62 replies to this topic

[charity]

This is the price you pay for living downtown in a cat box. Personally I like to living in a house in the burbs away from all the scum.

While the scum in your community may not be homeless, that by no means they aren't scum... and most likely they are far worse, on a much larger scale.

...and personally, give me a modern and stylish cat box, where there is actually some culture and vibrancy, over more square footage I would have to clean everyday, grass to cut, carbon copy blue collar neighbors all in a race to one-up each other, living in cookie-cutter houses, all nicely grouped in the trendiest of subdivisions.

I've lived that life, and I think I'd probably take homeless people living on my balcony, before I ever went down that path again.

[sebberry]

We all have our preferences.  Some just want a small place to hang their hat at the end of the day, others want a house that will allow them to carry out various hobbies, activities, etc... at home.

 

The problems here aren't due to charity living in a so-called cat box, but rather failures at multiple levels of government to help those who need it, and punish those who insist on constantly breaking the law. 

[Mike K.]

Let's not forget poverty is big business. Right down to the police, so many organizations benefit from poverty and the many millions of dollars is receives from tax payers.

[pherthyl]

Let's not forget poverty is big business. Right down to the police, so many organizations benefit from poverty and the many millions of dollars is receives from tax payers.

So you're implying the police and charitable organizations that help the homeless are somehow encouraging homelessness for their own profit?

[Mike K.]

Not at all, nobody is encouraging homelessness.

 

But managing homelessness is big business. Consider the sheer number of jobs related directly to the management of homeless individuals. Frontline organizations like police and shelters, the services provided by various government ministries, private businesses, etc, have a stake in this economy. And let's face it, poverty/homelessness and their associated issues are a big business in Victoria.

[Baro]

I found a lady setting up camp in my garage once, she was very polite and left right away.  For some reason she had stuffed a bunch of my lumber all around the door.  I just made sure to always lock the door now when I leave.

[sebberry]

Not at all, nobody is encouraging homelessness.

 

But managing homelessness is big business. Consider the sheer number of jobs related directly to the management of homeless individuals. Frontline organizations like police and shelters, the services provided by various government ministries, private businesses, etc, have a stake in this economy. And let's face it, poverty/homelessness and their associated issues are a big business in Victoria.

 

That whole industry could do with some amalgamation...  

[pherthyl]

Not at all, nobody is encouraging homelessness.

 

But managing homelessness is big business. Consider the sheer number of jobs related directly to the management of homeless individuals. Frontline organizations like police and shelters, the services provided by various government ministries, private businesses, etc, have a stake in this economy. And let's face it, poverty/homelessness and their associated issues are a big business in Victoria.

 

You're confused about business.   Homelessness is big cost, not big business.  

 

By bringing it up in this thread you are implying this "big business" is somehow looking the other way when it comes to homelessness.  Which is just wildly missing the mark.

[sebberry]

You're confused about business.   Homelessness is big cost, not big business.  

 

Indeed it is a big cost to the city and taxpayers, but individually there's a lot of people employed to provide services to the homeless.

 

Just look at this post from VHF showing the Cool Aid Society's expenses:  http://vibrantvictor...ssues/?p=261468

 

$10M in salaries...  $400,000 for office, IT and communications...  No doubt they're hard working people and most of them are probably worth what they earn, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot of people are being compensated for their efforts in this fight. 

[Mike K.]

I might be some bumbling idiot who knows nothing about most things. But I'd like to think that business is something I do know a little bit about.

 

Look, put aside your political slant for a second and consider that we could end homelessness and poverty in Victoria today, right now. We spend untold millions on managing homelessness and poverty in Victoria every single year, but why would the organizations tasked with management of a problem solve the very problem that is responsible for keeping them relevant and in demand? We could house, clothe, feed and keep busy every single homeless person in Victoria right now with the money we spend on managing their predicament. We could get them off the streets, all of them. We could probably even keep their drug habits satisfied if we really spread the tentacles far enough and reigned in even the most remote expenses budgeted for homelessness and poverty management.

 

Big business doesn't have to end in Inc. to be big business. An $18 million annual budget for Kool Aid alone makes it one of the biggest businesses/operations in our region. And it's just one small piece of a very big pie.

 

I wonder how much this region actually expends on homelessness and poverty, and then how much is siphoned from regular folk who are victims of crime as a result of poverty and homelessness (I'm not going to suggest crime and homelessness are mutually inclusive, of course). $200 million? $300 million? Half a billion? Who knows. But it's a lot.

[sebberry]

I love the Freudian slip autocorrect.

[pherthyl]

Indeed it is a big cost to the city and taxpayers, but individually there's a lot of people employed to provide services to the homeless.

Just look at this post from VHF showing the Cool Aid Society's expenses: http://vibrantvictor...ssues/?p=261468

$10M in salaries... $400,000 for office, IT and communications... No doubt they're hard working people and most of them are probably worth what they earn, but it doesn't change the fact that a lot of people are being compensated for their efforts in this fight.

So? Street sweepers are compensated for sweeping streets. Should we then assume they are probably encouraging littering to ensure their own jobs? This whole line of conversation is ridiculous

[sebberry]

You're missing the point - nobody is saying these organizations are encouraging homelessness, but it's clear that they're not doing much to solve it.  They're in the business of managing it.

 

Subtle difference in wording, big difference in outcomes. 

[pherthyl]

Look, put aside your political slant for a second and consider that we could end homelessness and poverty in Victoria today, right now. We spend untold millions on managing homelessness and poverty in Victoria every single year, but why would the organizations tasked with management of a problem solve the very problem that is responsible for keeping them relevant and in demand?

Nope. The organizations that work with the homeless don't have the power to solve homelessness.

We could house, clothe, feed and keep busy every single homeless person in Victoria right now with the money we spend on managing their predicament. We could get them off the streets, all of them. We could probably even keep their drug habits satisfied if we really spread the tentacles far enough and reigned in even the most remote expenses budgeted for homelessness and poverty management.

You have no idea how much it would cost to do those things and yet you're somehow supremely confident it could be done?

Never mind that a lot of homelessness is the result of mental illness, so even if you threw a lot of money at the problem you would still need the cool aids of the world to manage homelessness.

Sure our policies towards the homeless could improve, and we can probably even be more effective for less money, but the idea that we can solve homelessness for what we currently spend to manage it, and that the people managing it are somehow against solving it is ridiculous

[Mike K.]

Nope. The organizations that work with the homeless don't have the power to solve homelessness.

 

You gotta admit that it's pretty funny to be reading the above while the following ad is being displayed below:

 

[LJ]

If, instead of closing Riverview, they modernized it and opened other small units in each regional district instead of insisting those individuals could be assimilated into the general population and treated with outreach facilities, we wouldn't be having the problems we are having today.

[phx]

...and personally, give me a modern and stylish cat box, where there is actually some culture and vibrancy, over more square footage I would have to clean everyday, grass to cut, carbon copy blue collar neighbors all in a race to one-up each other, living in cookie-cutter houses, all nicely grouped in the trendiest of subdivisions.

I've lived that life, and I think I'd probably take homeless people living on my balcony, before I ever went down that path again.

 

To each their own, I guess.

 

I was feeling sorry for you after reading your first post, but I'm relieved to see your situation is not so bad after all.

[Sparky]

If, instead of closing Riverview, they modernized it and opened other small units in each regional district instead of insisting those individuals could be assimilated into the general population and treated with outreach facilities, we wouldn't be having the problems we are having today.

 

 

https://en.wikipedia...tal_(Coquitlam)

[insanelydeadlydisease]

One man's "vibrancy" is another man's repeated break ins by scum. 

[sdwright.vic]

Where is this place? I live on Gorge and it's quite shady because of the industrial area and have no problems?