Jump to content

      











Photo

Municipality of Saanich - Mayor and Council General Discussion Thread


  • Please log in to reply
765 replies to this topic

#1 VicHockeyFan

VicHockeyFan
  • Member
  • 47,560 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 06:24 AM

http://www.timescolo...ucrat-1.1662583

 

In a move that could cost taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars in severance, Saanich chief administrative officer Paul Murray is being pushed out the door by newly elected Mayor Richard Atwell, sources say.

Atwell, elected on a platform of change, met Murray before being sworn in as mayor to tell the administrator he was done and to begin negotiating a “resignation” package, the sources said. The Saanich mayor was accompanied at the meeting by lawyer Troy DeSouza, who does not work for the municipality.

 

- See more at: http://www.timescolo...h.mDMJm6U2.dpuf



#2 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 07:38 AM

 

And Lisa Helps is ecstatic that someone has screwed up more than her!

 

I have no issue with change but it certainly sounds like Atwell has gone rogue and decided to completely circumvent council and process on this.



#3 Sparky

Sparky

    Super Duper Moderator...one spark at a time

  • Moderator
  • 9,257 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 07:45 AM

^ I respectfully disagree. It is quite common for administrative "right hand mans" to be removed with a political change.

 

I also am not going to get sucked in to the way that slanted article was written by Bill Cleverly. His selective "quotations" are misleading from the headline on. 



#4 Rob Randall

Rob Randall
  • Member
  • 6,557 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 07:46 AM

The Chief Administrative Officer in Saanich is the same as Victoria's City Manager--it's the top bureaucratic job--the boss at City/Municipal Hall. That person has to be compatible with the mayor's vision or there will be all sorts of friction. Although if they are too close, like Fortin and Stephens, bad things can happen, too. Atwell must have a replacement in mind and he must have had Murray in his crosshairs for a while to fire him so soon. He must really see dysfunction if Murray remained. 

 

Atwell is taking a chance here because I don't think he can choose the replacement himself--they have to do the whole headhunting trip and the rest of council must approve, and there may be other stakeholders as well. Atwell better hope Murray's replacement isn't worse for him.


  • Mixed365 likes this

#5 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 07:55 AM

^ I respectfully disagree. It is quite common for administrative "right hand mans" to be removed with a political change.

 

I also am not going to get sucked in to the way that slanted article was written by Bill Cleverly. His selective "quotations" are misleading from the headline on. 

 

What I was reading in the article is that Atwell discussed the decision with other councilors in-camera, did not get the required 75% approval, but decided on his own to get his own legal representation and fire the City manager anyways.

 

Now that could very well be incorrect info. We didn't elect the guy to be running around making decisions all by himself though.


Edited by spanky123, 12 December 2014 - 07:56 AM.

  • Mixed365 likes this

#6 Mike K.

Mike K.
  • Administrator
  • 37,722 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:24 AM

It's like a regime change in Saanich with some bitter about the situation and some excited with the changes.

Senior staff who worked with and saw eye to eye with the previous mayor may no longer be what's best for tax payers with Atwell as mayor.

Know it all.
Citified.ca is Victoria's most comprehensive research resource for new-build homes and commercial spaces.


#7 VicHockeyFan

VicHockeyFan
  • Member
  • 47,560 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:33 AM

A lot of people don't think Saanich is broken, but still thought it was time for a change.


  • lanforod likes this

#8 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:38 AM

I think that Lisa and Richard may be suffering from the same ailment and that is that they both think that the Mayor runs the show and that council and City staff are supporting actors.


  • sasamat and Mixed365 like this

#9 VicHockeyFan

VicHockeyFan
  • Member
  • 47,560 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:41 AM

I think that Lisa and Richard may be suffering from the same ailment and that is that they both think that the Mayor runs the show and that council and City staff are supporting actors.

 

I don't know Saanich council well, but I'd say that every single one of the Victoria councillors can stand up to Lisa Helps, if required.



#10 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 08:46 AM

I don't know Saanich council well, but I'd say that every single one of the Victoria councillors can stand up to Lisa Helps, if required.

 

And I think that was demonstrated yesterday when Lisa had to back down on her motion to hire the consultants.


  • Mixed365 likes this

#11 G-Man

G-Man

    Senior Case Officer

  • Moderator
  • 11,767 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 09:18 AM

For General discussion of the actions and debates of the Saanich Mayor and Council


Visit my blog at: https://www.sidewalkingvictoria.com 

 

It has a whole new look!

 


#12 rjag

rjag
  • Member
  • 2,802 posts
  • LocationSi vis pacem para bellum

Posted 12 December 2014 - 09:54 AM

Sounds like Victoria will have some competition for the gossip pages!!!!


  • Bingo likes this

#13 pherthyl

pherthyl
  • Member
  • 2,209 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 10:47 AM

A lot of people don't think Saanich is broken, but still thought it was time for a change.

 

Well put.  Seems like Frank was voted out due more to some vague feeling of boredom than any real problem with his term.


  • Rob Randall and Mixed365 like this

#14 Mike K.

Mike K.
  • Administrator
  • 37,722 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 11:50 AM

There was more than enough to tarnish his reputation throughout the last term

 

His stance on amalgamation was considered by many as undemocratic and peeved off a lot of voters, then he added insult to injury by complaining about higher levels of government disregarding him.

 

He made off the cuff comments regarding the affairs of other municipalities and flung mud over BC Transit's decisions that didn't jive with his opinions as chair of the commission. And there were more localized affairs that had certain subsets of the population upset with him. I attended a meeting with some stakeholders (some of whom are well known in the community) earlier in the year and man, was there ever pent up rage.

 

And he did himself no favours by missing virtually every CRD sewage treatment meeting while failing to identify his son as a beneficiary of a CRD sewage treatment contract that he voted on.


  • David Bratzer likes this

Know it all.
Citified.ca is Victoria's most comprehensive research resource for new-build homes and commercial spaces.


#15 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 12:04 PM

^ Don't disagree with anything you said but that doesn't mean that Atwell has carte blanche to do anything he wants without council approval. Atwell supporters are advancing the idea today that Saanich doesn't need a City Manager and that Atwell should direct staff himself as the CEO and save the $200K.

 

It will be interesting to see how this plays out.


  • Mixed365 likes this

#16 Rob Randall

Rob Randall
  • Member
  • 6,557 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 12:25 PM

It might be good for Atwell to be his own city manager for a year to defray the cost of severance and the job search (I think the last job search took 3 months) but I don't think it's a good idea in general for the mayor to also be the top bureaucrat in charge of hiring and firing city staff and the rest of the day-to-day management duties. 


  • lanforod likes this

#17 spanky123

spanky123
  • Member
  • 7,669 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 12:49 PM

It might be good for Atwell to be his own city manager for a year to defray the cost of severance and the job search (I think the last job search took 3 months) but I don't think it's a good idea in general for the mayor to also be the top bureaucrat in charge of hiring and firing city staff and the rest of the day-to-day management duties. 

 

If council took a vote and decided that Atwell was the best person for the role of City Manager then I would accept that. I don't think that is what Atwell's supporters have in mind - especially since they are all over social media bashing several members of council. Doesn't look like Richard shares Lisa's love and respect approach to the Mayor's job.



#18 Mixed365

Mixed365
  • Member
  • 921 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 01:11 PM

The Mayor governs, the Chief Administration Officer manages. There is a big difference and in no way can Richard Atwell do both jobs. 

For the Mayor to go against his team of councillors and do things in "his own way" is inappropriate. A Mayors role is to bridge the two opposing sides and go with the majority of the team (councillors), not treat the municipality like a Fortune 500 company and go around hiring and firing. 

spank123 I agree with you completely. 


  • Nparker and spanky123 like this

“To understand cities, we have to deal outright with combinations or mixtures of uses, not separate uses, as the essential phenomena.”
- Jane Jacobs 


#19 Bernard

Bernard
  • Member
  • 3,936 posts
  • LocationVictoria BC

Posted 12 December 2014 - 01:39 PM

The relationship between the Mayor and the CAO is crucial but the CAO is an appointment made by the council and not by the mayor.   If this is the end of Paul Murray as CAO, then the council will need to appoint one of the current senior staff to be acting in the role.   City Hall can not legally function without someone in the CAO role.

 

If it comes to hiring a new CAO, which I expect it will, it is the council that will choose the new CAO, not the mayor.  I have no idea what happens if there a disagreement between the council and the mayor as to who should get the role.

 

The compensation package for a new CAO is likely to be broadly similar to the the current one.

 

What I do not understand is why the rush to get rid of Paul Murray, I have never heard that he was any sort of problem.  He was someone that came up through the management ranks of Saanich and was not hired in externally, he seems to be apolitical as far as I can tell


  • Bingo and Mixed365 like this

#20 Bingo

Bingo
  • Member
  • 14,450 posts

Posted 12 December 2014 - 01:43 PM

The relationship between the Mayor and the CAO is crucial but the CAO is an appointment made by the council and not by the mayor.   If this is the end of Paul Murray as CAO, then the council will need to appoint one of the current senior staff to be acting in the role.   City Hall can not legally function without someone in the CAO role.

 

If it comes to hiring a new CAO, which I expect it will, it is the council that will choose the new CAO, not the mayor.  I have no idea what happens if there a disagreement between the council and the mayor as to who should get the role.

 

The compensation package for a new CAO is likely to be broadly similar to the the current one.

 

What I do not understand is why the rush to get rid of Paul Murray, I have never heard that he was any sort of problem.  He was someone that came up through the management ranks of Saanich and was not hired in externally, he seems to be apolitical as far as I can tell

 

I think you could get a job in Victoria teaching Mayor 101 for newbies.


  • sasamat and Mixed365 like this

"I know nothing except the fact of my ignorance" - Socrates


You're not quite at the end of this discussion topic!

Use the page links at the lower-left to go to the next page to read additional posts.
 



0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users