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Victoria homelessness issues


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#16641 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 09 November 2019 - 08:43 PM

what’s the new plan if they agree this one is not working? there is none so why bother? look at downtown east side. no change in 20 years.

#16642 A Girl is No one

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 08:47 AM

I would say “no improvement”, as word on the street is that it has gotten much worse, much more violent and unsafe.

Edited by A Girl is No one, 10 November 2019 - 08:48 AM.

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#16643 VIResident

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 11:23 AM

Have friends who moved out of beautiful new condo in general area at end of Oct. couldn't stand what they saw every single day.  Not that they didn't care, they did care and that was the problem, they didn't have enough personal resources to be able to care more.  No these were not Senior's these were 30 somethings, singles.  Can't imagine what buyers must think when they are viewing 'for sale' - what is going through their heads when they are considering moving into the area?



#16644 rmpeers

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 05:59 PM

I would say “no improvement”, as word on the street is that it has gotten much worse, much more violent and unsafe.


Suspect the attitude of local govt officials is, "as long as it doesn't affect me, who cares if other people don't feel safe walking home etc."

It can only get worst when Ben becomes chancellor 2 years from now.
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#16645 LJ

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 07:13 PM

Have friends who moved out of beautiful new condo in general area at end of Oct. couldn't stand what they saw every single day.  Not that they didn't care, they did care and that was the problem, they didn't have enough personal resources to be able to care more.  No these were not Senior's these were 30 somethings, singles.  Can't imagine what buyers must think when they are viewing 'for sale' - what is going through their heads when they are considering moving into the area?

The COV is counting on this as part of their affordable housing strategy.


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#16646 LJ

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Posted 10 November 2019 - 07:18 PM

At the intersection of two fairly main roads there is "homeless" person sitting on his ass holding up a sign saying "homeless  please help"

 

Not twenty yards away from him on another median is a guy spinning a sign advertising a housing development making xx dollars an hour.

 

You would think the homeless guy would go, "hey I'm sitting here anyway I could make some money by doing a little work," but in reality he is probably thinking "jeez, look at that guy over there working for chump change."


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#16647 spanky123

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 03:14 PM

^ In fact the guy is probably thinking that he could work for $15 an hour but then he wouldn't get free food, a free place to live, free medical and dental, free massages, and free haircuts so it makes far more sense for him to sit on his butt and do nothing. The guy with the sign is probably thinking that he can't wait until the socialists implement a guaranteed minimum wage and then he won't have to wave a silly sign.

 

You can travel the world and you would be very hard pressed to find too many places outside of Canada (and to a lesser extent the US) where fully able young people just sit around all day with their hands out asking for money. 


Edited by spanky123, 11 November 2019 - 03:18 PM.

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#16648 Mike K.

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 04:35 PM

That being said, perhaps that is the price we pay for social stability and security. Society may be better served my giving someone enough to survive on, rather than that individual having to survive by taking that which does not belong to him or her, or resorting to violence. Yes, we still have theft and crime at the hands of individuals on the lowest rung of the income ladder, but it’s not to the degree that you see in Brazil or SA.

Having experienced a society where people need to take from others just to live I feel that providing a bare minimum may be to our overall benefit, as a society, but there is the potential for abuse and that’s where we should focus our efforts (to combat/minimize it).
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#16649 Nparker

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 04:57 PM

...Society may be better served by giving someone enough to survive on, rather than that individual having to survive by taking that which does not belong to him or her, or resorting to violence...

So Canada's social safety net is basically a form of extortion.



#16650 Midnightly

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 08:49 PM

That being said, perhaps that is the price we pay for social stability and security. Society may be better served my giving someone enough to survive on, rather than that individual having to survive by taking that which does not belong to him or her, or resorting to violence. Yes, we still have theft and crime at the hands of individuals on the lowest rung of the income ladder, but it’s not to the degree that you see in Brazil or SA.

Having experienced a society where people need to take from others just to live I feel that providing a bare minimum may be to our overall benefit, as a society, but there is the potential for abuse and that’s where we should focus our efforts (to combat/minimize it).

 

 

this might work for someone in a sane clear mindset... but for many who are chronically homeless (the ones who often cause the most damage, theft, crime, mess) tend to have issues (mental, physical, emotional, addiction...) that prevent them from being able to say... budget properly..  this is something that they are now educating kids more about in school (which i think is great)



#16651 Belleprincess

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Posted 11 November 2019 - 11:25 PM

That being said, perhaps that is the price we pay for social stability and security. Society may be better served my giving someone enough to survive on, rather than that individual having to survive by taking that which does not belong to him or her, or resorting to violence. Yes, we still have theft and crime at the hands of individuals on the lowest rung of the income ladder, but it’s not to the degree that you see in Brazil or SA.

Having experienced a society where people need to take from others just to live I feel that providing a bare minimum may be to our overall benefit, as a society, but there is the potential for abuse and that’s where we should focus our efforts (to combat/minimize it).


I wish there was a better way to weed out more people who abuse the system to give more to those who truly need it

#16652 pennymurphy2000

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 07:41 AM

I wish there was a better way to weed out more people who abuse the system to give more to those who truly need it

 

There is but no one has the guts to do it. What is wrong with making people register and show ID in order to access the free services? Proof of residency could be established. We are under no obligation to support every single person who just shows up from another province wanting free stuff. We help local people in need first. 

 

Set a time limit on the services of 3 months. After that it gets reviewed. Why aren't they able to support themselves after 3 months?

 

What other interventions do they need? Rehab? Career training? Anger management? Sign them up. Once signed up they get another 3 months of services. Any free service should come with a expectation of some kind of volunteer work as a pay it forward. Everyone can do something to contribute. Sweep a floor, fold some laundry, etc. 

 

After that if they aren't able to support themselves then maybe it is time to look at a bus ticket back to wherever they came from. We simply can not afford to keep going down the same path that we are on now.


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#16653 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 10:15 AM

at least part of that might be against charter. haven’t wait period and other issues been challenged as going against freedom of movement or something.

#16654 pennymurphy2000

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 11:10 AM

If you move here from another province or country you have a 3 month waiting period before you can receive MSP coverage. You have to show ID and a notice of assessment to get a discounted pass at most rec centres. You need to apply or show proof of income in order to qualify for almost anything in life. You need to show ID to apply for welfare etc. Some countries won't even let you in if you don't have a return ticket or proof that you can support yourself while visiting. We can start with an ID check so we can get an idea where people are coming from at least when it comes to the extras like dental, etc. The charter says you are free to travel wherever you want it doesn't say anywhere that the city you choose has to support you.


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#16655 pennymurphy2000

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 11:17 AM

Wasn't the homeless count again around 1500?

Isn't the same number we had last year and the year before?

Are these 1500 new homeless people?

How many did we house last year?

Cool Aid and the Province keep buying buildings and creating new housing yet the homeless numbers keep rising every year?

Where are they all coming from? 

We have to do something different.

One guy interviewed in the TC said he has been using the services at Our Place for the last 3 years. I am sure he isn't the only one. 


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#16656 rmpeers

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 12:11 PM

Shame that Hammond wasn't successful in his run for mayor. Here was a guy with some actual knowledge/experience on the subject of homelessness. Unfortunately, voters weren't receptive to someone who seemed to have genuine interest in maoing change or making things better. The street scene has visibly detoriated in the past few years; wonder at what point voters will fess up to the fact that it's not working.

In Hammond's case, the fact that he had a perfectly reasonable human reaction to the tent city debacle was weaponized against him.
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#16657 Sparky

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 04:20 PM

Where are they all coming from? 


Mostly from east of here. Very few from the west.
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#16658 spanky123

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Posted 12 November 2019 - 04:53 PM

Wasn't the homeless count again around 1500?

Isn't the same number we had last year and the year before?

Are these 1500 new homeless people?

How many did we house last year?

Cool Aid and the Province keep buying buildings and creating new housing yet the homeless numbers keep rising every year?

Where are they all coming from? 

We have to do something different.

One guy interviewed in the TC said he has been using the services at Our Place for the last 3 years. I am sure he isn't the only one. 

 

Unfortunately the more we offer Our Place clients, the more people we have deciding that it isn't worth working. We have the lowest unemployment rate in the country and the highest rate of people seeking social services. Something is amiss there. You will find few other places where this is the case.

 

I m not trying to compare Canada to Brazil or SA but rather to other developed countries. In Germany, the Nordics or much of Asia/Pacific there is social pressure to contribute to society and work. In Canada it is acceptable to not contribute and ask other people to pay. 

 

I having nothing against helping those who truly need it. The problem is that when the best the Government can do is run a $20B to $30B deficit during the best economic run in decades then we all know what is going to happen when the inevitable cycle correction occurs.


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#16659 Victoria Watcher

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Posted 18 November 2019 - 12:13 PM

how novel.

 

 

 

 

The Abbotsford Police Department may soon look to clamp down on homeless people who are engaged in criminal or harassing behaviour, Chief Mike Serr told council last week.

Serr said the department will remain focused on first trying to help people living on the streets, but that those who break laws and bylaws also need to be held “accountable” for their actions.

“We are always going to be a caring department that is going to try to find them pathways of care and help,” Serr said. But he added: “I think we’ve lacked the enforcement side at times.”

 

https://www.vicnews....ss-lawbreakers/


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#16660 Mike K.

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Posted 01 December 2019 - 07:55 PM

The Hollywood Boulevard “Superman” died trying to pull out clothing from a clothing donation bin.

https://www.latimes....d-in-the-valley

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