419 replies to this topic

[Bernard]

It does make me wonder, say a police force was not enforcing an injuction to clear rail lines. Can CN sue that province/police force for the revenue lost while the injuction was not being enforced?

I seriously doubt that this sort of case would get very far in the courts given the complexity of enforcing an injunction in this sort of situation.  For contempt you would have to have the police publicly refuse to enforce the injunction after an enforcement order was granted.   The police and courts are both part of the justice system and the courts are likely going to work from the belief that the police are best at judging how to enforce an injunction

[Victoria Watcher]

After all, it's decades of political foot-dragging that brought us to this point. Bringing out the riot batons won't solve it.

 

no it's not.  it's recent political correctness.  social and other media.  increasing welfare programs.

[RFS]

no it's not. it's recent political correctness. social and other media. increasing welfare programs.

Exactly. This crap only gets as far as we are willing to tolerate it. No other country would tolerate it at all

[Bernard]

This is not political correctness.  This is an issue that should have been settled over 100 years ago, so yes, this is decades in the making.   Blockades as are seeing now have been occurring on a regular basis since the late 1960s.  First Nations have been actively trying to get settlement since at least the 1890s.

 

The same sort of protests are seen in Australia and New Zealand though in New Zealand they settled it all 25 or so years ago and have no longer seen the same issues coming forward.   

 

The simple reality is that Canada has a constitutional obligation to most of the First Nations in BC and settle treaties with them but have consistently and constantly done everything to break the law and not do it.  The courts for close on 50 years I have been telling the Crown to negotiate but they seem to never take seriously and just go on with the status quo.   The courts have been pushing slowly but consistently to try and get the Crown to do anything.   What Canada can not do is show the legal mechanism by which they gained title to the land.  

 

The current fiasco could have been settled 20 years ago in the current treaty process if the Feds had decided to take the process seriously and some to an agreement with the Office of the Wet'suwet'en.  The Wet'suwet'en were seeking a treaty.   This whole process is doing serious harm to the Wet'suwet'en people internally.

[Victoria Watcher]

sounds like just a lot of lawyers on both sides making money. 

 

how many referendums or even surveys and polls have been held among FN communities asking the people directly their opinion?

 

i suspect zero.

[RFS]

No one believes there is anything the government could offer or do that would make the protests stop, because it really has nothing to do with the wetsuweten or land rights or anything like that. It’s about woke SJW virtue signalling and greta thunberg style climate protests. Its about western white male capitalism bad, anything else good.

[Victoria Watcher]

No one believes there is anything the government could offer or do that would make the protests stop, because it really has nothing to do with the wetsuweten or land rights or anything like that. It’s about woke SJW virtue signalling and greta thunberg style climate protests. Its about western white male capitalism bad, anything else good.

 

most if not almost all protesters have no idea what the pipe carries how large it is and what the impacts are or aren't.   they are just the usual grievance crew.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 25 February 2020 - 03:59 PM.

[Midnightly]

most if not almost all protesters have no idea what the pipe carries how large it is and what the impacts are or aren't.   they are just the usual grievance crew.

 

it really does feel like one protest rolls into another protest and into another protest... it seems as soon as one issue cools down another pops up to protest, and many are on different issues (me too movement, climate, homeless, first nations rights, truckers were protesting last week..).. to be honest i wouldn't be surprised if many people at one protest go to the next protest and then the next... i have a feeling we might be seeing teachers down there soon if contract renewals don't go over well

[Rob Randall]

People make comparisons to Oka or Clayoquot but these protests remind me more of the global unrest of 1968. People that summer demonstrated, even rioted in the street. In Mexico City it was anti-Olympics and indigenous rights. In Chicago it was anti-Republicanism and police brutality, Prague, anti-Sovietism etc. In every city it was a different thing and in many cases they were protesting for the sake of protesting and had no specific agenda. Emotions just seemed to boil over that summer. 

[Victoria Watcher]

i tried to look it up but failed.   but it reminds me of some type of saying.  when you have too many young men idle (no jobs) then bad stuff follows.  perhaps it follow on ireland during the troubles.

 

in any event we have such a rich society now (literally the poor are richer than the middle class in the 80's now) that all kinds of people have time and resources (their own plus government) to protest whatever and wherever they want.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 25 February 2020 - 04:31 PM.

[Rob Randall]

^That's good, though, right?BC was crippled by protests and strikes in the 80s. Now life is good and we're able to tackle problems that have been on the back burner for too long.

[Victoria Watcher]

^That's good, though, right?BC was crippled by protests and strikes in the 80s. Now life is good and we're able to tackle problems that have been on the back burner for too long.

 

not necessarily.  i'd like to see just one native band or clan argue about what band-bettering situation they are being denied.

 

that 48" gas pipe through millions of acres in middle bc is hurting them how?  holding them back from what and how?  20 bands signed on and agreed they'd like it.  three guys are opposed.  and every one of those three is enriched financially by the tides foundation.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 25 February 2020 - 04:52 PM.

[rjag]

https://twitter.com/...436047708950529

 

Heres Ellis Ross in a 3 part video calling out the BS 

[m3m]

Vic PD should be cited for contempt of court for failing to enforce the injunctions

 

VicPD can't be held in contempt of court.  The court hasn't made any orders that compel them to do anything - the court has only made orders against the protesters.   

 

Also, it is not generally the police's job to enforce civil matters and that's what this ultimately is.  The police aren't going to come around to enforce an order for payment that arises out of a small claims lawsuit.  

[todd]

If you were to pick a time to blockade a country now is the most convenient time what with COVID-19.

Edited by todd, 25 February 2020 - 10:11 PM.

[JimV]

VicPD can't be held in contempt of court.  The court hasn't made any orders that compel them to do anything - the court has only made orders against the protesters.   

 

Also, it is not generally the police's job to enforce civil matters and that's what this ultimately is.  The police aren't going to come around to enforce an order for payment that arises out of a small claims lawsuit.  

 

It's only a civil matter if we choose to treat it as one. It is an indictable offence to block a highway under CCC S.421(1)(g).  Have you noticed the police enforcing that law recently?  No, because they are choosing to conflate the constitutional right of free expression with clearly illegal blockades.  We will probably see the same thing happening later today on the Pat Bay Highway.  Police brass are fawningly sensitive to their political masters.  If they don't think they have the support of the latter they almost always take the easy way out.  The calculation is basically:  which would I rather do, enforce the law and possibly lose my job, or hide behind my discretionary authority until the politicians sort it out.

 

Most of the talk about reconciliation is also irrelevant blather.  The gas pipeline project passed an excruciating environmental review and achieved the support of all 20 bands along the route.  Those opposing it comprise a very small subset of hereditary chiefs and their supporters.  Well surprise, you're never going to get 100% support for anything.  So do we just let the country grind to a halt out of fear of offending a few malcontents and anarchists?  And never mind the fact that most of the so-called protesters probably don't know the first thing about the project or even know why they are protesting.  We have seen this time and time again in various guises.

 

 

[Benezet]

CN and CP both have police forces, and they have as much authority and power as any other police force. Where are they in all of this?

Looks like both railway police forces are now fully involved.

https://walkingeagle...re-rail-system/

[Mike K.]

^Are you sure that's not a bogus article?
 

Tens of thousands of officers from the OPP, RCMP, Sûreté du Québec, CN and CP Police forces are forming a massive human chain around the country’s entire rail system.

 

...

 

“Holy crap, they look like army ants or something,” said Emma Nelson, a Cree woman from Manitoba who witnessed the officers begin linking arms outside Winnipeg.

 

[Mattjvd]

Looks like both railway police forces are now fully involved.

https://walkingeagle...re-rail-system/

Yeah, that's an indigenous satire/parody news site.

Edited by Mattjvd, 26 February 2020 - 09:50 AM.

[Benezet]

Yeah, that's an indigenous satire/parody news site.

Yes, and I should think that would be most obvious!