2544 replies to this topic

[Victoria Watcher]

nearly 3 years ago:

 

 

 

Victoria councillors voted Thursday to replace, rather than refurbish, the Crystal Pool and Fitness Centre. It will now be up to Victoria taxpayers to approve or reject the borrowing of needed funds Just how much the city will need to borrow is yet to be determined, but councillors capped total cost at $69.4 million.The 45-year-old facility needs major repairs and equipment replacement.

 

___________________________________

 

Helps said she’s “very optimistic” that external funding will be found to lower the cost for Victoria taxpayers. She said Crystal Pool is a regional facility that is widely used, making it an attractive funding target for the province. She noted the federal government will soon release Phase 2 of its infrastructure funding program.

 

Helps also noted that next year is Victoria’s 150th anniversary as the capital of B.C., which might attract funding.

Staff had presented councillors with three options: retrofit the existing facility at an estimated cost of $40.9 million, retrofit and expand for $57.1 million, and build new at $69.4 million.

https://www.vicabc.c...ce-crystal-pool

 

 

 

this city can't even punch its way out of a wet paper bag.  there will no pool before 2025.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 13 November 2019 - 07:38 AM.

[Victoria Watcher]

and that'll be 18 years since this thread began.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Crystal Pool keep-up a costly affair



By Brennan Clarke
Victoria News
Jan 12 2007


City councillors not anxious to throw good money after bad

The rising cost of maintenance at Victoria’s aging Crystal Pool has some councillors demanding progress on plans to build a new recreation centre in the city.

Commenting on proposed annual maintenance costs in excess of $900,000 for the coming fiscal year, Coun. Geoff Young suggested the money would be better spent building a new pool and recreation centre.

“This is now a major expenditure program of close to $1 million a year,” he said Tuesday during the first of three special council meetings held to examine the 2007-08 municipal budget.

“My fear is that at some point we’re going to have to say ‘this is ridiculous.’ We’re going to say ‘we can’t afford to do this.’

“At some point it’s going to be cheaper to hire a taxi to go swimming in Saanich.”

The city recreation department unveiled a redevelopment plan for Crystal Pool in 2004, but the proposal called for the closure of several Victoria community centres and met with stiff opposition.

Since then the recreation department has conducted several rounds of consultation, but made precious little progress. Last spring, the department hired a consultant to help organize a community forum in June and “collate” the feedback with the goal of developing a plan some time in the fall.

Recreation director Donna Atkinson told council a steering committee is slated to hold further meetings beginning in February.

Coun. Helen Hughes warned that rushing into another ill-conceived plan would be a mistake.

“The steps need to be taken extremely carefully or else we do not carry the rest of Victoria along with us,” she said.

mailto:bclarke@vicnews.com

 

Crystal Pool keep-up a costly affair



By Brennan Clarke
Victoria News
Jan 12 2007


City councillors not anxious to throw good money after bad

The rising cost of maintenance at Victoria’s aging Crystal Pool has some councillors demanding progress on plans to build a new recreation centre in the city.

Commenting on proposed annual maintenance costs in excess of $900,000 for the coming fiscal year, Coun. Geoff Young suggested the money would be better spent building a new pool and recreation centre.

“This is now a major expenditure program of close to $1 million a year,” he said Tuesday during the first of three special council meetings held to examine the 2007-08 municipal budget.

“My fear is that at some point we’re going to have to say ‘this is ridiculous.’ We’re going to say ‘we can’t afford to do this.’

“At some point it’s going to be cheaper to hire a taxi to go swimming in Saanich.”

The city recreation department unveiled a redevelopment plan for Crystal Pool in 2004, but the proposal called for the closure of several Victoria community centres and met with stiff opposition.

Since then the recreation department has conducted several rounds of consultation, but made precious little progress. Last spring, the department hired a consultant to help organize a community forum in June and “collate” the feedback with the goal of developing a plan some time in the fall.

Recreation director Donna Atkinson told council a steering committee is slated to hold further meetings beginning in February.

Coun. Helen Hughes warned that rushing into another ill-conceived plan would be a mistake.

“The steps need to be taken extremely carefully or else we do not carry the rest of Victoria along with us,” she said.

mailto:bclarke@vicnews.com

 

[Nparker]

Someone help me please in understanding what Prosperity and Economic Inclusion means?...

CoV socialist code for wealth transfer? Whatever it means, I am bound to pay more taxes to make it happen.

[Jackerbie]

Yeah, this question bugged me also.  Obviously "Good Governance" is #1 but after that?  Not much to choose when one reads between the lines.

 

Where's "Transportation Efficiency" as an option?

Where's "Road, Infrastructure, and Civic Maintenance and Upkeep"?

 

Does upvoting "Strong, Livable Neighbourhoods" mean one is just supporting NIMBYism?

Does upvoting "Sustainable Transportation" mean nothing but support for more bike lanes?

 

And, above all, what happened to "Amalgamation"?

 

Could be that the whole exercise is convoluted and/or poorly worded, as there is one set of "Strategic Objectives" (those thinks listed in the question) and a second set of "Operational Priorities," which I guess don't appear anywhere in the survey. The "Operational Priorities" are:

Heritage conservation and heritage designation

Nurturing and supporting arts, culture, and creativity

Creating and maintaining a high-quality public realm

Continuous improvement with regard to open government

Meaningful and inclusive public engagement

Accessible information, facilities, and services,

Sound fiscal management

 

via https://www.victoria...egic Plan_e.pdf

[Torrontes]

Perhaps they might consider developing SMART goals. However,that is extremely unlikely as it might make them accountable.

Specific, Measurable, Attainable, Relevant, Time-based.

[Tom Braybrook]

Could be that the whole exercise is convoluted and/or poorly worded, as there is one set of "Strategic Objectives" (those thinks listed in the question) and a second set of "Operational Priorities," which I guess don't appear anywhere in the survey. The "Operational Priorities" are:

Heritage conservation and heritage designation

Nurturing and supporting arts, culture, and creativity

Creating and maintaining a high-quality public realm

Continuous improvement with regard to open government

Meaningful and inclusive public engagement

Accessible information, facilities, and services,

Sound fiscal management

 

via https://www.victoria...egic Plan_e.pdf

what is lacking throughout the questionnaire is an option labeled "None of the Above"

[tedward]

...those they are are supposed to represent or those they actually do represent? Probably a significant difference there.

 

The median income of their constituents. 

 

Don’t forget this is not a full time job, and the $41k per year remuneration reflected that fact. Raising the pay to $70k is extremely high for a part-time job doing what council does.

 

Yeah, I'd rather see people doing this work full-time and not getting paid extra for attending meetings that should just be part of the job.

[Mike K.]

The expectation that these individuals should put their lives on hold or to drop their other work/business priorities/commitments is asking far, far too much for a job that should only be concerned with patching potholes and development approvals (I'm being simplistic here, I know).

 

But the way our council has gone is they're tackling everything from global oil-related issues, to national political issues, to pursuits that are not in their lane, so-to-speak, and end up being overturned by higher levels of government, or never funded for being improperly managed. Council needs to stop with the ever increasing workload they've created for themselves and re-focus on the ABC's of running a city.

 

$41k for a part-time position is a heap of cash. It's huge renumeration for what council should be doing.

[Nparker]

...council...is...tackling everything from global oil-related issues, to national political issues, to pursuits that are not in their lane, so-to-speak, and end up being overturned by higher levels of government, or never funded for being improperly managed. Council needs to stop with the ever increasing workload they've created for themselves and re-focus on the ABC's of running a city.

This.

[shoeflack]

It seems to me that the whole part-time nature of the Council job is what attracts the very people that most on this forum take issue with. Who has the desire or time to jump into a $40k "part-time" job?...activist-types, people with mostly non-profit backgrounds, etc.

 

You're always going to be hard pressed to find a good, business-oriented person who has the flexibility to step away from their busy career to fit into a Council role.

 

Maybe if it were a proper, full-time role, you'd at least attract people who maybe would take less money than if they had another job, but who have that different background that we so desperately need on Council.

 

And let's be honest, it's going to be a full-time role for the next Council or the one after that to clean up the mess of our current leadership. Are we really going to attract the best people at $40k?

[Victoria Watcher]

It seems to me that the whole part-time nature of the Council job is what attracts the very people that most on this forum take issue with. Who has the desire or time to jump into a $40k "part-time" job?...activist-types, people with mostly non-profit backgrounds, etc.

 

not all.

 

geoff young - runs an economic consulting business

pam madoff - runs a bed and breakfast

shellie gudgeon - runs a restaurant

margaret lucas - ran a hotel

chris coleman - was a marketer

[shoeflack]

not all.

 

geoff young - runs an economic consulting business

pam madoff - runs a bed and breakfast

shellie gudgeon - runs a restaurant

margaret lucas - ran a hotel

chris coleman - was a marketer

 

And what do those folks all have in common? Age. They're older, more established folks who have the time now that their businesses are established or they have staff support.

 

Very rarely do we see younger, progressive business-types try to jump into Council roles. They're too busy. What we see instead is the activist-types who are used to a full-time salary of $35,000 for their non-profit job, so joining Council actually becomes a financial incentive. There's truly no barrier to entry for them.

 

Is the young entrepreneur or banker or whomever going to toss away their 100k+ job to run for Council? Not a chance.

 

That's what I'm talking about here. Council (generally speaking anyways, because I know there are some exceptions to this) either attracts activists/non-profit types of all ages or older business-people. There's a major demographic that is missing there, and it happens to be the one that we most desperately need.

[Victoria Watcher]

most young entrepreneur types don't want a job with a fixed salary though.  they want to work harder to be paid more.  at the very least they know/hope the extra hours they put into their business to start pays off later.  that does not really happen with council jobs.  

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 14 November 2019 - 12:40 PM.

[Mike K.]

Raising the pay won’t stop the activists, it’ll just make the job more lucrative. A business person won’t be move much by a $70k salary if the expectation suddenly becomes that their service must be full time for that amount of pay.

[Victoria Watcher]

a current saanich councillor and crd rep is a full-time grade school teacher.  the current view royal mayor is a full-time business owner.  the former oak bay mayor was a crown prosecutor.   the long-time mayor of langford is a long-time multi-business owner.

 

i think the job can be done by those with other jobs.

[sebberry]

#MikeKForCouncil

[Rob Randall]

^Only if Pam comes back.

 

Council can easily be a full time job if you really put your back into it.

[rmpeers]

In the last election there seemed to be well organized/financed campaigns for candidates backed by either Counc Isitt or the Mayor. Wouldn't it be daunting for a more business minded person to enter the race knowing that there's likely another Together Victoria candidate backed by $$, a slick campaign, etc?

[Victoria Watcher]

Council can easily be a full time job if you really put your back into it.

 

of course it can if you want to be a counsellor and an activist and a crusader and a gladhander to boot.  but if you just aim to be a good legislator it's a part-time job.

[Victoria Watcher]

In the last election there seemed to be well organized/financed campaigns for candidates backed by either Counc Isitt or the Mayor. Wouldn't it be daunting for a more business minded person to enter the race knowing that there's likely another Together Victoria candidate backed by $$, a slick campaign, etc?

 

dollars are pretty limited don't forget.