1451 replies to this topic

[tjv]

Property owners in Victoria today = Living the good life off the backs of their tenants. 

 

I wonder how many property owners/landlords would voluntarily live like their tenants have to.........Probably couldn't find a single one.

No one is forcing you to live here if you don't want to!

 

Landlord don't have to build rentals, they can just invest money elsewhere and live the "good life" without you

 

Edit:  I am going to flip this around:  Tenants in Victoria today = Living the good life in paradise off the backs of hardworking property owners who are willing to take a major gamble

Edited by tjv, 01 December 2018 - 06:41 PM.

[Bob Fugger]

Property owners in Victoria today = Living the good life off the backs of their tenants. 

 

I wonder how many property owners/landlords would voluntarily live like their tenants have to.........Probably couldn't find a single one.

 

I've read a lot of posts on here over the years, but that ranks up there in the top 5 worst, most vapid posts.

[sdwright.vic]

Especially from someone who espouses such hardline conservative values on a regular basis. I had to take a double take when I read that.

[spanky123]

Property owners in Victoria today = Living the good life off the backs of their tenants. 

 

I wonder how many property owners/landlords would voluntarily live like their tenants have to.........Probably couldn't find a single one.

 

The reality is that most landlords in town are not making money from your rent. In fact, most are subsidizing you and hoping for continued appreciation in the property price in order to make any money at all longer term. It doesn't matter what someone paid for their property it is what it is worth that is important. If your condo is worth $500K then that means that you can make almost $20K a year having your money sit in a GIC with no risk. To cover condo fees, property taxes, insurance, and the other fees that the property owner pays, they would have to charge at least $2,500+ a month in rent just to earn the same amount. Have the unit sit empty for a few month, get hit with a special assessment from the strata, or have interest rates go up and you are underwater very quickly. 

 

Although I disagree with Ben's politics, he is right in pointing out that the only way that we will ever see rents back to where they were a decade ago is if the Government buys housing and then subsidizes it. Since the Government is required to buy land at market prices (or in most cases a multiple of market prices), those units will always require subsidies. The Europeans had it a lot easier as back in the day they just took land from their opponents so the Government already owned most of the prime real estate.

Edited by spanky123, 02 December 2018 - 10:08 AM.

[Mike K.]

It's always easier to pass judgement than to see the situation from someone else's point of view.

 

In order for a landlord to make a $250k studio apartment available for rent, these are the costs that must be covered by the tenant:

- $1,035 for the mortgage, at 3.84%, with a 20% down payment ($50,000)

- $125 for municipal taxes

- $150 for strata fees

- $75 for insurance

= $1,385

 

Pushing the purchase price to $300,000 also with a 20% down payment, the monthly carrying cost is $1,592.

 

Of course the common line we hear is "why should I be paying the landlord's mortgage/costs?" Well, you don't have to. But you will have to come up with the landlord's 20% down payment to secure your own apartment ($50k for a $250k unit, plus GST if its new, or $60k for a $300k unit), qualify for a mortgage, then pay your own mortgage/taxes/strata/insurance.

[DavidL]

 

Although I disagree with Ben's politics, he is right in pointing out that the only way that we will ever see rents back to where they were a decade ago is if the Government buys housing and then subsidizes it. Since the Government is required to buy land at market prices (or in most cases a multiple of market prices), those units will always require subsidies. The Europeans had it a lot easier as back in the day they just took land from their opponents so the Government already owned most of the prime real estate.

 

And the only way sandwiches will be priced as they were 10 years ago is if the government buys the sandwich ingredients and subsidizes them...

 

Ben's favourite example is Vienna.  That city already owned most of its land or "acquired" it in the 20s and 30s when it was a communist run city.  To this day Vienna spends 700,000,000 EUROS a year on subsidized housing, on a per-capita basis that's equivalent to about $40,000,000 per year here in Victoria.  It has become so expensive that the city itself got out of building housing in 2004, leaving the field open to third party developers, something that is conveniently left out of the conversation.  Another fun fact that no one talks about is that this third party stock requires a deposit or down payment from it's occupiers that averages out around 25,000 Euros.  Yes their system works well in some regards, but it has been in place for almost a hundred years and it is remarkably expensive and does have some significant issues associated with it if you're willing to take off the rose,(red), coloured glasses.

[Nparker]

And let's not forget:

Vienna's population = 1,757,0000

Victoria's population = 85,792

[tjv]

In order for a landlord to make a $250k studio apartment available for rent, these are the costs that must be covered by the tenant:

- $1,035 for the mortgage, at 3.84%, with a 20% down payment ($50,000)

- $125 for municipal taxes

- $150 for strata fees

- $75 for insurance

= $1,385

Don't forget

 

advertising costs

Property management fees (even if you do it yourself your time is worth something)

Maintenance/repairs

Vacancy allowance

 

and those are just off the top of my head

 

Even with today's high rents its impossible to make the numbers work, the only saving grace was property appreciation and that's long gone now.  I'm shocked to still so many purpose built rental construction proposals still out there

[Mike K.]

Although to be fair, it is a long-term investment and a very stable, secure one at that. Even if the unit doesn't immediately appreciate like it may have two or three years ago it remains a safe asset that also won't depreciate beyond a normal/expected correction in our market.

 

You also build equity over time and there's something to be said about that even if the unit doesn't appreciate or falls in value.

[James Bay walker]

There are (far) less expensive communities than Greater Victoria. Our area is classed as "severely unaffordable", see: http://www.rentalhou...ffordability_cd If you want to live here as tenant or owner, be prepared to pay the current market value (unless you luck out with subsidized housing). jbw

[tjv]

Although to be fair, it is a long-term investment and a very stable, secure one at that. Even if the unit doesn't immediately appreciate like it may have two or three years ago it remains a safe asset that also won't depreciate beyond a normal/expected correction in our market.

 

You also build equity over time and there's something to be said about that even if the unit doesn't appreciate or falls in value.

True, but the returns reflect that, typically an ROI of 4% ignoring the last few years with large capital gains

[Bernard]

1) Vienna was not governed by the communists in the1920s and 30s, it was governed by the Social Democrats, a centre left political party.   

2) Many cities throughout Europe purchased a lot to build needed housing from 1919 to the 1970s.   Vienna was only doing what others were doing

[sdwright.vic]

I thinks it is pretty simple. If you can't afford to be a landlord here, then don't. Just like if you can't afford to live here.

Plenty of cheaper places in the country to by investment property.

[DavidL]

1) Vienna was not governed by the communists in the1920s and 30s, it was governed by the Social Democrats, a centre left political party.   

2) Many cities throughout Europe purchased a lot to build needed housing from 1919 to the 1970s.   Vienna was only doing what others were doing

 

Fair point, however, the Social Democrats were Austro-Marxists which could hardly be characterized as centre left.  I find some equivalency between Marxism and communism.

[tjv]

Plenty of cheaper places in the country to by investment property.

and plenty of other cheaper cities to rent too

[sdwright.vic]

and plenty of other cheaper cities to rent too

Think I implied that.

Just like if you can't afford to live here.

[Bernard]

Fair point, however, the Social Democrats were Austro-Marxists which could hardly be characterized as centre left.  I find some equivalency between Marxism and communism.

There was a separate communist party in Austria.  The Social Democrats governed in Vienna as a centre left party during the 1st Republic, as an example, they refused to go into debt.  The housing needs in Vienna were dire straits because of laws passed by the previous Austro-Hungarian empire that had the effect of ending all private investment in housing.   

 

Yes, the party had some serious left wing members, but so does the BC NDP but that does not make the BC NDP as a Marxist party.

[tjv]

Think I implied that.
 

Ah sorry I read that really fast and thought you were implying about buying a home, my bad

[DavidSchell]

I have a 1 bedroom purposely built suite in a 3 year old home in Fairfield.

 

Was thinking of asking $1390 a month that includes heat, hot water and hydro. Also has stainless steel appliances including washer/dryer.

 

Does this seem reasonable enough to attract a good tenant?

 

Thanks,

Dave. 

[Bob Fugger]

I have a 1 bedroom purposely built suite in a 3 year old home in Fairfield.

Was thinking of asking $1390 a month that includes heat, hot water and hydro. Also has stainless steel appliances including washer/dryer.

Does this seem reasonable enough to attract a good tenant?

Thanks,
Dave.

Your inbox will be flooded at that price. You could easily get $100 more without any utilities. If you decide to keep the price at $1,390, for the love of Pete, DO NOT include utilities. Any of them. And no, it’s not a pain in the ass to collect hydro every two months. It’s not even about the money itself: when people aren’t on the hook for anything, they will treat the place like hotel. Lights on all day, heat cranked in the middle of winter, one-sweater dryer loads, etc.