26251 replies to this topic

[dasmo]

speaking of studies

"Among US counties with populations greater than 500,000 people, during the week ending June 13,2020, the median estimate of the county level probability of a confirmed infection is 1 infection in 40,500 person contacts (Range: 10,100 to 586,000). For a 50 to 64 year-old individual, the median estimate of the county level probability of a hospitalization is 1 in 709,000 person contacts (Range: 177,000 to 10,200,000) and the median estimate of the county level probability of a fatality is 1 in 6,670,000 person contacts (Range 1,680,000 to 97,600.000).

 

Conclusions and Relevance: Estimates of the individual probabilities of COVID19 infection, hospitalization and death vary widely but may not align with public risk perceptions."

 

https://www.medrxiv....6.06.20124446v2

[Mike K.]

I don't know if I would equate that to skin colour.  The genuinely-not-able-to-wear a mask would likely have some ID for that?  There might be some looks for sure, todays society is weird to say the least.  Speaking for myself I likely won't go in to a store if they told me I had to wear a mask.  Not cause I'm boycotting but just respect their decision and I'll go somewhere else if I need to..  It's just choice.

 

People don't choose health conditions like asthma, or respiratory issues due to exposure on a job site, etc., just like they don't choose their ethnicity, so the example is fair.

 

I also don't think the solution is for random people to be carting other people to prove they have an ailment. But you're right though, if you encounter a business that requires you wear a mask, and you can't, I guess you go elsewhere.

[Victoria Watcher]

But you're right though, if you encounter a business that requires you wear a mask, and you can't, I guess you go elsewhere.

 

and if you are Black and they bar you entry you can always go to somewhere they allow you.

 

see how that does not work?

[GetLisaSomeHelps]

and if you are Black and they bar you entry you can always go to somewhere they allow you.

 

see how that does not work?

 

refusing service because one does not wear a mask is the same as refusing service because of skin colour. 2020 is getting weirder and weirder.

[Greg]

Does anyone have hard data demonstrating that my going into a business without shirt or shoes is dangerous? Are any of you armchair libertarians enraged over "no shirt, no shoes, no service" signs?

[Barrrister]

I rarely, as in almost never , go into a store these days. When I do I always mask with gloves. But my mask is a N-95 so it does provide me protection.Not paranoia but rather COPD which is a serious lung condition.

[Victoria Watcher]

Does anyone have hard data demonstrating that my going into a business without shirt or shoes is dangerous? Are any of you armchair libertarians enraged over "no shirt, no shoes, no service" signs?

 

are there conditions that would prevent the wearing of shoes or shirts for medical reasons?

[Victoria Watcher]

Does anyone have hard data demonstrating that my going into a business without shirt or shoes is dangerous? Are any of you armchair libertarians enraged over "no shirt, no shoes, no service" signs?

 

a lot of you armchair SJWs get uppity about bar or restaurant dress codes against gang colours or clothing etc.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 17 September 2020 - 12:05 PM.

[Ismo07]

People don't choose health conditions like asthma, or respiratory issues due to exposure on a job site, etc., just like they don't choose their ethnicity, so the example is fair.

 

I also don't think the solution is for random people to be carting other people to prove they have an ailment. But you're right though, if you encounter a business that requires you wear a mask, and you can't, I guess you go elsewhere.

 

I think he was saying if you choose not to wear a mask and get denied service that equates to skin colour.

[Victoria Watcher]

I think he was saying if you choose not to wear a mask and get denied service that equates to skin colour.

 

no i said if you CANNOT wear a mask for medical reasons then that's that.  sort of like skin colour.  you can't alter that condition.  nothing about choice.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 17 September 2020 - 12:37 PM.

[sebberry]

I rarely, as in almost never , go into a store these days. When I do I always mask with gloves. But my mask is a N-95 so it does provide me protection.Not paranoia but rather COPD which is a serious lung condition.

 

I don't understand the glove thing unless they're a fresh pair right as you enter the store and are discarded in the garbage bin on the way out.  

[Ismo07]

no i said if you CANNOT wear a mask for medical reason then that's that.  sort of like skin colour.  you can't alter that condition.

 

No you are right, I was coming back to edit...  This is still different in that you can show why you can't wear a mask.  I still do not agree it's the same though I appreciate the angle you are taking.  There are a few things I can think of like people with vision impairment don't drive, etc.  Ok that's not the same either.  I think for reasons of safety somethings have to occur that might not seem fair for every single person and might create some issues for the few.

Edited by Ismo07, 17 September 2020 - 12:41 PM.

[Victoria Watcher]

No you are right, I was coming back to edit...  This is still different in that you can show why you can't wear a mask.  

 

by sharing your medical information with a shopkeeper or clerk or security guard?  no i don't think you can show your mask issue easily.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 17 September 2020 - 12:44 PM.

[Ismo07]

by sharing your medical information with a shopkeeper or clerk or security guard?  no i don't think you can show your mask issue easily.

 

I thought you would get a hall pass or something?  I don't think it specifically indicates why, just that you can't.  How many people really can't wear a mask for a short period?  Is that a real thing or have we wasted too much time on it?

 

"There are no known medical conditions aside from a severe skin condition [like a very severe burn that needs medical attention] on your face that would prevent a person from wearing this type of mask,” David Kaufman, MD, pulmonologist and director of the medical ICU at Tisch Hospital, tells Health. “If you can wear a scarf to keep your face warm in the winter, you can wear a mask to prevent the spread of disease.”

 

https://www.health.c...ing-a-face-mask

Edited by Ismo07, 17 September 2020 - 01:02 PM.

[GetLisaSomeHelps]

by sharing your medical information with a shopkeeper or clerk or security guard?  no i don't think you can show your mask issue easily.

 

An honour system should suffice IMO. Unless the whole point is not what the gov tells us it is (would not be suprised if it wasn't).

 

As for those who berate people they don't know about not wearing a mask...not sure what to do about them.

Edited by GetLisaSomeHelps, 17 September 2020 - 12:58 PM.

[Mike K.]

I thought you would get a hall pass or something?  I don't think it specifically indicates why, just that you can't.  How many people really can't wear a mask for a short period?  Is that a real thing or have we wasted too much time on it?

 

"There are no known medical conditions aside from a severe skin condition [like a very severe burn that needs medical attention] on your face that would prevent a person from wearing this type of mask,” David Kaufman, MD, pulmonologist and director of the medical ICU at Tisch Hospital, tells Health. “If you can wear a scarf to keep your face warm in the winter, you can wear a mask to prevent the spread of disease.”

 

But if you're asthmatic and don't wear a scarf to keep your face warm in winter, what then?

 

What a silly thing for a medical doctor to say. Unbelievable.

[Victoria Watcher]

i'll admit there is likely few people that would suffer severe harm from the lightest of masks or bandannas.  if they had to wear one they would not die.

[Barrrister]

seberry: They are a fresh pair when going into the store and discarded before getting into the car after putting purchases into truck. Second fresh pair when unloading trunk. Actually the gloves are recycled often after two weeks of decontamination. Shower and shampoo vigorously when I get home. 

 

I think that this is far more cautious than is required for most people but than again I am far more vulnerable. On the other hand I dont wear a mask when out walking but I really do avoid people. 

 

I do believe that stores have a right to insist on masks particularly if they have made a commitment to their employees.

[Greg]

According to a patient advocacy site:  https://community.aa...vid-19-pandemic

 

“For people with very mild asthma or well-controlled asthma, it’s probably not going to be an issue,” said Dr. David Stukus, member of the Medical Scientific Council for the Asthma and Allergy Foundation of America (AAFA). “For people who have very severe disease and have frequent exacerbations, ER visits, hospitalizations, require lots of medications and frequent symptoms, it might cause more issues for those folks.”

 

If you have severe asthma and your breathing is so compromised that wearing a mask is an issue, you are also at a very heightened risk from COVID-19, so I'd think you might want to avoid going into indoor spaces where masks aren't being worn in any case.

[Mike K.]

You'd be at a high risk for various other things, too, and would know better than anyone else how to take care of yourself.