22 replies to this topic

[jsan]

I am really getting sick of waking up most mornings this spring and summer to see the gorgeous deep blue sky turn into a white haze as some idiot flies back and forth. I realize that sunny days are fun to fly in, but the white trails they are leaving behind are not disappearing. Yesterday I watched a moron fly over and over and the sky turn from blue to white. And now again this morning!

How can Victoria council allow this sort of air-pollution? One person up there gets to haze over a neighborhood? Are we living in the 1950's, because I thought we were more environmentally concerned than that. And I want my weekend blue skies back please.

[North Shore]

Ahhh, they're called contrails or vapour trails, and they usually form at altitudes above ~ 25,000 feet. That's a little above the jurisdiction of Victoria Council...

[Baro]

You'll have to write to the reptoids to stop spraying their chemtrails. Although if they stopped, society would wake up and overthrow our reptoid leaders and drive them back into the hollow-earth they came from.

Anyways, let me know how your attempts to stop planes from flying over head, ruining your skies, goes. I'm trying to ban cars from the street on the weekend because these joy-drivers just ruin my silence with their horrible machines.

[aastra]

I told you guys it was a mistake for city council to allow so many airliners to take off from the city proper like that.

The reptoid thing is just salt in the wound.

[jsan]

There was someone just flying back and forth all day yesterday, this wasn't a commercial plane and yes, I am concerned about the amount of pollution this creates.

[G-Man]

I would be more worried about the thousands of cars joy riding around the city than a single 172 flying around the city.

[Baro]

Yeah, if even 1% of the people who drive out to lakes or campgrounds every weekend stayed home it would more than make up for every personal aircraft that flew over the city that week.

The tiny amount of personal planes that fly over head seems like such a ridiculously minor thing to worry about.

[phx]

I just want a flying car.

[LJ]

I am really getting sick of waking up most mornings this spring and summer to see the gorgeous deep blue sky turn into a white haze as some idiot flies back and forth. I realize that sunny days are fun to fly in, but the white trails they are leaving behind are not disappearing. Yesterday I watched a moron fly over and over and the sky turn from blue to white. And now again this morning!

How can Victoria council allow this sort of air-pollution? One person up there gets to haze over a neighborhood? Are we living in the 1950's, because I thought we were more environmentally concerned than that. And I want my weekend blue skies back please.

Nobody flying back and forth joyriding is turning the sky white.

Most likely what you are seeing is smoke from the forest fires blowing over from the mainland.

The contrails from jet engines is merely water vapour condensing in the cold air at altitude. These contrails dissipate quite rapidly in most instances.

[Holden West]

Small aircraft do not produce contrails, only high-flying jets. So I don't know what you're talking about.

Unless...

Victoria is being bombarded by secret government planes dispersing mind-control chemicals and CHEK's ED BAIN IS PART OF THE CONSPIRACY!

[jsan]

I looked into your link and very much doubt we are being bombarded with secret chemicals, but there is no doubt that the repeated flying back and forth created a white haze. This was NOT a result of smoke from the mainland, the white cloud-like formation was surrounded by blue sky on its periphery and our air quality reading for the day was a 2.

The vapor trails did not dissipate but spread out over a period of six hours, which we all observed during a BBQ that afternoon. The result above was a milky white sky with strips of pale blue here and there. This is ridiculous on a fine summer's day in a region that is rainy for the rest of the year.

Being a busy adult, I never pay much attention to what's going on overhead. It first caught my attention when I overheard a senior complaining to her friend about it at Mirage coffee shop. Apparently this is a new phenomenon for Victoria. I must agree, growing up never did it become like this from planes flying back and forth. The trail would vanish quickly and not linger for hours blocking out half the sun.

It does make me wonder about the kind of fuel the planes are using and the effect this is having. Next time you see a bright white trail notice if it disappears within minutes as it should, or fans out over hours.

[Mike K.]

It does make me wonder about the kind of fuel the planes are using and the effect this is having. Next time you see a bright white trail notice if it disappears within minutes as it should, or fans out over hours.

While I agree that the contrail "fan effect" can be unnerving, there is a logical explanation for this.

Decreasing or low atmospheric pressure will cause contrails to remain in the sky. If prevailing winds are just right the contrails will expand across the sky (they can even appear to blanket the sky over a period of several hours, as could have been the case on Friday).

Increasing or high atmospheric pressure causes contrails to remain for either a short period of time or fail to even appear.

For what it's worth, pressure was decreasing on Friday and we had a slightly unstable weekend in our region. This is a good mix for contrails fanning across the sky. But what you likely saw was not caused by the plane you had observed flying back and forth.

[jsan]

Thanks for the info Mike, appreciate it. So am supposing we are seeing more of these hazy skies thanks to increased air traffic.

[Mike K.]

If there is increased air traffic, it is caused by aircraft navigating our airspace well in excess of altitudes that would be possible by aircraft landing in or originating in Victoria or Vancouver.

Even jets departing Seattle that happen to fly over our airspace would still be quite low in the sky and very unlikely to cause contrails in our skies.

[jsan]

Interesting:

"Contrails - Aviation's Clouds
Message from Dr. Pat Minnis, senior research scientist in the Radiation Science Branch of the ASD, NASA, Langley
Research Center, Hampton, Virginia.

The long line-shaped clouds that we often
see forming behind airplanes are condensation
trails or, in short, contrails. They are becoming
more and more frequent as the number of airplanes
increases. During the past decade, air traffic has
increased at a rate of almost 8% each year. This
means that there are almost twice as many planes
flying now than flew during 1989."

"Because contrails are a type of cirrus cloud, they may have an effect on climate. This effect will become larger as more airplanes take to the sky."

http://asd-www.larc....L/News3.Eng.pdf

[Sparky]

Jsan

The information that you are posting on contrails is correct.

At some point though, you need to concede that contrails are not a byproduct of normally aspirated internal combustion engines that power small fixed wing aircraft.

[Gipper]

Jsan

The information that you are posting on contrails is correct.

At some point though, you need to concede that contrails are not a byproduct of normally aspirated internal combustion engines that power small fixed wing aircraft.

Just be thankful it hasn't degenerated into a chemtrail discussion.

On a serious note I recall climate scientists did some interesting research in the days after 9/11 When air traffic was grounded. There was significantly less high cirrus cloud cover without the airliners to generate it.

[Coreyburger]

Planes that appear to be at the same height often aren't, which, coupled with differing weather conditions at different altitudes, is why one plane can leave a contrail and another doesn't. Beyond that, the weather can change by the minute at altitude, some two different planes on the same altitude can pass by the same point and leave differing contrails.

As for the other stuff: CoV has no jurisdiction over flying stuff. That is all Transport Canada. CoV doesn't even have any say as to the float planes.

Small aircraft don't (generally) leave contrails because they don't fly high enough. Contrails are caused by the same effect that makes your breath "steam" in the cold: hot, moist air hitting cold air.

[Redial]

If there is increased air traffic, it is caused by aircraft navigating our airspace well in excess of altitudes that would be possible by aircraft landing in or originating in Victoria or Vancouver.

Even jets departing Seattle that happen to fly over our airspace would still be quite low in the sky and very unlikely to cause contrails in our skies.

From what we've come to know, This comes under the U.S. Military. The jets that cover our region are located at the U.S.Naval Base on Whidbey Island near Everett, Washington. These jets release the spraying above 30,000 feet. The contents of the spray includes high levels of aluminum and Barium Salt, just to name a few. Barium is not detected in the way we currently do our water testing.
We also believe the spraying has resulted in the destruction of our honey bees here on Vancouver Island.
The program is called Project Cloverleaf. It's about weather modification at its worse. When you control the weather, you also control our food sources. An excellent interview with former CIA agent AC Griffith and XM Radio's Power Hour host Joyce Reilly does a good job of explaining how it all came into being and the deadly consequence.
http://share.ovi.com...Dziner4u0.10001

[VicHockeyFan]

From what we believe, the jets that cover our region are located at the U.S.Naval Base on Whidbey Island near Everett, Washington.
This program is called Project Cloverleaf. It's about weather modification at its worse. When you control the weather, you also control our food sources. An excellent interview with former CIA agent AC Griffith and XM Radio's Power Hour host Joyce Reilly does a good job of explaining how it all came into being and the deadly consequence.
http://share.ovi.com...Dziner4u0.10001

OK, well, when do they plan to actually start changing the weather, so we don't get crops anymore? I'm sure our crop yield per acre has gone up steadily in this century. Are they just going to practice for 25 years first, then throw the main plan into action?