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Affordable housing in Victoria


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#1001 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:29 PM

It's time to implement my SPPLELA Plan.  The Schools, Parks, and Parking Lots Emergency Land Acquisition Plan.

 

 

screenshot-www.google.ca-2018.05.14-14-21-23.png

 

 

I've talked about it in this space before.   You carve a very tiny bit of land out of each school yard, park, and parking lot that's adjacent to a road, and put up some buildings, 3-floor walk-ups, very shallow from the street, no setback from the sidewalk.  Soccer balls no longer fly out onto the streets and there are dozens of sets of eyes on parks and schools at night.


Edited by VicHockeyFan, 14 May 2018 - 12:30 PM.

<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1002 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:39 PM

At Panama Flats, we even build some stilt housing.

 

screenshot-www.google.ca-2018.05.14-14-35-31.png

 

screenshot-www.google.ca-2018.05.14-14-34-06.png

 

screenshot-www.google.ca-2018.05.14-14-32-28.png

 

 


<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1003 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:40 PM

Also, in all these scenarios, no parking, except drop off, car-share, and 1-hour visitor.  If you own a car, go live in Langford etc.


Edited by VicHockeyFan, 14 May 2018 - 12:40 PM.

<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1004 Nparker

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:45 PM

It's time to implement my SPPLELA Plan.  The Schools, Parks, and Parking Lots Emergency Land Acquisition Plan...

The only thing worse than this plan is the acronym. :wacko: The idea that every park and school gets surrounded by cheaply built SRO-style slums is nightmarish to say the least. I refuse to believe there aren't better ways to create additional housing.


Edited by Nparker, 14 May 2018 - 12:46 PM.

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#1005 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 12:48 PM

Also, in all these scenarios, no parking, except drop off, car-share, and 1-hour visitor.  If you own a car, go live in Langford etc.

 

How moderne of you.


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#1006 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:02 PM

The only thing worse than this plan is the acronym. :wacko: The idea that every park and school gets surrounded by cheaply built SRO-style slums is nightmarish to say the least. I refuse to believe there aren't better ways to create additional housing.

 

They are "market rent".   Developer gets free land and the council chooses the best offer. That's the end of government involvement.


Edited by VicHockeyFan, 14 May 2018 - 01:03 PM.

<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1007 Cassidy

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:08 PM

I have never really understood the drive to spend my tax dollars in order to create affordable housing ... at least over any other kind of housing?

 

  • If you can't afford to buy a house in Victoria, then rent.
  • If you can't afford to rent in Victoria, then find a rooming house.
  • If you can't afford to room with others (or don't want to), then you have to go live somewhere in some other town or city.

 

There's no "right to reside" or "right to abode" in Victoria, or anywhere else for that matter.

 

Here's something for those who feel Victoria is too expensive a market in which to own a home -  https://www.realtor....Z6-Port-Alberni

Go to Port Alberni ... $199,000.00 and you're in your own home.

 

Done ... bought .... paid for.

Yeah I know it's in Port Alberni ... but you can't afford to live in Victoria.


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#1008 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:11 PM

It is strange, for sure. And a lot of parents that own homes say "my kids can't afford to live here!"  Well, they could if you loaned them just 20% of your home-value increase while the kids were at home, 0 to 18 years old or whatever.  Which of course, many do.


<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1009 FirstTimeHomeCrier

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:45 PM

You think there are enough jobs in Port Alberni for all the folks that can't afford to live in Victoria?


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#1010 tjv

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 01:58 PM

BC Assessment for the above properties:

2925 Qu’Appelle Street Victoria $6,050,000/$183,333 Nov 2017
Total Value
Assessed as of July 1st, 2017 $5,789,000
Land/Buildings
$2,095,000/$3,694,000

Previous Year Value
Land/Buildings
$4,604,000
$1,904,000/$2,700,000

1555 Jubilee Avenue Victoria $5,250,000 $250,000 Oct 2017
Total Value
Assessed as of July 1st, 2017 $4,163,000
Land/Buildings
$1,522,000/$2,641,000

Previous Year Value
Land/Buildings
$3,537,000
$1,360,000/$2,177,000

1510 Clive Drive Victoria $9,185,000 $540,294 Aug 2017 (this is a new luxury building)
Total Value
Assessed as of July 1st, 2017 $7,522,000
Land/Buildings
$1,800,000/$5,722,000

Previous Year Value
Land/Buildings
$5,414,000
$1,638,000/$3,776,000

2181 Haultain Street Victoria $8,450,000 $216,667 Aug 2017
Total Value
Assessed as of July 1st, 2017 $8,397,000
Land/Buildings
$2,593,000/$5,804,000

Previous Year Value
Land/Buildings
$6,229,000
$2,359,000/$3,870,000

what are we supposed to derive from this info

 

I suspect what we’ll find is the CRD will be engaging local developers to bring the projects to completion.

see my RFP from BC Housing I posted here in the past few days

 

You think there are enough jobs in Port Alberni for all the folks that can't afford to live in Victoria?

I gather you haven't lived in Victoria all that long.  Victoria has always been a tough place to establish a career.  The 80s and 90s were brutal here and even the stretch of 2009-2014 or so were difficult times to find a job here.  When you are buying a house for 200k you don't have to work full time hours to live compared to Victoria

 

You know I can't afford to live in the Uplands or Lands End Rd.  I demand government supply me with affordable houses of comparable quality and finish in these areas immediately!



#1011 Cassidy

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 02:05 PM

You think there are enough jobs in Port Alberni for all the folks that can't afford to live in Victoria?

It doesn't matter how many jobs there are in Port Alberni.

If you can't find work in Port Alberni, then you would go looking for a job in Parksville, Quallicum Beach, or Nanaimo.

 

The point is, if a person insists on living on Vancouver Island, they'll have to live where they can afford to live ... and find work where work is available.

 

The belief that everyone has the right to own a home and work somewhere in the CRD ... while an attractive thought, and perhaps true in our parents time  ... simply isn't a reality in 2018.

 

It's a pipe dream.


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#1012 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 03:04 PM

Well, that's not actually the case. The reality is that if we had not strangled development to the degree that we historically strangled it we wouldn't be facing this problem.

 

And we continue to strangle it. Look at what's happening on Cordova Bay Road or the response to Abstract's Fort Street project? Opposition to newcomers to established neighbourhoods is overwhelmingly strong in Victoria and the urban core.

 

So statements like "it's a pipe dream" to own a home in Victoria for an average worker is a product of mismanagement of the housing stock and not due to some insatiable desire for our real-estate. Heck, one meal between three people will leave someone hungry. You don't need a mass famine to feel the effect of an empty belly.


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#1013 Nparker

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 03:26 PM

...Look at what's happening on Cordova Bay Road or the response to Abstract's Fort Street project? Opposition to newcomers to established neighbourhoods is overwhelmingly strong in Victoria and the urban core...

And yet, if asked, I can almost guarantee the established residents of these neighbourhoods would rank "housing affordability" as the region's #1 issue. The irony would be hilarious if it weren't so frustrating. :whyme:



#1014 Cassidy

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 05:53 PM

...statements like "it's a pipe dream" to own a home in Victoria for an average worker is a product of mismanagement of the housing stock and not due to some insatiable desire for our real-estate.

I'm pretty sure it is the case ... as I made no effort to describe why it's a pipe dream ... only that in 2018, it's a pipe dream.

 

Certainly those of us of a certain age, and who've lived here for most of those years ... watched this anti-development movement happen through repeated City Councils in various municipalities, and as you note Mike ... we continue to watch it happen today.

 

Presumably if the housing stock had been allowed to grow over the last 30 or 40 years to meet demand ... prices would also adjust downward in 2018 to reflect the "abundance" of available housing stock.

 

Mitigating everything, as it always always has and always will ... is the fact that we're surrounded on three sides by water, and on the fourth by a mountain range. Those physical borders have a huge impact on how a region grows and develops ... or in this case, stops cold at each of the four "walls".

Mixed with the decades of an anti-development mindset, we're where we're at today.

 

But for people actually looking for affordable accommodations in the CRD in 2018, the day to day reality is that it remains a pipe dream.



#1015 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:12 PM

Ok yeah, I getcha.

I do think though that we fall back on the terrain issue a little too much. Half of LA is built on hills. Half of this city is built on hills, too, and we have huge tracts of land that can easily be developed between Renfrew and the West Shore. Thousands of acres of easy to build on and service land is available to us.

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#1016 VicHockeyFan

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:13 PM

We have thousands of acres at Prospect Lake Ffs.
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<p><span style="font-size:12px;"><em><span style="color:rgb(40,40,40);font-family:helvetica, arial, sans-serif;">"I don’t need a middle person in my pizza slice transaction" <strong>- zoomer, April 17, 2018</strong></span></em></span>

#1017 Nparker

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:16 PM

...I do think though that we fall back on the terrain issue a little too much. Half of LA is built on hills...

I am not sure that LA is the best model for us to emulate. That being said, we could easily double the density through much of the region without having to spread out much beyond the current developed areas with little detrimental effect.



#1018 Mike K.

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:19 PM

But LA is one of the densest cities in North America. We just focus on the freeways and forget just how much compact housing there is in that city.

LA is only big if you include the Inland Empire. That’s like lumping everything between Peterborough and Niagara and calling it Toronto, or Sooke to Qualicum as “Victoria.”

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#1019 tjv

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:27 PM

So statements like "it's a pipe dream" to own a home in Victoria for an average worker is a product of mismanagement of the housing stock and not due to some insatiable desire for our real-estate. Heck, one meal between three people will leave someone hungry. You don't need a mass famine to feel the effect of an empty belly.

Completely disagree with this.  We have a huge amount of Canadian baby boomers loaded with cash ready to retire and now they are done living in their cold climate they want to move here

 

Also we are seeing a lot of Vancouverites selling their houses for top dollar often $4 million plus, moving over here and buying a comparable house in Oak Bay for ONLY $2 million, wow what a savings and still managing to put $2 million right in the savings account.  Too early to retire?  with an extra $2 million in the savings account they can retire at 45 or telecommute for their jobs if they don't want to retire

 

By the attached graph it looks like every city in Canada is a "product of mismanagement of the housing stock".  Or is it a long period of record low interest rates?

 

https://www.globalpr...a/Price-History

 

Its time to understand we are the most desirable area in Canada to live and one of the most in the world

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  • canada-house-price-index-2.gif


#1020 thaicobb

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Posted 14 May 2018 - 06:31 PM

I am not sure that LA is the best model for us to emulate.

Too right.  That being said, the northern and eastern LA sprawl came to a screeching halt in 2008 and hasn't resumed to any great extent.  Current development is higher density nearer to the core and particularly along the Metrorail lines.  Geography even trumps the love of SUV's and lawns.



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