Jump to content

      












Photo

CoV zoning density plan for "missing middle"


  • Please log in to reply
747 replies to this topic

#621 aastra

aastra
  • Member
  • 17,700 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 10:18 AM

 

The generational divide was remarked on by speakers on both sides of the proposal.

“If you are of that generation [able to buy a home], you're speaking from a place of privilege,” said 23-year-old Chance McClendon. “You already have equity and you can already pass it down to your children. Most of us will never have that advantage and never have the opportunity to pass it down.”

 

We've been saying this for ~30 years at least. Does nobody ever detect any logical problems with this premise?

One the one hand we're supposed to believe home ownership has a cult following in Canada (literally, politicians/newscasters/academics have used this terminology), and no matter how old we are we're supposed to despise our parents and grandparents for being able to buy real estate on the cheap that eventually became worth millions...

...but on the other hand we're supposed to believe "most of us" will never inherit anything and thus have no opportunity to pass wealth down. We (the complaining generation, whichever generation it happens to be) are committed to passing wealth down to our children, no doubt... but unfortunately we just don't have any wealth to pass down. Meanwhile, our parents and grandparents were greedy SOBs who made out like bandits by virtue of their sheer dumb luck... but unfortunately they would rather burn their houses to the ground than pass wealth down.


Edited by aastra, 05 August 2022 - 10:22 AM.

  • Nparker, LJ and lanforod like this

#622 aastra

aastra
  • Member
  • 17,700 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 10:44 AM

 

The tension between younger and older generations was palpable in the council chambers, with the overwhelming trend among speakers being that younger people spoke in support of the proposal while older speakers opposed it. That tension was raised directly by Helps at one point, when she remarked that she was hearing about harassment directed toward the younger speakers during breaks, and the mayor was again shouted down by an attendee.

 

For shame, all of you "older" people! Always resorting to harassment and intimidation. I guess your thirst for blood wasn't satiated when you went after the tenters behind the courthouse and in Beacon Hill Park. So now your sights are set on "younger people". For shame!

In Victoria the "older" people have dominated the "younger" people by threats and harassment for too long. This culture of thuggish intimidation needs to end, and it needs to end right now. For shame!

 

News flash for all you "older" people: in Victoria the pro-development stance is regarded as the noble and good one. EVERY SINGLE TIME. If you grey hairs don't like living in a staunchly pro-development community then feel free to leave on the next bus.

 

 

 

Sigh. To anyone who still believes politics is real, do you really not see how transparently manipulative these messages are? My goodness. If you want to believe the average Victorian has turned into a menacing thug overnight then you are lost. The politicians own you, body and soul.



#623 aastra

aastra
  • Member
  • 17,700 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 10:50 AM

The ambiguity of "younger" versus "older" just makes me laugh, it's so cartoonishly manipulative. Come on, wake up.


  • Nparker likes this

#624 aastra

aastra
  • Member
  • 17,700 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 10:51 AM

It bugs me how Sparky thinks he can push VV forumers around just because he's older and the rest of us are younger.


  • Sparky and lanforod like this

#625 Victoria Watcher

Victoria Watcher

    Old White Man On A Canadian Island

  • Member
  • 33,740 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 11:04 AM

The missing middle proposal also comes with a set of guidelines that aim to ensure that projects fit neighbourhoods and promote livability by including appealing aesthetics, accessibility standards, integrated parking, minimized privacy issues and greenspace.


Written or pre-recorded submissions can be sent via email to publichearings@victoria.ca or people can physically attend the hearing continuation, which starts at 6:30 p.m. on Sept. 1.

https://www.vicnews....pening-session/




A lot of slant to that article.

It reduces parking requirements, reduces green spaces, and decreases privacy for neighbours.

Other than that, the sentence is accurate.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 05 August 2022 - 11:07 AM.

  • Nparker likes this

#626 aastra

aastra
  • Member
  • 17,700 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 11:20 AM

"The yellow zones currently only allow for single-family dwellings".

I'm getting older so I don't have the energy to tear into things like I used to, but let's just say I have quite a few observations to make about this.

1) I suppose the key word is "allow", since many of those yellow "zones" DO contain apartment buildings and townhouses. It looks like they've tried to be extremely precise with the demarcations, skirting around all the apartments on Hillside Ave near the mall, for example. But there are plenty of small apartment buildings and townhouses within the neighbourhoods that are nevertheless smack inside a yellow area.
Also for example, do my older eyes deceive me or is Shelbourne south of Hillside Mall showing yellow even though there are apartments and townhouses on every block?

2) Half the city is NOT yellow, and yet we're supposed to believe there's a crisis.
 

 

29995874_web1_220512-vne-missing-middle-

 

 



#627 Midnightly

Midnightly
  • Member
  • 1,291 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 04:13 PM

i'm looking at that map and i do agree there are many areas that are in yellow that i know there are apartment buildings or condo buildings.. just look at bay street there are many multi-residential buildings along there that are currently in yellow.. and there are many buildings that look like a multi level family home that are split up into 2-4(or more) units



#628 dasmo

dasmo
  • Member
  • 8,615 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 05:40 PM

If you look at the city map I think it shows spot zoning. I seem to recall that when I was researching our property in Fairfield that we were going to turn into a duplex instead of a McMansion and a suite. My research had shown that the majority of properties in my area were not single family. But I might have gleaned that from other sources. In the end life took a different path and we sold. The buyer built a McMansion with a garden house (and probably a suite).

#629 dasmo

dasmo
  • Member
  • 8,615 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 05:43 PM

This map
https://maps.victori...l?viewer=VicMap

#630 LJ

LJ
  • Member
  • 11,425 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 06:50 PM


“If you are of that generation [able to buy a home], you're speaking from a place of privilege,” said 23-year-old Chance McClendon. “You already have equity and you can already pass it down to your children.

 

We are not speaking from a place of privilege, we are speaking from a place of hard work, saving, and living in less desirable cities until we built some equity and could afford to move to a more desirable area.


  • Nparker, Matt R., JimV and 2 others like this
Life's a journey......so roll down the window and enjoy the breeze.

#631 kitty surprise

kitty surprise
  • Member
  • 402 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 07:58 PM

Sometimes a gif is worth a thousand words.200w (1).gif

#632 Matt R.

Matt R.
  • Member
  • 4,694 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 08:09 PM

We are not speaking from a place of privilege, we are speaking from a place of hard work, saving, and living in less desirable cities until we built some equity and could afford to move to a more desirable area.


I think those 3 bedroom townhouses by Tillicum are <$500k.. is that considered affordable? They sure aren’t luxury…
  • Nparker likes this

#633 Redd42

Redd42
  • Member
  • 1,297 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 08:16 PM

I think those 3 bedroom townhouses by Tillicum are <$500k.. is that considered affordable? They sure aren’t luxury…

 

The one you used to own?


  • Matt R. likes this

#634 dasmo

dasmo
  • Member
  • 8,615 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 08:19 PM

But that’s tillicum. Ewwwe gross…. I want to buy a place where I can walk to the cook st village and the beach!
  • Nparker and Victoria Watcher like this

#635 Matt R.

Matt R.
  • Member
  • 4,694 posts

Posted 05 August 2022 - 09:13 PM

The one you used to own?


Sure, there are others as well I think.

#636 Victoria Watcher

Victoria Watcher

    Old White Man On A Canadian Island

  • Member
  • 33,740 posts

Posted 06 August 2022 - 03:47 AM

“This council has missed the opportunity to encourage increased density in ways that would not necessarily depend on developers,” said Chantal Meagher, of the Rockland Neighbourhood Association.

She suggested making the processes for building garden homes and dividing existing single-family houses into multi-unit houses more simple; that would increase densification at a lower environmental and financial cost, she said.

https://www.timescol...h-sides-5666490



There is probably something to be said for just allowing developers to gut interiors and make existing SFDs into 3-plexus plus garden suite.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 06 August 2022 - 03:48 AM.


#637 Victoria Watcher

Victoria Watcher

    Old White Man On A Canadian Island

  • Member
  • 33,740 posts

Posted 06 August 2022 - 03:49 AM

Former Victoria-Hillside NDP MLA Steve Orcherton used the public hearing to blast city council over an initiative that he called a profound change in community planning that will lead to heavy densification. “I am disheartened, disgusted and profoundly disappointed by this initiative and other collective actions you have taken. I find myself no longer having faith or trust in this council.”

Orcherton said such a massive change requires a slow and thoughtful process.

“This council has a record of flavour-of-the-day policies,” he said, adding if the proposal is adopted it will “negate any input from citizens as individuals and negates the work of community associations regarding community planning and zoning in neighbourhoods.”

https://www.timescol...h-sides-5666490



I does make you wonder why we have detailed community planning documents for each neighbourhood, but then we consider this blanket policy that overrides them all. The neighbourhood plans already show where density is designed to occur.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 06 August 2022 - 03:51 AM.

  • Nparker and dasmo like this

#638 Redd42

Redd42
  • Member
  • 1,297 posts

Posted 06 August 2022 - 07:35 AM

But that’s tillicum. Ewwwe gross…. I want to buy a place where I can walk to the cook st village and the beach!

 

Yeah I used to experience this trying to rent out a basement suite in that area that was only 6 houses up from the Gorge. There is even a water glimpse from one of the windows in the suite. But it wasn't in the Cook St village so meh....


  • Victoria Watcher likes this

#639 Victoria Watcher

Victoria Watcher

    Old White Man On A Canadian Island

  • Member
  • 33,740 posts

Posted 06 August 2022 - 07:38 AM

Thursday night’s session saw a relatively even split of support and concern over the initiative, which has been designed to increase the number of housing options in the hope more families will be able to stay in the city, while ensuring new development suits the character of neighbourhoods.

 

https://www.timescol...h-sides-5666490

 

 

 

 

I think we all know that is not possible.

 

This is Cambridge and Woodstock.  Show me how you can "suit the character" there with these new plexes.

 

screenshot-www.google.com-2022.08.06-11_39_03.png


Edited by Victoria Watcher, 06 August 2022 - 07:40 AM.


#640 Matt R.

Matt R.
  • Member
  • 4,694 posts

Posted 06 August 2022 - 09:30 AM

But that’s tillicum. Ewwwe gross…. I want to buy a place where I can walk to the cook st village and the beach!


It was a bit gross but there were some fabulous local dining options! Marble arch, montanas, Safeway, Hampton little league concession… :banana:
  • Nparker and Seechelle1969 like this

You're not quite at the end of this discussion topic!

Use the page links at the lower-left to go to the next page to read additional posts.
 



0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users