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Victoria the NO FUN CITY


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#21 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 12:49 PM

Staying open all night would probably not generate enough revenue for most places. Economic laws can't be broken.


Staying open until 4am would suit many cabaret owners, on weeekends at least.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#22 Rob Randall

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 01:01 PM

Part of the problem I've been hearing has been frequent closure of the restaurant's washrooms, which causes public urination problems for Regents Hotel and other neighbours. Also, huge piles of garbage late at night. It's really bad by 4:00 am a neighbouring business owner has told me.

#23 m0nkyman

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 01:27 PM

If a restaraunt is closing it's washroom, then perhaps VIHA should spend the overtime to send it's inspectors out on a Friday night and shut them down for it, instead of coming up with a new law.

#24 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 02:59 PM

If a restaraunt is closing it's washroom, then perhaps VIHA should spend the overtime to send it's inspectors out on a Friday night and shut them down for it, instead of coming up with a new law.


Yup. If the law says they have to have a restroom, then they must have it at 10am, 12am or 2:30am.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#25 Icebergalley

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Posted 07 May 2007 - 03:53 PM

Part of the problem I've been hearing has been frequent closure of the restaurant's washrooms, which causes public urination problems for Regents Hotel and other neighbours. Also, huge piles of garbage late at night. It's really bad by 4:00 am a neighbouring business owner has told me.



Are we speaking of Wharf Street only?

#26 Rorschach

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Posted 02 June 2007 - 06:23 AM

Yeah, lighting is good, but more cameras? It hasn't worked in the UK, which is probably the most ueber-surveillanced land in the world, and still full of yobbos. My guess is that cameras are just another technology that's supposed to make us behave, but technology can't replace real human interface... In that sense, shining a brighter light on idiots might be more effective.


Check this link out about the cameras in the UK: [url=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/news/news.html?in_article_id=459200&in_page_id=1770:5199f]The Secret CCTV Bunker[/url:5199f]

#27 gumgum

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Posted 02 June 2007 - 07:14 AM

[url=http://www.dailymail.co.uk/pages/live/articles/showbiz/bigbrother.html?in_article_id=459344&in_page_id=1815:11bf7]Meanwhile on Big Brother UK[/url:11bf7]. :roll:

#28 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 07 June 2007 - 04:39 PM

City Council today turned down Red Jacket's application to open until 2am on Sundays. (Owner Jeremy) Cownden complained that he'll have to open Monday and Tuesdays now. Mayor Lowe said he won't be intimidated by such talk. Quote: "I don't respond to that kind of threat. If his business model shows he can make money opening on Monday and Tuesday, I wish him good luck".

It was a good exchange from what I understand.

The basis for the refusal to grant the extension was "concerns" by nearby apartment-dwellers.

BTW, they are allowed to stay open until 12midnight now.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#29 mikedw

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Posted 12 June 2007 - 09:34 AM

Too funny. Really: they'd fine the artists for making artwork that could be spray painted.
Victoria has it ass-backwards on so many topics: promoting drug addiction, traffic crippling and now this.

If they don't like rowdies at the restaurants, then they can prevent this by putting the clamps on the bars: earlier closing hours, push the liquor laws to limit seating and occupancy, force a sin-tax to up the price of drinks, require that bars ante up part of the police budget (that's not to say that there isn't a flow of money now). Vegas and other party spots don't have these problems. What are we missing out of this formula? Do we need a 'party mall:' a part of town where bars are allowed, good lighting, restaurants can operate without limit, lots of bar security and still a police presence-- maybe even allow bar goers to hop from bar-to-bar with their drinks in hand. Then, run late night buses, a big taxi loop, and making parking really hard to come by. ie. make it the opposite to how Wharf St. is now (ample drunk parking, minimal bus access and lots of stairs).

- Mike

If we had an outdoor sculpture park and people started vandalizing the works by spray-painting them, would we say, "oh, bad, let's move all the sculptures inside -- and punish the art gallery for making the sculptures available in the first place by restricting its operating hours" -- or would we try to enforce existing laws that forbid vandalizing public or private property?

On the Food & Dining page, where Vic Hockey Fan first posted the newspaper article, he prefaced it with this:

Am I missing something here? Some councillors say its the restaurants fault, Fortin says its the bars fault... doesn't anyone think the fault lies with the rowdies or the drunks or the guys pissing on the street?


Well, that's the question, isn't it -- and no, he's not the only one who thinks the fault lies with the rowdies or the drunks or the guys pissing on the street. He's right, it is their fault, not the places of business.

So why should the eateries be punished because we (collectively?) have failed to ensure that there are consequences for illegal behaviour?

It's as though we'll all get collectively punished -- no more fun, no late night bars, no late night eateries, no public amenities worth having because someone "might vandalize them," and on and on -- while the yahoos continue to wreck it for everyone.

Way to go.


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#30 Mike K.

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Posted 15 June 2007 - 04:04 PM

Oh brother, A-Channel's top story today is how seniors are complaining about the monster truck shows at SOFA. So in went the city with their decibel meters to appease the complainers, but the promoter claims this is the first time in 20 years they've had complaints of this sort (and other venues are also located in downtowns).

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#31 aastra

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Posted 15 June 2007 - 05:01 PM

When you have a monster truck show running 16 hours a day for two weeks straight I suppose you should expect some complaints.

#32 LJ

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Posted 15 June 2007 - 08:26 PM

It would be like living next to the PNE, but at least there you can make money selling parking spots!!
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#33 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 15 June 2007 - 08:32 PM

Oh brother, A-Channel's top story today is how seniors are complaining about the monster truck shows at SOFA. So in went the city with their decibel meters to appease the complainers, but the promoter claims this is the first time in 20 years they've had complaints of this sort (and other venues are also located in downtowns).


Ya, what a bunch of bullshit. I went to the actual show tonight (yes, I heard they practised on Pembroke last night). It wasn't all that loud, although runners did sell earplugs and earmuffs. BTW that was a waste of $70 to go. :shock: But, what the ****, I go to all this kind of ****.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#34 Holden West

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Posted 15 June 2007 - 09:25 PM

Holy crap, I didn't know truck shows were that much. I thought they'd be $20 or some ****. What was the attendance like?
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

#35 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 06:52 AM

Holy crap, I didn't know truck shows were that much. I thought they'd be $20 or some ****. What was the attendance like?


$68 for a pair of tix, to be exact.

I'd say 2500 at best.






<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#36 G-Man

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 08:29 AM

Where is the mud and dirt?

Visit my blog at: https://www.sidewalkingvictoria.com 

 

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#37 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 16 June 2007 - 09:14 AM

Where is the mud and dirt?


Not part of the show.
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#38 Ms. B. Havin

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Posted 20 June 2007 - 12:51 PM

You may have read in the previous day's paper that SNAFU dance was denied permission to put on a small dance performance (for which admission would be charged, to at least cover some of the costs) in either St.Ann's or Stadacona Park. This was to be part of the Fringe Festival, coming up in September. Today's T-C has a commentary/ editorial on that: [url=http://www.canada.com/victoriatimescolonist/news/comment/story.html?id=e5e32dfe-ed90-4de0-b660-7ccddb589f32:0139d]No dancing, this is Victoria[/url:0139d]

No dancing, this is Victoria
Times Colonist
Published: Wednesday, June 20, 2007

Coun. Pam Madoff is right. We do think Victoria's city councillors are "a bunch of boring old you-know-whats," just as she predicted.

Worse, council's rigid caution, highlighted by this week's decision on a request to use a park for a dance performance, is hurting the city.

Ingrid Hansen, director of a small city dance company, asked council to allow a few performances in Stadacona Park as part of this year's Fringe Festival. No big crowds or noisy bands; just a performance that consists of "a slow meditative walk" with three acoustic musicians. The company would limit the audience to 50. (Experimental dance rarely draws a big crowds anyway.)

No, said council. The rules say parks can't be used for any activity if people have to pay, as they would to attend the performance. Request denied. Madoff, who opposed the request, predicted councillors would be seen as boring and fusty. She's right.

The park rule probably reflects a good policy principle. But what happened to common sense and good judgment?

The performance won't disturb neighbours. The park, near Oak Bay junction, isn't over-used. There's no special environmental issues. In short, no real reasons to say no, except a rather stuffy adherence to "policy."

And there are lots of reasons to say yes.

A local arts group would get a boost. The park would gain new users.

Perhaps most importantly, the city -- which has lost an alarming number of events this summer without an effective municipal response -- would signal its support for the end-of-summer Fringe Festival.

From Edmonton to Edinburgh, fringe festivals are wonderful cultural celebrations and tourist attractions. (And yes, in Edinburgh city parks are used for performances.) Local and visiting performers, interesting venues and big crowds add great vitality and life to the cities. Victoria is no exception.

Council had a chance to signal its support by finding a way to allow dance in the park. Perhaps with limits on the times of performances or the size of the audience, and a careful warning that this was a a one-time experiment.

Instead, councillors just said no. However well-meaning their intent, the message is that this is a city not much interested in promoting the arts, tourism and even fun.

© Times Colonist (Victoria) 2007


Just for comparison, take a look at how Saskatoon is leveraging arts & culture to revitalize its downtown and to make itself more attractive to visitors (tourists and locals): [url=http://www.canada.com/saskatoonstarphoenix/news/story.html?id=f35a27e8-ad83-4c37-b58f-a5a9ca9b6183:0139d]The Crescent; Plan calls for city's historic core to be marketed as cultural centre[/url:0139d]. The article:

The Crescent
Plan calls for city's historic core to be marketed as cultural centre
David Hutton, The StarPhoenix
Published: Wednesday, June 20, 2007

A development plan for a cultural corridor, dubbed "The Crescent," calls for the transformation of Saskatoon's historic core by marketing it as a creative hub, redeveloping older buildings, bringing in more riverfront events and improving ties with the university.

"Culture is very real," said Terry Scaddan, executive director of the Partnership, a downtown business group. "The only real branding we've had in the past was, 'We've been here a long time,' but people want something real, they want to experience festivals, events, galleries and theatres."

A $200,000 development strategy, which is a working draft in its final stages, was carried out by three consultants with backgrounds in city planning, retail and economic development on behalf of the three business improvement districts: Broadway, Riversdale and downtown. Funding was provided by the federal government's cultural capitals program.

The document will be used as a guide.

The three districts are now marketing themselves collectively as the Crescent, with the hope they can work together to bring in more commerce, tourism and development, create more traffic among the areas and fight off competition from big-box development in the city.

Together, the main roads of the three areas loosely form a crescent-shaped "C" on the map, which led to the name, Scaddan said. While the areas are working together on this project they will still maintain their distinctiveness.

"We want to promote the area as a whole while still keeping the identity of each area at the forefront," said Tammi Campbell, project co-ordinator for the Crescent.

The development plan includes six key strategies and a collection of ideas to attract people to the areas. The consultants visited Saskatoon for three days in February to take an inventory of what was here and brainstorm suggestions for change.

One of the marketing ideas outlined in the plan has the districts purchasing unclaimed bicycles from the annual police sale, painting them the colour designated for their area and allowing people to ride them for free between the three districts.

"It's worked in many other places," said Dan Carmody, the lead consultant. "It's about reducing that perceptual distance because in real terms to go across the river isn't that far. That psychological chasm that is the river valley needs to be closed."

The theme of the document is that Saskatoon will thrive by providing more opportunities for arts, culture and creativity. While resource-based economic booms have a history of busting, the consultants argue a creative corridor such as the Crescent would act as a sustainable resource.

To succeed the districts need to further capitalize on their thriving arts and cultural centres, they say.

The consultants point out that many of the cutting-edge centres are currently housed downtown and in Riversdale, where artists can afford space to work. These artist-run centres and non-profit organizations need to be promoted, they say.

"The centre of the city is a rich under-utilized gem," Scaddan said. "We want to bring back the local tourist who maybe hasn't been to the areas in awhile."

The consultants argue the new Farmers' Market will form the heart of the crescent, bringing people from across the city to an area they wouldn't regularly visit and creating more opportunities for commerce. They also call for more Jazz Festival stages in the Broadway and Riversdale areas and a signature annual event to "put skin on the bones of the Crescent skeleton."

One of the keys to becoming a creative hub is further integrating the "isolated" University of Saskatchewan with the rest of the city, the consultants argue. They call for a proposed university arts centre to be located in River Landing to help bridge the "town/gown" gap.

The plan also calls for "imaginative redevelopment" of "white elephant structures" such as the Barry Hotel, as well as the Adilman building, and the expansion of the Saskatchewan Native Theatre Company in Riversdale. They suggest an architectural firm could work with artists to renovate the Barry Hotel.

The consultants argue the Broadway area needs to initiate a planning process that looks at stricter design standards and a parking plan. They also note higher rents and a changing demographic may push Broadway to evolve from a "raucous drinking destination" into a more mature area with higher-end businesses. Attracting trendy stores such as those found on Calgary's 17th Avenue or Edmonton's Whyte Avenue is also recommended.

"It's definitely a concept and there are a lot of good ideas there," Scaddan said. "With a little luck it will take on a life of its own and become real."

mailto:dhutton@sp.canwest.com

AT A GLANCE:

Keys to Building "The Crescent"

- More events along the river, including an annual event put on by the business districts.

- A stronger marketing strategy that focuses on the arts and cultural centres in the areas.

- More building around the Farmers' Market, the project with the greatest ability to transform the crescent.

- Stronger relationship between the U of S and the downtown area.

- More cultural leadership in the form of a crescent council that includes government, university and business people.

- A community-based development entity that would come up with creative development ideas.


© The StarPhoenix (Saskatoon) 2007


PS: Just a note that Victoria isn't the only city suffering from short-sighted management of 'the arts' -- Christopher Hume, architecture critic at the Toronto Star, went ape-sh*t yesterday because Toronto city council decided to sell off the historic roundhouse to a furniture chain. (See [url=http://www.thestar.com/article/225994:0139d]How do you spell creative bankruptcy? R-O-U-N-D-H-O-U-S-E[/url:0139d].) (Interesting read, BTW, especially since we have our own roundhouse here...) Anyway, today he's back, with [url=http://www.thestar.com/entertainment/article/227266:0139d]The impressive new buildings are only a beginning[/url:0139d], which sounds a gentler tone toward the Toronto situation. But as he points out, at the end of the article:

...about to begin is Evergreen at the Brick Works, a spectacular $55 million rebuilding of the 16-hectare industrial site in the Don Valley. Promoters say it will be the "greenest facility in North America." Included will be a food market, restaurants, performance spaces, demonstration gardens, trails, marshes and more.

"These are not razzle-dazzle iconic buildings," Jones says. "The first round of the cultural renaissance was about putting creativity on display; the next will be about putting it to work."

Given the recent debacle in which the city-owned Roundhouse, a national historic site, was leased to a furniture chain, it's obvious creativity has yet to be fully understood at the civic level. As the renaissance and its ripples make clear, these days the only leadership in this city is coming from the cultural sector.

In other words, culture clods on city councils in Canada seem to be as common as ...well, fill in your own favourite common thing...
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#39 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 07:55 AM

Neighbours fear soccer tournament problems
Richard Watts, Times Colonist
Published: Thursday, June 21, 2007
Smelly portable toilets, broken roses and a closed bicycle route were raised as concerns by North Park residents last night with organizers of the FIFA Under-20 World Cup soccer tournament.

FIFA organizers met with about 20 residents to discuss concerns about the upcoming event to be held in their neighborhood at Royal Athletic Park on July 1, 4, 7 and 11.

One woman demanded to know the location of any Port-A-Potties because the smell can waft for many yards.


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Font: ****Todd Doherty, said he has antique rose bushes and has seen too many people attending other events "just snap them off without any attention."

And Darren Marr, who is also president of the Greater Victoria Cycling Coalition, complained the closing of Vancouver Street will shut down a designated cycle route.

Harold McNeill, chairman of the site organizing committee, did his best to explain about the extra security laid on, mostly to keep soccer fans from parking on streets near Royal Athletic Park.

McNeill was able to provided details about locations of portable toilets and promised to take some measures, like detour signs, for the cycle route. But he was not completely able to reassure Doherty his roses would be safe.

"You might ask 'Why my neighbourhood?' Well, you are the only neighbourhood we could do it in," he said.

At the end, most people, all of whom have seen everything from rock concerts, and baseball games to an annual beer garden (the mention of which prompted lots of groans) seemed satisfied.

Kristin Atwood, president of the North Park Neighbourhood Association, said she was "cautiously optimistic" the event will prove a limited annoyance.

"I hope it's going to be the beginning of great things for Royal Athletic Park," said Atwood. "It's not going to be a beer fest."
<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#40 Holden West

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Posted 21 June 2007 - 12:11 PM

To be fair, the next world soccer tournament should be held in Rockland.
"Beaver, ahoy!""The bridge is like a magnet, attracting both pedestrians and over 30,000 vehicles daily who enjoy the views of Victoria's harbour. The skyline may change, but "Big Blue" as some call it, will always be there."
-City of Victoria website, 2009

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