652 replies to this topic

[max.bravo]

He found some of the videos/letters in support of the application to be so distasteful that it put him off supporting the applicant. Thankfully he disabused himself of their impact and made a rational decision. Also, he needed to ensure something about the interior was preserved (?) and caused a motion arising that nearly stalled the process. Luckily staff knew how to stickhandle the request.

[Victoria Watcher]

he took issues with the videos that the developer had corralled i think.  videos were 30-2 in favour.

[Rob Randall]

I don't like the idea of videos if the proponent has anything to do with it.

[zoomer]

Andrew raised this last week, saying then he found comments in some of the video presentations quite offensive. He said at the time that this reflected quite badly on Reliance for putting these forward, but at that point Helps cut him off saying basically saying it wasn’t fair or appropriate to judge or ponder the intent or motives of the developer. Although Helps herself (Helps herself..hmm) on a couple of occasions spoke after a video presentation to remind people about the city policy against harmful, discriminatory, racist, etc, etc. comments.

I am a sensitive soul and I’m also easily offended, but from what I heard (I saw most, but not all of the video presentations) only one was clearly overboard, with the comment of the development cleaning up the ‘riff raff’. The others fairly spoke to the crime, intimidation and vandalism that has and still does occur there, and public drinking, open drug use, broken bottles etc. I guess you can say that about a lot of areas in Victoria now..

Anyways, hopefully Andrew can help us understand his reaction by responding here and being very specific about what was said. Helps was also angry last week that young homeless youth were being unfairly called out because they hang out at the park. To which I ask, how does she know they’re homeless? Is anyone actually sleeping at that park? Hopefully no one is blaming or upset with anyone hanging out at the park, just aggressive behaviour as there has been several violent attacks (often with skateboards as the weapon, strangely enough) that have occurred or emanated from there.

I dunno, maybe it’s just me, but I believe we should still be able to speak out against violent activity, vandalism and intimidation. Open drug use.. I dunno, don’t think we can complain about that anymore, the genie is out of the bottle and folks could argue drinking a beer in public and discarding the can or glass bottle is open drug use with the potential for public danger. As long as folks don’t use drugs in bus stops I guess. Ok, on buses then.. Well, maybe they can in designated sections of the bus. I’m open to evolving with the times.

[zoomer]

I don't like the idea of videos if the proponent has anything to do with it.

The videos were the best thing I’ve seen at a city council hearing in years. Actually getting to hear and see some younger folks for a change, not only the usual Bettys, Karens or Charles that blabber on at City Hall (as much as we still need those). I agree, not so sure of the optics of a developer led effort to collect those, but then again it’s fair, above board and none of those were scripted - those people were passionate and fully believed every word they said. To dismiss them would be unfortunate, and the city should be making it easy for residents to submit their feedback in this manner. Kudos to the developer for brining us into the 20th century, unlike city hall which only recently discovered that you can broadcast meetings.

[Mike K.]

You’re fully entitled to express yourself however you wish. There is no crime being committed when you say you’re intimidated by the groups that hang out there, or that these groups have been violent in the past. Council is not an arbiter of the sense of safety of its constituents and they should be enquiring to get a sense of what is happening at this park if their constituents are raising concerns, not telling us they don’t like hearing people’s blunt observations.

I avoid Reeson Park during the day, as it can be that intimidating.

[Nparker]

...I avoid Reeson Park during the day, as it can be that intimidating.

Does Reeson Park currently exist for any reason other than as a place for "riff raff" to hang out?

[Mike K.]

Reliance has issued a statement:

We are relieved that Victoria City Council finally approved the rezoning and heritage alteration of Northern Junk, two historic warehouses that have sat vacant for 43 years.

When Reliance Properties bought the Northern Junk site in 2010, it surprised and saddened us to know that the buildings had languished under the previous ownership since 1978. What we didn’t realize is that it would take us a full decade of designs and redesigns, community consultation, and city processes to get to a point where we can save these waterfront gems from permanent ruin. Thankfully, we can now begin to bring Northern Junk back to relevant use for future generations.

We are grateful to Victoria City Council and the community for supporting our vision for Northern Junk. We look forward to delivering a project that will contribute to the ongoing revitalization of Old Town.

[aastra]

August, 2021:

 

 

Helps was also angry last week that young homeless youth were being unfairly called out because they hang out at the park. To which I ask, how does she know they’re homeless? Is anyone actually sleeping at that park? Hopefully no one is blaming or upset with anyone hanging out at the park, just aggressive behaviour as there has been several violent attacks (often with skateboards as the weapon, strangely enough) that have occurred or emanated from there.

 

--

 

May, 1980:

 

 

Daily Colonist
May 1, 1980

Bugged by panhandlers? Grin 'n bear it

"Campers" in park at foot of Wharf have to move on, but begging tolerated.

The bumper crop of panhandlers that has shown up in downtown Victoria with the spring blossoms may be here to stay awhile...

As four business-oriented organizations turned to city hall and police for action Wednesday, the word was that little could be done about the situation.

"It's been a continuing problem around here," said a sympathetic Victoria police spokesman. "...They took away the vagrancy charge years ago."

If the person putting the hammer on you is carrying a weapon or grabs you in a way that would constitute assault, that's another matter. Or if he gets in your way and impedes your travel, he can be charged with causing a disturbance.

 

 

Daily Colonist
May 3, 1980

"We're not beggars"

...one of a group of young people identified as campers in a story about panhandlers... denied he and his friends are beggars. "We were just resting in the park when a photographer came up and asked to take our picture," he said.

[spanky123]

Mayor Helps says the public hearing felt like a "celebration of the City's colonial history."

 

The mayor would like more First Nations history to be taken into consideration when discussing the history of Victoria's heritage.

 

100% in support of this. Lets include FN literature and texts in all future discussions! 

[spanky123]

Reliance has issued a statement:

We are relieved that Victoria City Council finally approved the rezoning and heritage alteration of Northern Junk, two historic warehouses that have sat vacant for 43 years.

When Reliance Properties bought the Northern Junk site in 2010, it surprised and saddened us to know that the buildings had languished under the previous ownership since 1978. What we didn’t realize is that it would take us a full decade of designs and redesigns, community consultation, and city processes to get to a point where we can save these waterfront gems from permanent ruin. Thankfully, we can now begin to bring Northern Junk back to relevant use for future generations.

We are grateful to Victoria City Council and the community for supporting our vision for Northern Junk. We look forward to delivering a project that will contribute to the ongoing revitalization of Old Town.

 

I feel for Reliance and other developers who have to sit on properties for years but lets face it, they knew the risks when they purchased the property and that is exactly why they were able to buy it at the price they did. There was never any guarantee that they would be able to rezone or redevelop the site.

 

I also think it is hilarious that housing advocates seem to believe that apartments will be $750 a month and that this will solve all of our housing issues. 

[Mike K.]

It won't solve all of our housing issues, but if we tally up all of the decisions made by various members of council to reject housing proposals because individually that housing would not solve the housing problems we face, we would be at well over 2,000-units since 2018.

 

I'm lumping in the 1,500-units at Harris Green which several councillors voted against sending to a public hearing.

[Victoria Watcher]

100% in support of this. Lets include FN literature and texts in all future discussions! 

 

[jstovell]

https://www.timescol...ject-1.24349033

[Sparky]

^ You must be pleased Jon. That was a long time in coming.

Now you can get down to work and make that vision materialize.

I am planning a high quality frame for that 50’s calendar for you.

[Victoria Watcher]

Stovell rejected the notion that approving this project, with its blend of heritage and modern architecture, will have devastating effects on heritage preservation in the city.

“Young adults don’t hold these colonial buildings in the same view, not everybody looks at these old buildings in the same way. … Advocates are arguing for some perfect outcome,” he said, pointing to city staff’s determination that “no unicorn proposal” has been developed in almost 20 years of trying.

Site preparation will begin after permits are approved. Stovell estimates completion sometime in 2024.


https://www.vicnews....ia-greenspaces/


that’s an interesting take.

Edited by Victoria Watcher, 06 August 2021 - 02:16 PM.

[spanky123]

^ Sounds like he is setting himself up for the argument that the Capital Iron buildings will need to come down due to their colonial roots!

 

I am not saying that these developments shouldn't happen Mike, just that those people arguing that they will help with our affordable housing shortage are not being sincere. 

 

I am surprised that Helps feels the City should now be paying to develop a park for this project, why not make it a requirement for the developer in return for the re-zoning? 

Edited by spanky123, 06 August 2021 - 02:30 PM.

[Nparker]

...I am surprised that Helps feels the City should now be paying to develop a park for this project

Why on earth would another park be required in this area?

[Rob Randall]

It is something we've never heard before in that context--that colonial-era architecture may not be deserving of the pedestals we've put them on. I've never heard someone say derogatory things about heritage so it was a shock to my ear. (Breaking: Middle Aged White Guy Shocked By Young Peoples' Opinions)

 

I think it was Guideline 11 or something that supposedly was the most egregious error in the eye of critics; that all heritage add-ons must be subservient and unobtrusive (eg: Morley Soda). 

 

But these short little buildings can only be left alone or added on to.  And adding only one storey would look silly I think. I'm happy with the design. It gives the buildings the respect they deserve.

Edited by Rob Randall, 06 August 2021 - 02:39 PM.

[jstovell]

https://www.cheknews...council-863010/