hammond and the NewCouncil "slate" in 2018.

True, I could them being fearful of being bullied by the wingnuts who pathetically try to brand anyone who has powers of reasoning as fascists.

[Stephen Andrew]

most candidates will be wishy washy even on an easy issue like BHP.

look at Stephen Andrew.

this by-election is pointless.

The camping issue in Beacon Hill Park and all other parks in #VictoriaBC needs to be settled once and for all.

I am clear where I stand on this issue - camping is not a solution to homelessness and camping should not be allowed in Beacon Hill Park.

We need a definite statement from Dr. Bonnie Henry on her #COVID19 orders as to whether she supports them being interpreted to support 24/7 camping in parks - not “just” in Victoria but across BC.

We have different rules in each municipality and this is creating confusion and inequitable care management of our homeless population.

Victoria allows 24/7 camping whereas neighbouring Saanich and Oak Bay do not.

When Victoria Council took the step to not enforce its camping bylaw, what on earth did it expect would happen?! Of course we saw an influx of homeless to our city.

But, it’s fair to point out that every action has a reaction and, once again, Council did not consider the consequences of its action.

The move placed extra pressure on Victoria Service Providers, Bylaw, Police, City Staff, Parks staff and the thousands and thousands of dollars to manage and restore damage to our community.

Victoria simply doesn’t have the resources to go it alone on this issue.

There is palpable anger over what we see in parks and on our streets. People are furious - and they have a right to be. It’s our tax dollars that are being used and, despite Council’s apparent belief, we do not have an endless supply.

I sense much of the anger is directed at the poor planning by council. If this issue was properly managed, the impact on our city should be minimal.

So, where do we go from here?

Let’s stop fighting. Let’s demand answers - answers that we can deal with and move forward.

Resource the issue. If we went back to 7-7 camping, we would still have the fallout from the sheer number of homeless now living in our small city. Council needs to take action and work with neighbouring municipalities so we are all on the same page and we work with a “Regional Distributed Model” for shelter and supported housing.

Open more services. We need to remove the argument that “the vulnerable population needs to be in Victoria because that’s where services are”. Nonsense. It’s a fallacy that the services can only operate in Victoria.

Saanich, Oak Bay, Central Saanich,
Langford and all municipalities should have support services - make them mobile - but Council needs to extinguish that old chestnut from other local politicians’ bag of verbal tricks.

Listen. Look, I don’t have all the answers, but I am willing to listen and at least acknowledge the different viewpoints. Some will disagree with me, but I’m going to listen. I want to be respectful and I really want to learn and find answers that are realistic and we can implement. We “all” need to do that.

Also, acknowledge there is trauma here - from many angles; trauma from being homeless, trauma from losing access to our parks, trauma from the crime and social disorder that is affecting our lives, and so on. I hope we can recognize this in each other and find a way through. It isn’t easy - I’ve experienced it all and still trying to come to terms with what’s happening.

And we need our City Council to do its job, get back in its lane and stop trying to be a provincial and federal government.

Honestly, to City Council; I don’t care if you have aspirations of higher office, that you want to bring about a revolution, or if you want to build legacies to yourself - do the job you were elected to do; RUN VICTORIA and all the boring issues that come with municipal governance. If you want to be an MLA or MP or an Ambassador of whatever for whoever, focus on the job you have now.

I believe the majority of citizens you represent are tired of your antics. I know I am.

[Nparker]

Your last three paragraphs say it all, Stephen.

[Midnightly]

i do very much agree that camping should go back to 7pm to 7am... camping should not be made soo inviting as it has been camping should be seen as a last resort... not a first resort claim your spot and stay as long as you please... if people have to pack up it's harder for tent cities to establish, it's harder for bike chop shops to form, it's harder for the excess of mess to build... it can also help people disperse, maybe go back to their communities  if it's not so inviting people won't stay around... maybe once people have moved on someplace where it's easier we can then help those who truly want and need help... but as it's sitting the crd cannot handle the constant influx and growing numbers... and the city of victoria itself is just getting swamped

Edited by Midnightly, 29 July 2020 - 12:29 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Stephen Andrew says:


We have different rules in each municipality and this is creating confusion and inequitable care management of our homeless population.



I say that 24/7 camping encourages and grows homelessness.




Stephen Andrew says we need Bonnie Henry to make a ruling.





I say we just need to go back to 7-7 camping and 90% of the issue will be solved and then we ca take on the last 10% with great zeal. if we had not allowed 24/7 camping we would not have filled all the hotels with campers. the 10% I refer could be easily accommodated.

the province finally figured it out and stopped buying hotels but now they have hundreds of people that will “settle” for lifelong welfare.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 29 July 2020 - 01:52 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

Stephen Andrew says:

 

We have different rules in each municipality and this is creating confusion and inequitable care management of our homeless population.

 

I say that 24/7 camping encourages and grows homelessness.  there is not much "confusion".  victoria is where you go if you want 24/7 camping with free food.  other municipalities do not offer this.  campers know this - they are not confused about it.




Stephen Andrew says:

 

 

we need Bonnie Henry to make a ruling.

 

i say we just need to go back to 7-7 camping and 90% of the issue will be solved and then we can take on the last 10% with great zeal. if we had not allowed 24/7 camping in the first place (on pandora at centennital square at beacon hill and topaz) we would not have filled all the newly-bought hotels with campers. the 10% I refer to could have been easily accommodated.

the province finally figured it out and stopped buying hotels but now they have hundreds of people that will “settle” for lifelong welfare.  why would you leave a free bachelor suite at 3020 blanshard when a comparable is $1000-1200/mo. in this town?

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 29 July 2020 - 02:23 AM.