169 replies to this topic

[Victoria Watcher]

If they want to save the tree the 1,500 can make an offer on the property.

[Spy Black]

Traffic engineering in the COV is really hit or miss, depending on what time of day you're talking about, and what streets (exactly) you're using to get wherever you're going.

 

Somewhat of a surprise to me, is that every single morning at around 7:30am, I enter onto Douglas Street from Burnside (heading south), and once I clear the old roundabout, I make it all the way to Courtney Street in less than 5 minutes ... think about that ... all the way through downtown at morning rush hour in 5 minutes.

Douglas is one of the few streets, that, at a very specific time (around 7:30am) that some COV traffic engineers sync'ing of the stop lights actually works perfectly.

 

Unfortunately, this "sync'ing" doesn't work on any other streets downtown that I've found, and stops working on Douglas Street at some point later in the morning, when it reverts to taking 20+ minutes to drive the same route (Burnside to Courtney via Douglas).

[Mike K.]

This is why I can’t help but chuckle at complaints about Langford traffic. In 20 minutes you will get from the top of Bear Mountain to south Metchosin’s My Chosen Cafe.

That’s a distance of 16km. Or even further than Elk Lake to downtown at Yates and Douglas.

So it’s cute, when Victorians complain about Langford traffic.

[Ismo07]

This is why I can’t help but chuckle at complaints about Langford traffic. In 20 minutes you will get from the top of Bear Mountain to south Metchosin’s My Chosen Cafe.

That’s a distance of 16km. Or even further than Elk Lake to downtown at Yates and Douglas.

So it’s cute, when Victorians complain about Langford traffic.

 

No it wouldn't take that long.  It might feel like that but I can routinely get from Colwood to Downtown Vic in about 25 mins...  Could almost walk from Burnside to Courtney down Douglas in 20 minutes.  And again you are apples to Oranges...  Jack's to My Chosen 21 minutes right now and Burnside to Cora is 7...  Apples is you go down the back side of Bear mtn and really do not go through many lights...  Oranges you are going through the heart of a downtown where you go through 12 intersections...  This is a silly comparison again....  Funny if you go from Jack's to Cora it's 26 mins, 27 if you go down Burnside.

 

P.S. just had coffee with a friend who has lived in Langford his entire life.  He brought up the traffic and how terrible the infrastructure has been improved.  The new road connecting the back of Bear Mtn to Sooke road doesn't help him much.  Told him to stop whining and move lol.

Edited by Ismo07, 22 April 2022 - 11:00 AM.

[On the Level]

don't move to a place where you rely on one road and expect it to never have an accident or incident.  They paid a lower price to live there but now want millions spent on alternative routes?  

 

 

Please explain this?  I'm not complaining about any of this?  We were talking about complaining and that people in Langford are not impressed with all the added development.  I suggested that people complain about all sorts of things.

 

My response was in reference your comment at the top.  Your statements of "don't move to a place where you rely on one road." and "They paid a lower price to live there but now want millions spent on alternative routes?" are unreasonable since Victoria was a participant in creating the CRD community plan denoting the Westshore as the growth area for Victoria. If the CRD had properly followed their community plan over the past 30 years, then transportation would have been taken much more seriously. 

 

Instead, transportation has been impeded, such as the Island Highway choked off with a babbling brook running down the centre of it.  There is a reasonable expectation that we would already have a second route over the Malahat a decade or more ago.  Instead we have the Isitts making up nonsense about Butler Main being in the drinking watershed, which is ridiculous.

 

If you drive to Camosun from Lanford it takes 20 minutes.  If you take the bus, you have to go into town first, causing the trip to be 90 minutes each way.  If we don't want additional roadways then we need to pony up and provide a fairly massive investment in non-bus public transportation.  

[Mike K.]

No it wouldn't take that long. It might feel like that but I can routinely get from Colwood to Downtown Vic in about 25 mins... Could almost walk from Burnside to Courtney down Douglas in 20 minutes. And again you are apples to Oranges... Jack's to My Chosen 21 minutes right now and Burnside to Cora is 7... Apples is you go down the back side of Bear mtn and really do not go through many lights... Oranges you are going through the heart of a downtown where you go through 12 intersections... This is a silly comparison again.... Funny if you go from Jack's to Cora it's 26 mins, 27 if you go down Burnside.

P.S. just had coffee with a friend who has lived in Langford his entire life. He brought up the traffic and how terrible the infrastructure has been improved. The new road connecting the back of Bear Mtn to Sooke road doesn't help him much. Told him to stop whining and move lol.

I agree. It’s nothing to complain about.

[Ismo07]

My response was in reference your comment at the top.  Your statements of "don't move to a place where you rely on one road." and "They paid a lower price to live there but now want millions spent on alternative routes?" are unreasonable since Victoria was a participant in creating the CRD community plan denoting the Westshore as the growth area for Victoria. If the CRD had properly followed their community plan over the past 30 years, then transportation would have been taken much more seriously. 

 

Instead, transportation has been impeded, such as the Island Highway choked off with a babbling brook running down the centre of it.  There is a reasonable expectation that we would already have a second route over the Malahat a decade or more ago.  Instead we have the Isitts making up nonsense about Butler Main being in the drinking watershed, which is ridiculous.

 

If you drive to Camosun from Lanford it takes 20 minutes.  If you take the bus, you have to go into town first, causing the trip to be 90 minutes each way.  If we don't want additional roadways then we need to pony up and provide a fairly massive investment in non-bus public transportation.  

 

Yes development happens fast, infrastructure does not.  Buyer beware...  You say that Langford has increased infrastructure based on their development.  This is very insincere...  Hiring a couple more RCMP, building a pool (for the first time) and what ever small additions they did is nothing compared to what they needed..  They hope to expand on post-secondary school options, but nothing.  They hope to get more government offices, slow roll...  What about firehalls, is there a new one or expansion?  The development in the West Shore has been amazing...  Just infrastructure improvements haven't preceded it.  They develop then hope infrastructure follows.  My point is that if you want to buy in Sooke be aware of those issues that are there.  I just don't feel sorry for people whining about the commute..  If the bypass finally does get made then yeah your property value will go up and more people will move out there and so on.  You are talking about the West Shore like it's Sooke and getting that mixed up.  I say the same thing to people who live downtown and want to complain that the garbage gets picked up in the morning...  This society lives on whining and complaining about things that they contribute to...   

 

With respect to your trip from Langford Exchange to either Campus, the bus is about twice as long time-wise...  For free for Students I think that's acceptable.  Transit will never be as fast as cars..   Have a good weekend, the sun will rise tomorrow...  Stay calm, traffic is not going anywhere.

Edited by Ismo07, 22 April 2022 - 03:28 PM.

[On the Level]

Yes development happens fast, infrastructure does not.  Buyer beware...  You say that Langford has increased infrastructure based on their development.  This is very insincere...  Hiring a couple more RCMP, building a pool (for the first time) and what ever small additions they did is nothing compared to what they needed..  

 

"A" pool?  They have added both an outdoor pool and the Y has added rec centre with a pool among other facilities.  This is in addition to JDF Rec Centre. 3 public pools vs. the incompetent Crystal Pool.

 

Let's not stop there.  The Victoria Conservatory of Music is in Langford.  Boulders climbing built a full facility in Langford. Starlight stadium is about to double it's capacity meanwhile RAP is targeted for a dog litter box.

 

As far as Policing, has Langford ever rejected an increase for officers as the population increase?  No.  Do they tolerate Social Justice experiments?  No.

 

 

They hope to expand on post-secondary school options, but nothing. 

 

What Post-Secondary school is in Victoria?  

 

 

What about firehalls, is there a new one or expansion?

 

Yes....new apparatuses.  What has Victoria done other than tie it to the homeless for housing?

 

 

 I say the same thing to people who live downtown and want to complain that the garbage gets picked up in the morning... 

 

Victoria has a large taxation base from commercial.  Perhaps that is something to share?  "Garbage Pickup" is not free in places like the Westshore.  Those that don't get themselves out of downtown don't understand?.  If there ever is Amalgamation, there will be a leveling of services.  Victoria will help to pay for Westshore's new unified union full time fire department.  They will level out the cost of "free" (union), garbage pickup.  Etc etc etc. 

 

 

With respect to your trip from Langford Exchange to either Campus, the bus is about twice as long time-wise...  For free for Students I think that's acceptable.  Transit will never be as fast as cars..

 

Great.  Try completing an education with massive abouts of homework while doing so for 3 hours on the bus.  This proves the *sole* mode of a bus for public transit is quite frankly stupid. 

[Mike K.]

Yes development happens fast, infrastructure does not. Buyer beware... You say that Langford has increased infrastructure based on their development. This is very insincere... Hiring a couple more RCMP, building a pool (for the first time) and what ever small additions they did is nothing compared to what they needed.. They hope to expand on post-secondary school options, but nothing. They hope to get more government offices, slow roll... What about firehalls, is there a new one or expansion? The development in the West Shore has been amazing... Just infrastructure improvements haven't preceded it. They develop then hope infrastructure follows. My point is that if you want to buy in Sooke be aware of those issues that are there. I just don't feel sorry for people whining about the commute.. If the bypass finally does get made then yeah your property value will go up and more people will move out there and so on. You are talking about the West Shore like it's Sooke and getting that mixed up. I say the same thing to people who live downtown and want to complain that the garbage gets picked up in the morning... This society lives on whining and complaining about things that they contribute to...

With respect to your trip from Langford Exchange to either Campus, the bus is about twice as long time-wise... For free for Students I think that's acceptable. Transit will never be as fast as cars.. Have a good weekend, the sun will rise tomorrow... Stay calm, traffic is not going anywhere.

You haven’t left the island in a while, have you?

Infrastructure happens fast everywhere else. Except here. Here we wait 20-30 years for it, after it’s needed.

McKenzie was 25 years too late. The Sooke Road improvement is 20 years too late. The Malahat is a highway for 200,000 people, not 400,000. And Highway 17 is decades in arrears.

The rest of the world doesn’t do things this badly.

[Victoria Watcher]

I maintain that highway 17 isn’t so bad. But it should be cleaned up a bit by closing some accesses.

[Mike K.]

It’s getting the Keating flyover, finally.

[Victoria Watcher]

Sometimes immediately before Tinto Rocks take the stage, there is a Keating Flyover.

[Ismo07]

You haven’t left the island in a while, have you?

Infrastructure happens fast everywhere else. Except here. Here we wait 20-30 years for it, after it’s needed.

McKenzie was 25 years too late. The Sooke Road improvement is 20 years too late. The Malahat is a highway for 200,000 people, not 400,000. And Highway 17 is decades in arrears.

The rest of the world doesn’t do things this badly.

 

I leave and having been leaving the island all the time...  There are lots of areas where development happens before the infrastructure.  You rarely see visions such that a previous posted about the surrounding Phoenix area.  I also drive up island a lot and find no problem with the Malahat...  Sometimes there is an accident and you wait...  Same with Sooke...  I would not choose to commute from either of these places however.  If I did I wouldn't complain about it.  If I felt strongly then I would try to do something about it.  Easier to just complain I suppose.

[Mike K.]

Oh gawwwwwdd…

We can and should improve things. That’s what a functioning society does, or should aspire to want to do. If our highways are at capacity, build more, or offer alternatives. Saying too bad, you don’t deserve to have your quality of life improved because you don’t live where
I do or how I do is so unfortunate, and small-time thinking.

[Ismo07]

Oh gawwwwwdd…

We can and should improve things. That’s what a functioning society does, or should aspire to want to do. If our highways are at capacity, build more, or offer alternatives. Saying too bad, you don’t deserve to have your quality of life improved because you don’t live where
I do or how I do is so unfortunate, and small-time thinking.

 

Yes of course things should improve...  I'm not saying we shouldn't...  All I'm saying is for the whining to stop when you move somewhere and don't like something.  Some people have lived in Sooke for 30 years so sure they see the change.  When someone moves there and couple years later is beating the drum... Well the mess hasn't changed much since...  Just saying when those politicians are vying for the development dollar before they look at improving the infrastructure you will see these issues...

 

No one is saying too bad, just do things to make the change.. Whinging about it helps little.

[Mike K.]

I see. So be quiet, say nothing, and praise the bureaucrats?

Sometimes a little fire under the feet of politicians and bureaucracy is a good thing. Politicians aren’t mind readers.

But they work for ‘us.’ As does officialdom. Never forget that.

[Ismo07]

I see. So be quiet, say nothing, and praise the bureaucrats?

Sometimes a little fire under the feet of politicians and bureaucracy is a good thing. Politicians aren’t mind readers.

 

No there are tools and ways to do it without sounding like a baby, write letters to the politicians, run for office on that platform, start a convoy (wait not that)...  End of the day I would be surprised if either of those bypasses will happen in our lifetimes...  I wish you luck however.  I think it is clear development is happening much to fast for the infrastructure and space to handle.  Langford (and Sooke I suppose) are enjoying half of that but in a couple years will see some folly in those choices.

 

I looked at moving to Sooke 15 years ago and decided no way and that was after the extra lanes were built...  Just not what I could live with everyday living in town.... Pro/com lists work very well, so if there is a con that you are going to be sad about for 15-20 years it's better to look at other options.  If you are lucky and a solution is created (like the bypass) then you will be loving it as your property will go up cause of that...  

 

We are just having a discussion Mike, it doesn't have to resort to the side comments like "Oh poor people just have to bear with it" or " So people should just stay quiet".  End of the day it's about what you choose.  Sure try to improve things but be proactive not carry a cloud over your head..  You won't get far like that and we will potentially have the same discussion in 20 years..  Unless someone else puts the work in...  

[Mike K.]

Why are we so fixated on Sooke?

I want our region to get with the times and improve infrastructure everywhere. I don’t so much care about Sooke singularly, but infrastructure has to follow or precede the population. You can’t just relegate it to substandard status because that’s good enough for now, stop complaining.

The great cities of the world would never be built today, because we’d be tripping over ourselves.

[Ismo07]

Why are we so fixated on Sooke?

I want our region to get with the times and improve infrastructure everywhere. I don’t so much care about Sooke singularly, but infrastructure has to follow or precede the population. You can’t just relegate it to substandard status because that’s good enough for now, stop complaining.

The great cities of the world would never be built today, because we’d be tripping over ourselves.

 

The great cities you are talking about were built and established way before the car and many of them don't allow them in huge portions of their downtown.  They have space issues where we have abundance...  I agree infrastructure needs to precede though especially on a tight island.  We haven't really planned all that well I suppose.  We aren't fixated on Sooke, it's an example.  Remember this started because someone was concerned about the speed of development in Langford and you didn't like her complaint.  Why can't she complain but it's ok that you do.

[On the Level]

Agreed.  We should not expect better for transportation.  That way my house will be worth $6M and I can rent our my bachelor suite for $4K a month.  Bring it on!